3113 replies to this topic

[PUGATRON1000]

LeazesMag, on 22 February 2012 - 02:12 PM, said:

ewerk, on 22 February 2012 - 01:54 PM, said:

What factors influence our revenue? The main one is our performance on the pitch.

While our revenues were comparatively higher under Shepherd, this was because we had some decent players and had high league finishes and European runs. This brings in TV money, ticket money and sponsorship. However, while we were doing all this we were largely making losses. To credit Shepherd as some sort of financial genius who was responsible for increasing revenues is an overstatement. The fact is that we were not getting a good return on investment.

The problem we currently have is that we have gone too far the other way. We haven't been able to go on growing our revenue while investment on the field was cut. The key is to striking a balance with healthy investment and increased revenue as a result of improved team performances.

what you say is fairly obvious, but seems to escape most people. The bit in bold is something I have been thinking of posting for the last day or two, but wondered who would be first to say it. The fact is, football and profits simply very rarely go hand in hand. For the vast majority of clubs, its a loss making "industry", yet we still see pages and pages of posts [and not only on here] where people seem to think they are financial geniuses and have the answers. Toonspac posted a huge list of clubs who have gone bust over the last few decades, yet none of them are now supermarkets and are still actually football clubs.

This is what makes me laugh more than anything, especially some posters who post nothing about football and every post they make is on the pretence of being a financial guru.

Leazes MegaMind has spoken

[LeazesMag]

jaythesouthernmag, on 22 February 2012 - 06:46 PM, said:

Which of the players which you keep mentioning would get into our starting 11 now?

the point is where is the Carroll cash ? Or do you think we have such a soopa doopa team and are winning every game, we can't do any better ?

And in case you didn't realise, stuck in your armchair, its a squad game. You need more than 11 players.

Edited by LeazesMag, 22 February 2012 - 07:44 PM.

[jaythesouthernmag]

LeazesMag, on 22 February 2012 - 07:25 PM, said:

jaythesouthernmag, on 22 February 2012 - 06:46 PM, said:

Which of the players which you keep mentioning would get into our starting 11 now?

the point is where is the Carroll cash ? Or do you think we have such a soopa doopa team and are winning every game, we can't do any better ?

And in case you didn't realise, stuck in your armchair, its a squad game. You need more than 11 players.

Have a word with yourself, I agree we could do with a couple of squad players but for you to use that to support your argument for selling Carroll,Barton,Nolan and Enrique is frankly stupid

[LeazesMag]

jaythesouthernmag, on 22 February 2012 - 08:09 PM, said:

LeazesMag, on 22 February 2012 - 07:25 PM, said:

jaythesouthernmag, on 22 February 2012 - 06:46 PM, said:

Which of the players which you keep mentioning would get into our starting 11 now?

the point is where is the Carroll cash ? Or do you think we have such a soopa doopa team and are winning every game, we can't do any better ?

And in case you didn't realise, stuck in your armchair, its a squad game. You need more than 11 players.

Have a word with yourself, I agree we could do with a couple of squad players but for you to use that to support your argument for selling Carroll,Barton,Nolan and Enrique is frankly stupid

selling Carroll [or witholding the money from the manager for what is accepted as a big fee, to improve the entire team and squad as much as possible with it - do you really not understand this], Nolan and Enrique and giving away Barton for nothing, were all stupid decisions.

A couple of squad players ? What glue are you sniffing ? Would we not be better if Nolan, Barton and Enrique [and others sold in the last 3 years or so] were all still here ?

You really don't understand the build and improve process do you ? Rather than a revolving door sell and replace [cheaply] policy ? How naive are you to think that you can go on selling your best players and continue to replace like this ? Why do you think all the successful clubs there has ever been have not applied this policy ?

Sigh. I give up.

Edited by LeazesMag, 22 February 2012 - 08:16 PM.

[spongebob toonpants]

Tom, on 21 February 2012 - 05:10 PM, said:

He's took a break

The day the music died....

So what happened, or aren't we allowed to know

[Ant]

Nothing to know that's actually the whole story

[PUGATRON1000]

LeazesMag, on 22 February 2012 - 08:12 PM, said:

Would we not be better if Nolan, Barton and Enrique [and others sold in the last 3 years or so] were all still here ?

IMHO no, as we would be paying their overinflated wages still, and I can't imagine any of them to be happy sitting on a bench, or playing reserve football. Yes it's a squad game, BUT a couple bad apples can create chaos. I am more than happy with how we have progressed ( in league position AS WELL AS football played,) since they left. We're not even close to being a finished article, but as a work in progress I think we are doing good things.

