dbsweeney 0 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 "big signing" and "Guthrie" in the same sentence One big player is not what you need. You need to build a squad. With a decent wage structure and shared vision for NUFC. what a load of shit Not really ... it's just that the way that MA went about it was wrong and unrealistic (too much--too fast). No-one here can honestly expect us to be contenders for the title in the next three years or so. BUT ... build a decent squad that knows each other, and is consistent and dependable (supplemented by a top quality, willing-to-be-a-rock central midfielder) and you have a basis to build something on. Can anyone honestly say that the amount of money poured into the club over the last decade or so (apart from Sir Bobby's years) really ended up doing anything? We do need to lower the wage costs and build a structured squad. It's just that Ashley though he could turn us into Arsenal overnight ... which was just an idiotic way of doing it. Over time, as players leave and come in a natural progression, make smart purchases and don't offer the exorbitant amounts we've paid in the past for new players. It's a great idea, it's just that MA turned it into a fire-sale of sell everyone now and replace them with whatever we can happen to lay our hands on--Xisco being the perfect example of the worst of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 "big signing" and "Guthrie" in the same sentence One big player is not what you need. You need to build a squad. With a decent wage structure and shared vision for NUFC. what a load of shit Not really ... it's just that the way that MA went about it was wrong and unrealistic (too much--too fast). No-one here can honestly expect us to be contenders for the title in the next three years or so. BUT ... build a decent squad that knows each other, and is consistent and dependable (supplemented by a top quality, willing-to-be-a-rock central midfielder) and you have a basis to build something on. Can anyone honestly say that the amount of money poured into the club over the last decade or so (apart from Sir Bobby's years) really ended up doing anything? We do need to lower the wage costs and build a structured squad. It's just that Ashley though he could turn us into Arsenal overnight ... which was just an idiotic way of doing it. Over time, as players leave and come in a natural progression, make smart purchases and don't offer the exorbitant amounts we've paid in the past for new players. It's a great idea, it's just that MA turned it into a fire-sale of sell everyone now and replace them with whatever we can happen to lay our hands on--Xisco being the perfect example of the worst of this. the last board built some good squads, that qualified for europe regularly and was the 5th highest placed team in the country. You don't do that if you don't have a good squad. You;re talking bollocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douggy B 0 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 "big signing" and "Guthrie" in the same sentence One big player is not what you need. You need to build a squad. With a decent wage structure and shared vision for NUFC. what a load of shit Not really ... it's just that the way that MA went about it was wrong and unrealistic (too much--too fast). No-one here can honestly expect us to be contenders for the title in the next three years or so. BUT ... build a decent squad that knows each other, and is consistent and dependable (supplemented by a top quality, willing-to-be-a-rock central midfielder) and you have a basis to build something on. Can anyone honestly say that the amount of money poured into the club over the last decade or so (apart from Sir Bobby's years) really ended up doing anything? We do need to lower the wage costs and build a structured squad. It's just that Ashley though he could turn us into Arsenal overnight ... which was just an idiotic way of doing it. Over time, as players leave and come in a natural progression, make smart purchases and don't offer the exorbitant amounts we've paid in the past for new players. It's a great idea, it's just that MA turned it into a fire-sale of sell everyone now and replace them with whatever we can happen to lay our hands on--Xisco being the perfect example of the worst of this. the last board built some good squads, that qualified for europe regularly and was the 5th highest placed team in the country. You don't do that if you don't have a good squad. You;re talking bollocks. In the meantime the levels of debt just got worse and worse. You werent living within your means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbsweeney 0 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 "big signing" and "Guthrie" in the same sentence One big player is not what you need. You need to build a squad. With a decent wage structure and shared vision for NUFC. what a load of shit Not really ... it's just that the way that MA went about it was wrong and unrealistic (too much--too fast). No-one here can honestly expect us to be contenders for the title in the next three years or so. BUT ... build a decent squad that knows each other, and is consistent and dependable (supplemented by a top quality, willing-to-be-a-rock central midfielder) and you have a basis