Park Life 70 Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Anyone know what is happening with this piece of garbage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26118 Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Hope people forget about it and then convince the Irish that they're voting on something completely different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 Hope people forget about it and then convince the Irish that they're voting on something completely different. Am I right in thinking the Irish are the only ones who have held this back? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26118 Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Aye, I can't remember whether any other countries were due to have a referendum on it but once the Irish said no then it was dead in the water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 (edited) Aye, I can't remember whether any other countries were due to have a referendum on it but once the Irish said no then it was dead in the water. Thank god for that. It seems the PM's agreed not to put it to referendum, which is a disgrace and goes against all values of democracy. I've been looking into it a bit and it is very dangerous to the powers of individual EU nations to control their own countries. MEP's are saying they have no access to 85% of the law making in Brussels which is done by closed committee. Edited December 3, 2008 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc-mag 1 Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Aye, I can't remember whether any other countries were due to have a referendum on it but once the Irish said no then it was dead in the water. I don't care who he gets as long as I can have a go at the Greeks. They invented gayness! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeordieMessiah 0 Posted December 3, 2008 Share Posted December 3, 2008 Aye, I can't remember whether any other countries were due to have a referendum on it but once the Irish said no then it was dead in the water. I don't care who he gets as long as I can have a go at the Greeks. They invented gayness! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted December 3, 2008 Author Share Posted December 3, 2008 Here be monsters I tell thee! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Carr's Gloves 3176 Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 (edited) Aye, I can't remember whether any other countries were due to have a referendum on it but once the Irish said no then it was dead in the water. Thank god for that. It seems the PM's agreed not to put it to referendum, which is a disgrace and goes against all values of democracy. I've been looking into it a bit and it is very dangerous to the powers of individual EU nations to control their own countries. MEP's are saying they have no access to 85% of the law making in Brussels which is done by closed committee. Yes most of the decision making in the EU is done by the Commission which is an unelected body full of unelected people. Or the Council of Ministers which is a misnomer as most of the decision making is done by either the committee of permanent representatives and the secretariat which are both....... yes you guessed it unelected bodies poulated by unelected people. The reason for this is that these two bodies are controlled by the nation states governments as they decide which unelected people make up these august institutions. They definitely dont want to give power to the Parliament as they are made up of completely different people than the governments would like. Edited December 5, 2008 by Kevin Carr's Gloves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted December 5, 2008 Author Share Posted December 5, 2008 Aye, I can't remember whether any other countries were due to have a referendum on it but once the Irish said no then it was dead in the water. Thank god for that. It seems the PM's agreed not to put it to referendum, which is a disgrace and goes against all values of democracy. I've been looking into it a bit and it is very dangerous to the powers of individual EU nations to control their own countries. MEP's are saying they have no access to 85% of the law making in Brussels which is done by closed committee. Yes most of the decision making in the EU is done by the Commission which is an unelected body full of unelected people. Or the Council of Ministers which is a misnomer as most of the decision making is done by either the committee of permanent representatives and the secretariat which are both....... yes you guessed it unelected bodies poulated by unelected people. The reason for this is that these two bodies are controlled by the nation states governments as they decide which unelected people make up these august institutions. They definitely dont want to give power to the Parliament as they are made up of completely different people than the governments would like. So, basically the whole process is undemocratic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 8862 Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 (edited) The people who appoint the commission are elected though, as are the members of the European parliament who have certain rights in the process of appointment as well regarding the vote of no confidence. Not what I'd call a totally undemocratic process. If the commission is a bunch of muppets is a different issue though... Edited December 5, 2008 by Isegrim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26118 Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 Tbf the Commissioners don't have a whole lot of accountability and a lot of people in Britain have no idea that they even exist, never mind have any idea of what they're doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fop 1 Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 The people who appoint the commission are elected though, as are the members of the European parliament who have certain rights in the process of appointment as well regarding the vote of no confidence. Not what I'd call a totally undemocratic process. If the commission is a bunch of muppets is a different issue though... The EC is about as undemocratic as you can get without actually having to salute them. The Libson Treaty seems to have been put onto the under table train, expect it to rear up at any moment (they just need to work out a way to get it past the Irish without a vote). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted December 5, 2008 Author Share Posted December 5, 2008 The people who appoint the commission are elected though, as are the members of the European parliament who have certain rights in the process of appointment as well regarding the vote of no confidence. Not what I'd call a totally undemocratic process. If the commission is a bunch of muppets is a different issue though... The EC is about as undemocratic as you can get without actually having to salute them. The Libson Treaty seems to have been put onto the under table train, expect it to rear up at any moment (they just need to work out a way to get it past the Irish without a vote). Why are there no referendums? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fop 1 Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 The people who appoint the commission are elected though, as are the members of the European parliament who have certain rights in the process of appointment as well regarding the vote of no confidence. Not what I'd call a totally undemocratic process. If the commission is a bunch of muppets is a different issue though... The EC is about as undemocratic as you can get without actually having to salute them. The Libson Treaty seems to have been put onto the under table train, expect it to rear up at any moment (they just need to work out a way to get it past the Irish without a vote). Why are there no referendums? Because they did a great "look over there, an Aardvark!!!" trick. They changed it just enough to be able to claim it's not the constitution (which is what the referendum promises were about), whist it actually is pretty much the same document. The don't want referendums because they know they'll lose at least one or more. IMO it's the dodgyiest think the EU has done (so far) including the vast EC embezzlement/corruption scandals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Carr's Gloves 3176 Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 The people who appoint the commission are elected though, as are the members of the European parliament who have certain rights in the process of appointment as well regarding the vote of no confidence. Not what I'd call a totally undemocratic process. If the commission is a bunch of muppets is a different issue though... That one really doesn't make it any better mate. Look at who has been on the commission and the Santer Crisis it is still too powerful for an unelected body. The Parliament is getting more power but is still the Junior member. The process is not wholly undemocratic but enough to give its opponentsammunition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted December 7, 2008 Share Posted December 7, 2008 all depends on the Irish - if they turn it down again its dead - but the changes will sneak in anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyluke 1 Posted December 7, 2008 Share Posted December 7, 2008 Aye, I can't remember whether any other countries were due to have a referendum on it but once the Irish said no then it was dead in the water. I don't care who he gets as long as I can have a go at the Greeks. They invented gayness! It's not the Greeks, it's the Chinese he's after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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