[BestBaNone]

Whether or not or transfer policy is sustainable is a matter of opinion. 100% opinion. Leazesmag though, he claims to like facts. The fact is that we are an improving outfit using this strategy in the market, as the improving league positions back up. Simple.

[spongebob toonpants]

Ant, on 22 February 2012 - 08:53 PM, said:

Nothing to know that's actually the whole story

ok, secret squirrel

[NJS]

LeazesMag, on 22 February 2012 - 08:12 PM, said:

A couple of squad players ? What glue are you sniffing ? Would we not be better if Nolan, Barton and Enrique [and others sold in the last 3 years or so] were all still here ?

Players of that quality Yes - but football isn't as simple as that. I bought into the team spirit thing about Nolan and Barton which made me think it was poor selling them but that's been proved to be a load of shite. You keep saying that finances are meaningless (or suggest that) but if you really think it's a good idea to give a 30 year old a 5 year 55k pw contract then I think you're daft. Similarly tolerating a shit-stirrer just because hie's a good player is something no club should put up with - See Man Utd and up to now Man City (Tevez) as good examples of that.

In Enrique's case these things happen - players decide the grass is greener but if they don't want to play for you then I say they can fuck off and die. Of course you'll say that no player should fancy liverpool more than us which I agree with in principle but in reality they always have and always will have more appeal to foreigners - the history is just too much.

I'd also argue on the "backing the manager" point that Pardew now has his number one striking target at the club - it's shit that it took a year but suggesting he's had no backing is daft.

[NJS]

^ I should add that he hasn't has enough backing - but it's the black and white "he's had none" that irks.

[LeazesMag]

NJS, on 22 February 2012 - 09:28 PM, said:

LeazesMag, on 22 February 2012 - 08:12 PM, said:

A couple of squad players ? What glue are you sniffing ? Would we not be better if Nolan, Barton and Enrique [and others sold in the last 3 years or so] were all still here ?

Players of that quality Yes - but football isn't as simple as that. I bought into the team spirit thing about Nolan and Barton which made me think it was poor selling them but that's been proved to be a load of shite. You keep saying that finances are meaningless (or suggest that) but if you really think it's a good idea to give a 30 year old a 5 year 55k pw contract then I think you're daft. Similarly tolerating a shit-stirrer just because hie's a good player is something no club should put up with - See Man Utd and up to now Man City (Tevez) as good examples of that.

In Enrique's case these things happen - players decide the grass is greener but if they don't want to play for you then I say they can fuck off and die. Of course you'll say that no player should fancy liverpool more than us which I agree with in principle but in reality they always have and always will have more appeal to foreigners - the history is just too much.

I'd also argue on the "backing the manager" point that Pardew now has his number one striking target at the club - it's shit that it took a year but suggesting he's had no backing is daft.

you are unbelievably naive, like most of the skunkers posters too, as shown by this post.

Every single manager, and player, in the game, will tell you that team spirit and leadership is essential to success in football. Alex Ferguson said it recently on TV, I think it was after the Chelsea game where they came back to draw after being 3-0 down. Ironically, Alex Ferguson also has only achieved what he has at ManU because he was backed by his directors, along with every other successful club in the history of the game. They were backed by their directors, and on the odd occasion that their best players leave the club they have been continued to be backed to improve the team in entirety, without money disappearing down a big black hole.

You won't find a post from me anywhere saying its a good idea to give a 30 year old a 5 year contract at 55k a week, so stop making things up, and I thought Fish was perusing the forum to clamp down on these sort of false accusations You will find a post or two saying there was no need to take such a decision when Nolan had 2 years of his contract left, and I stand by that, so where is the money, bearing in mind a big club like NUFC ought to be able to buy players like Cabaye within its normal operating budget or at least like all the other ambitious clubs who don't tell their supporters they need to sell to buy ?

There was also no reason to give Barton away for free, we would be better off if Barton was also still at the club.

I really don't want to go down this road, but it never ceases to amaze me, the amount of people who have such an irrational hatred of the directors who have gave us the best period by a million miles in over 50 years, have their methods mocked by so many so called supporters, who are clinging to the belief that they will still be proved right in their assertions that "anybody would do better than this". I won't expand further on the meaning of "this", its been done hundreds of times, here, on skunkers, and on Newcastle Online, but despite theirs and yours "opinions" the current owner has got nowhere near and the reason for that is quite simply that his strategy and ambitions are inferior.