to build something on. Can anyone honestly say that the amount of money poured into the club over the last decade or so (apart from Sir Bobby's years) really ended up doing anything? We do need to lower the wage costs and build a structured squad. It's just that Ashley though he could turn us into Arsenal overnight ... which was just an idiotic way of doing it. Over time, as players leave and come in a natural progression, make smart purchases and don't offer the exorbitant amounts we've paid in the past for new players. It's a great idea, it's just that MA turned it into a fire-sale of sell everyone now and replace them with whatever we can happen to lay our hands on--Xisco being the perfect example of the worst of this. the last board built some good squads, that qualified for europe regularly and was the 5th highest placed team in the country. You don't do that if you don't have a good squad. You;re talking bollocks. In the meantime the levels of debt just got worse and worse. You werent living within your means. Exactly -- and we still have one of the highest wage costs in the league. Under Sir Bobby we did alright. But that was five years ago and ever since it's been big costs for players that haven't delivered and no success of any consequence (unless you call the Intertoto a big whopsy-doo--I don't). Instead you've seen managers who have been counting their pennies (Moyes, O'Neal) having greater success than us. Instead we still pay 52 mill a year in wages (just below Liverpool) and we have a wafer thin squad. Just buying one or two big names won't fix it. I quote the original post by Danny B: You need to build a squad ... with a decent wage structure and shared vision for NUFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 13840 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Dennis Wise signings, Jonas and Collicini. Good or bad? They were Jeff Vetere/Tony Jimenez signings. Guthrie was Keegan, The likes of Ranger,Kadar,Zambrela were Wise signings. Wise then proceeded to get in the way when Keegan wanted Warnock and Lennon and commission a striker and the sale of Milner instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 "big signing" and "Guthrie" in the same sentence One big player is not what you need. You need to build a squad. With a decent wage structure and shared vision for NUFC. what a load of shit Not really ... it's just that the way that MA went about it was wrong and unrealistic (too much--too fast). No-one here can honestly expect us to be contenders for the title in the next three years or so. BUT ... build a decent squad that knows each other, and is consistent and dependable (supplemented by a top quality, willing-to-be-a-rock central midfielder) and you have a basis to build something on. Can anyone honestly say that the amount of money poured into the club over the last decade or so (apart from Sir Bobby's years) really ended up doing anything? We do need to lower the wage costs and build a structured squad. It's just that Ashley though he could turn us into Arsenal overnight ... which was just an idiotic way of doing it. Over time, as players leave and come in a natural progression, make smart purchases and don't offer the exorbitant amounts we've paid in the past for new players. It's a great idea, it's just that MA turned it into a fire-sale of sell everyone now and replace them with whatever we can happen to lay our hands on--Xisco being the perfect example of the worst of this. the last board built some good squads, that qualified for europe regularly and was the 5th highest placed team in the country. You don't do that if you don't have a good squad. You;re talking bollocks. In the meantime the levels of debt just got worse and worse. You werent living within your means. Exactly -- and we still have one of the highest wage costs in the league. Under Sir Bobby we did alright. But that was five years ago and ever since it's been big costs for players that haven't delivered and no success of any consequence (unless you call the Intertoto a big whopsy-doo--I don't). Instead you've seen managers who have been counting their pennies (Moyes, O'Neal) having greater success than us. Instead we still pay 52 mill a year in wages (just below Liverpool) and we have a wafer thin squad. Just buying one or two big names won't fix it. I quote the original post by Danny B: You need to build a squad ... with a decent wage structure and shared vision for NUFC Ashley has set about building a "squad". Still think that is right ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman 2188 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Our squad was woefully thin when the season began and still is; how has Ashley built a decent squad? We're utterly short in midfield (a 34 year old who can't pass the ball is our midfield lynchpin), we are short of a left back, a centre half, a back up right back and all of our strikers are injury prone except the one you want to be injured. A decent squad ? Would be funny if we were weren't in the bottom 3...