80-2

I do wonder how much control Llambias actually has. I know most of us thought/think that he's just Ashley's puppet, but I'm wondering if Ashley just leaves him to it and that Llambias deserves more of the blame that is directed straight at Ashley. Wouldn't be surprised in the slightest, but I think it's gone far too far for that sophisticated an analysis... Ultimately, Ashley put him there, knows him and isn't taking him away.

Anyone know where I can get a decent torrent of the whole first series? Initial checks see them all dead, private or including an incomplete episode. I've wanted to watch the first again before the second since I realised just how much the BBC cut out in order to up the sex proportion - hurrah for high-quality, publicly-funded smut.

Don't normally post on here, but I wanted to share this http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=RockyMcBatts Seems the video I originally found him through has been deleted, unfortunately ("There was a young boy from eebrax"). I've since found a few response videos of varying quality, "The Italian Christmas Donkey" appeals to the child in me.

I know I shouldn't, but Perhaps I have tourettes!?! Am I right in thinking the Homosapien remark came in Canterbury? Just occurred to me that would've been in relation to creationism and such

Well, of course, the story goes that he's got a £4.5m release clause...

Sky were blatantly taking the piss, as was Souness. 107757[/snapback] Agree with both posts. He was obviously not a proper player Wish those guys who caught Keegan in the car park with the baseball bat all those years got hold of Souness instead And thats the price on the ticket 107816[/snapback] I heard it was a rent boy that done that to Keegan, probably just a vicous rumour like 107906[/snapback] I've heard worse than that. Think it was from someone on here

More meritocratic. Because it has less class hang-ups! In a nutshell. Jesus wept tbh. 34289[/snapback] For every missing class hang up there's a "he's a fucking WASP/non-denominationalist/wetback/etc.". Case in point - The Fucking Fulfords. Posh as they come but poor. Theres more to being upper class than money. With that in mind, its probably easier for the working classes to become properly assumed members of that club than it is richer middle classes.

^*ahem*^

that is the point of course THROUGH BIRTHRIGHT I don't think the Dook in Alnwick has done much to justify owning all that land and his dinkie castle 34251[/snapback] Perhaps, but I can't help thinking that all people who say property should revert to the state upon death are arch mentalists. So they enjoy the fruits of slavery and exploitation but can't be held responsible for it? 34252[/snapback] You live in the prosperous West because your ancestors sailed off to the Muslim world and sodomised it several times over, helping to wreck the technological/philisophical/etc. lead it had over us at the time. Are you offering reparations? --- Preview page shows breaking news... --- In many ways, I'd actually say Britain is more meritocratic. And in other ways, less meritocratic. For my money, its probably too mixed a bag to try and gauge. It also would probably involve a far longer discussion in another thread to try and pin down Are you laughing? Rule #1 in the reading of the past, present and future - Never use absolutes. "Death Knell" was probably the wrong term to use. For general chat its alright, but if we're gonna be more accurate, "given a good kicking" would be a better way to put it. You can get back up from a good kicking. I think one problem we're all having here (or at least, I am) is just what the definition of the Upper Class is. As a result, we may be arguing at cross points. Some (to a large extent, me included) are thinking of the people and culture that does remain, but has been ground down under assaults of varying magnitude for around 300 years, now. Others seem to be thinking of rich people with public school accents - there is a large difference between these two groups. To go back to the "Upper Classes dying" bit, it would be stupidity itself to say such a thing, simply because whenever an upper class does disappear, it is always replaced - nature abhors a vacuum and all that. Edit: This bloody thread isn't easy to keep up with when you're trying to do other things at the same time... Stop posting and wait for me, you bastards. 2nd Edit: Fucking deleted my post with that previous fucking edit...

Its around, but half of it is bankrupt and they don't hold anything like the sway they once did/would've. By death knell, I meant in the longer term. A revolution took place and ambitious sorts from the lower classes seized power, imposing what they saw as logic and rationale upon their surroundings. The thing about the landed-gentry is that the vast majority of their land remained in our scepted isle, whether it was in Northumberland, Perthshire or Shropshire. The only upper classes that remained, prospered and expanded were the ones who started playing the middle classes' game. Also, I don't really like this term being bandied about in quite the way it is being. Its as though its a Hindu-based cast system, as opposed to the reletively fluid entity it actually is. Is anyone here (or anywhere else) going to dare say that the USA doesn't have a class system, including a fully-fledged upper class?

Don't see what it has to do with class. 34230[/snapback] upper class=greatest beneficiaries from empire/colonialism 34231[/snapback] You're thinking of the middle classes. 34234[/snapback] Excuse me, but I'm not. 34236[/snapback] Well, in that case, I suggest you do some reading up, Sir. It can be well argued that the rise and rise of the middle classes throughout the 18th and 19th centuries rang the death knell for the upper classes.

Don't see what it has to do with class. 34230[/snapback] upper class=greatest beneficiaries from empire/colonialism 34231[/snapback] You could argue completely the opposite mancy. The upper classes in countries that were never colonists still do quite well. You could in fact argue that thwe lower classes really benefit most. Look at the standard of living of the average American for example. What I'm really getting at with NJS's post was that his attitude sounds like an excuse to bitterly generalise. Maybe if we stopped slinging shit at each other we might actually learn something? Would it be ok for 'working class twats' to hold the same party? 34233[/snapback] Basically what I said at greater length

Don't see what it has to do with class. 34230[/snapback] upper class=greatest beneficiaries from empire/colonialism 34231[/snapback] You're thinking of the middle classes.

You're thinking within the realms of your own experiences. To much of that lot, theres a social cachet in sourcing some good looking costume of a specific tribe, there wasn't as much "leaves on bollocks, spears in hands" stuff, therefore. Of course, it also demonstrates what a concientious and decent young man he is for associating The Third Reich with what he no doubt sees as the appalling excesses of imperial England in its pomp, ruthlessly exploiting Mother Africa for sheer greed.

We could set Harry on any slackers. Sounds good, to me.