Your point about Enrique is an absolute no brainer, and shows that anybody who don't understand why he left, is a joke. He left Newcastle because he knows the club does not have the ambitions to make it worthwhile for him to stay, the same reason that players such as Shay Given, James Milner, Sebastian Bassong, Andy Carroll and Charles N'Zogbia left, and players in the past such as Gazza, Waddle and Beardsley. And the sad thing is, more will follow, yet fools will continue to make excuses for it, just like they did when Gazza, Waddle and Beardsley were sold too.

The club has gone backwards in the last 4 years, in ambitions and on the financial front as explained in other threads, and will continue to do so unless the owner does a dramatic u-turn.

I'm not explaining this to you again.

Edited by LeazesMag, 23 February 2012 - 12:54 AM.

[LeazesMag]

NJS, on 22 February 2012 - 09:30 PM, said:

^ I should add that he hasn't has enough backing - but it's the black and white "he's had none" that irks.

in keeping with the thread subject, rather than derail it by talking about idealistic financial nonsense, if NUFC qualify for the Europa Cup this season, they will NOT attempt to build on it and go higher. Expect sales and cheap replacements instead, and more money witheld from the manager like the Carroll money, this is what 2nd rate selling clubs do, not big clubs with big support who should be aiming for the real european competition slots.

Edited by LeazesMag, 23 February 2012 - 12:44 AM.

[JaMoUsE]

LM, if you think N'Zogbia left and went to Wigan cos the club didn't match his ambitions you are totally insane.

[BestBaNone]

LeazesMag, on 23 February 2012 - 12:34 AM, said:

NJS, on 22 February 2012 - 09:30 PM, said:

^ I should add that he hasn't has enough backing - but it's the black and white "he's had none" that irks.

in keeping with the thread subject, rather than derail it by talking about idealistic financial nonsense, if NUFC qualify for the Europa Cup this season, they will NOT attempt to build on it and go higher. Expect sales and cheap replacements instead, and more money witheld from the manager like the Carroll money, this is what 2nd rate selling clubs do, not big clubs with big support who should be aiming for the real european competition slots.

A prediction/opinion. Poor form for somebody that prides himself in dealing with facts.

[dbsweeney]

Zoggy left for Wigan because of Kinnear. Kinnear was chosen by Ashley and Llambias. Would you say that the choice of Kinnear showed ambition?

JK was chosen because the job at SJP seemed caustic at the time and no-one else was willing to do it (or the club wasn't willing to pay those who were willing—speculation on my part). Added to the fact that MA and DL knew absolutely nothing about running a football club and so knew no better than to choose someone who'd been out of the game for many years.

[jaythesouthernmag]

He says he doesn't approve of giving a 30 year old a five year deal on £55k a week but that's what it would have taken to keep Nolan, yet he slates the sale,how does that work?

[JawD]

I was pissed when Nolan and Barton left, but its difficult not knowing all the facts behind the moves.  That said, if you consider Tiote and Cabaye their replacement then we are stronger for it.  However, to back LM's point, we could have done with keeping Barton as well as having these two as he had started putting in a hell of a shift in RM and would have given us a good option there when we have struggled at times.

Barton leaving was fuck all to do with ambition though, nor was Nolan.  Barton simply fell out with the board. slated them in public and was driven out of the club for it.

[ewerk]

LeazesMag, on 23 February 2012 - 12:29 AM, said:

I'm not explaining this to you again.

Thank fuck for that.

[McFaul]

LeazesMag, on 23 February 2012 - 12:29 AM, said:

You won't find a post from me anywhere saying its a good idea to give a 30 year old a 5 year contract at 55k a week, so stop making things up, and I thought Fish was perusing the forum to clamp down on these sort of false accusations You will find a post or two saying there was no need to take such a decision when Nolan had 2 years of his contract left, and I stand by that, so where is the money, bearing in mind a big club like NUFC ought to be able to buy players like Cabaye within its normal operating budget or at least like all the other ambitious clubs who don't tell their supporters they need to sell to buy ?

I was up in arms at the Nolan sale, but from a less frenzied position now, I think it was the right thing to do.  He's slow and immobile now so what's he going to be like in 5 years time.  I don't agree with letting him run down his 2 year deal neither, £5m for a man as unathletic as Nolan was tremendous business, particularly when we got a French international worth treble that for the same price more or less.  If we'd have let him while down his 2 year deal and knocking back the money we'd be basically paying £5m for a slow midfielder for just two seasons.  That said I agree with everything else you've put.