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Our squad was woefully thin when the season began and still is; how has Ashley built a decent squad? We're utterly short in midfield (a 34 year old who can't pass the ball is our midfield lynchpin), we are short of a left back, a centre half, a back up right back and all of our strikers are injury prone except the one you want to be injured. A decent squad ? Would be funny if we were weren't in the bottom 3...... I think Danny is on the wind up. There are good and bad things about the setup. But it has categorically failed vis a vie the squad and our current predicament...People will debate this I guess till we get relegated, cause if we don't spend in Jan we will be fighting for our lives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 8870 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Our squad was woefully thin when the season began and still is; how has Ashley built a decent squad? We're utterly short in midfield (a 34 year old who can't pass the ball is our midfield lynchpin), we are short of a left back, a centre half, a back up right back and all of our strikers are injury prone except the one you want to be injured. A decent squad ? Would be funny if we were weren't in the bottom 3...... I think Danny is on the wind up. No shit. He's only defending Spurs though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitman 2188 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Our squad was woefully thin when the season began and still is; how has Ashley built a decent squad? We're utterly short in midfield (a 34 year old who can't pass the ball is our midfield lynchpin), we are short of a left back, a centre half, a back up right back and all of our strikers are injury prone except the one you want to be injured. A decent squad ? Would be funny if we were weren't in the bottom 3...... I think Danny is on the wind up. There are good and bad things about the setup. But it has categorically failed vis a vie the squad and our current predicament...People will debate this I guess till we get relegated, cause if we don't spend in Jan we will be fighting for our lives. I think there are some people who believe the setup is a work of genius. Despite where we sit in the table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 We're back in the bottom three tonight. If Hull keep winning there's every chance on earth we will be relegated, especially if this evil empire are planning on replacing quality with turgid shite. I guarantee the players that come in will sign contracts saying they'll earn a different salary in the Premiership to what they will in the Championship. Wigan's win tonight has pushed us back in to the bottom three, and no one likes reading their paper and seeing us there is upsetting. We have a third of the season gone, and if the next two thirds are the same we will be relegated from the top flight of English football it's that simple. If Shay Given is sold to fund a Thomas Sorensen type keeper, I will state now you will not see me at SJP till that fucking fat "I'm your friend" bastard is gone. Fucking sat there with the fans, insulting us saying he worried in case we chin his daughter, he's a fuckin disgrace. He will die a filthy rich man, even if he blew £500m on us from now, he'd die rich, if he had any honour about him, he'd give us the money to retain the squad we have, and sign one or two quality players which can hopefully prove the difference between dogfight and midtable. This fuckin I'm a PC advert is pissing me off more than anything in life. Take it off the telly you cunts! I really dont get this. Your three big signings last window have (considering the fact they have yet to settle) been a success. Jonas, Guthrie and Collicini have done well so far. More of the same whilst cutting out a bit more of the dead wood will see you rise up the table. As I have always said on here. Short term pain, for long term gain. Agree about the PC advert by the way. Fucking shit. Guthrie's been pretty shit imo. The other two have been ok (excellent some games, poor in others) but I wouldn't slag them given they need to settle in etc. How is Guthrie a big signing and Xisco (who has hardly been a success) isn't? Because it doesn't fit your agenda? Both rhetorical questions btw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 It's all KK's fault innit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Stevie Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 It's all KK's fault innit. .........and the ingrained attitude of the fans don't forget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 And the previous board Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fop 1 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Would a FFS signing have appeased you? Say Modric? An Etoo? Backing Keegan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fop 1 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Dennis Wise is being written off because he is southern. Firstly it wouldn't have been Wise that identified them, secondly no one would have a problem with Wise if he'd gone out and got the players Keegan wanted/needed as opposed two he didn't and a £0 transfer budget (and trying to flog Owen and Barton etc.). The amazing thing is THIS isn't the worse case scenario Wise and Ashley could have landed us in. We could have quite easily be sat in the same position, with the exact same squad, this season only without Owen and Barton (and maybe a few others) as well. Which is what fills me with terror about January, and undoubtedly makes you yourself bloody about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douggy B 0 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 We could have quite easily be sat in the same position, with the exact same squad, this season only without Owen and Barton (and maybe a few others) as well. Which would have freed up money for more signings. Signings that wouldnt be injured / suspended for a good portion of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 We could have quite easily be sat in the same position, with the exact same squad, this season only without Owen and Barton (and maybe a few others) as well. Which would have freed up money for more signings. Signings that wouldnt be injured / suspended for a good portion of the season. Like when Milner went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fop 1 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 We could have quite easily be sat in the same position, with the exact same squad, this season only without Owen and Barton (and maybe a few others) as well. Which would have freed up money for more signings. Signings that wouldnt be injured / suspended for a good portion of the season. Yes, because we'd have been able to operate OUTSIDE the transfer window wouldn't we? Oh wait... I'm sure when we go down we'll have plenty to spend. Technically there should be money anyway for the January window, yet we're being ran for that on a £0 budget again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 The thing is as well, we all took the piss out of Roeder for his last minute dealings but it wasn't his fault he had to do virtually everything on the scouting side too. Wise, on the other hand, had nothing else to do except look after bringing players in and he was still doing stuff at the last minute (not particularly effectively either). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Douggy B 0 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 We could have quite easily be sat in the same position, with the exact same squad, this season only without Owen and Barton (and maybe a few others) as well. Which would have freed up money for more signings. Signings that wouldnt be injured / suspended for a good portion of the season. Like when Milner went. He paid for the new three. three good players for one fairly overrated one. Hardly been pulling up trees at villa 7 appearances in the league five from the bench? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matty 0 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 I don't think we'll go down, and I also don't think there'll be a mass exodus in January... Unsure about incoming players and takeover like. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 We could have quite easily be sat in the same position, with the exact same squad, this season only without Owen and Barton (and maybe a few others) as well. Which would have freed up money for more signings. Signings that wouldnt be injured / suspended for a good portion of the season. Like when Milner went. He paid for the new three. three good players for one fairly overrated one. Hardly been pulling up trees at villa 7 appearances in the league five from the bench? Aye, he did pay for them (although it's 2 good ones at best imo). But we were told when Milner left that a replacement would arrive. Lies apparently. Therefore I would suggest Barton and Owen wouldn't have been replaced, barring some miraculous last minute dealings. That is the point, rather than Milner's ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fop 1 Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 The thing is as well, we all took the piss out of Roeder for his last minute dealings but it wasn't his fault he had to do virtually everything on the scouting side too. Wise, on the other hand, had nothing else to do except look after bringing players in and he was still doing stuff at the last minute (not particularly effectively either). Aye, the unbelievable thing is that anyone would think Wise was good at his job. We could have quite easily be sat in the same position, with the exact same squad, this season only without Owen and Barton (and maybe a few others) as well. Which would have freed up money for more signings. Signings that wouldnt be injured / suspended for a good portion of the season. Like when Milner went. He paid for the new three. three good players for one fairly overrated one. Hardly been pulling up trees at villa 7 appearances in the league five from the bench? No he didn't, he went on the proviso that two weak positions would be filled with the money from him (preferable with £6m ish Premiership players) - that never happened. How you think they would have replaced Owen and Barton in the 3 nanoseconds after they would have been sold and before the window shut I've no idea. So as bizarre as it is, Wise could have done an even worse job for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted November 25, 2008 Share Posted November 25, 2008 Anyway, if we needed to sell Milner to pay for the other 3, it was lucky he handed in a transfer request a week before the window closed. Some top foresight there by the people handling recruitment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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