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Israel continues its merciless pounding of the defenceless.


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Anyone seen any good articles on the Palestinian rejection of the latest proposal to freeze the settlements? I only glanced over some; seems they still want a right of return to Israel. Jimmy Carter has been on record saying if they'd relent in that demand then they could get a solid agreement down.

 

Palestinians declined to take the bait of Israeli Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu on Monday. Netanyahu offered an extension of the 10-month freeze on new Israeli settlements in the Palestinian West Bank in return for a PA acknowledgment of Israel as a “Jewish State.” Obviously, the phrase has some covert significance for the Israeli Right, and perhaps it is intended to bestow on Israel a right to denaturalize and expel Palestinian-Israelis. The phrase may also be intended to forestall any return to Israel of the Palestinians ethnically cleansed from that territory in 1948.

 

Fatah official Saeb Erekat said he could not understand what Israel’s self-definition had to do with negotiations over the shape of a Palestinian state, and pointed out that the PLO had exchanged letters in 1993 recognizing the state of Israel. (The Palestinians do not understand how the Israelis can negotiate over the West Bank in good faith if they are de facto annexing large swathes of it even as the talks proceed.)

 

Israeli foreign minister and far-right social engineer Avigdor Lieberman lost his temper Sunday in a meeting with the Spanish and French foreign ministers. He told them to go solve Europe’s own disputes before coming to the Mideast and instructing Israel how to resolve its. Lieberman is then accused in some quarters of having leaked his comments to the press, embarrassing Spain and France. He is said to have pointed to France’s ban on the niqab or full Muslim face veil, and to Switzerland’s ban on minarets as signs of European difficulty in dealing with Muslims.

 

(Lieberman does not appear to understand the difference between banning the niqab, which is worn by almost no one in Europe, and keeping over 4 million human beings for decades in a condition of statelessness wherein they have no real human or civil rights.)

 

Lieberman, already angling for title of most corrupt politician in elective office in the world, now appears to be trying for the additional title of Worst Foreign Minister in the history of foreign ministers.

 

Spain and France, undeterred, continued their fact-finding mission in the region. France’s Bernard Kouchner even admitted that it may be necessary to go to the United Nations for a declaration on a Palestinian state.

 

From another side, Mahmoud Abbas told the Arab League summit this weekend at Sirte, Libya, that Israel has unilaterally abrogated the Oslo accords and other understandings it had reached with the Palestine Authority. It has stripped the Authority of much of its power, and makes daily incursions into PA territory.

 

Abbas raises the possibility that if the negotiations with Netanyahu continue to be frozen, he would go to the UN General Assembly with a plan for a unilateral declaration of a Palestinian state, to be blessed by the UNO.

 

The problem is that although the UN could give Palestine a seat as a nation, unless the Israeli army were induced to withdraw from the West Bank and to cease blockading Gaza (which is being economically strangled by an illegal and inhumane Israeli ban on civilian exports), the resulting “state” would remain a fantasy.

 

If NATO would agree to reassign the troops now beginning to withdraw from Afghanistan to Palestine, and would face down any Israeli intransigence, now that would be a plan.

 

But nothing so dramatic is likely to ensue. Fanatics like Lieberman have taken over Israel and they have no future in a Muslim Middle East that is now growing faster than Israel economically and which is likely to become more and more militarily and scientifically sophisticated. As Obama’s initiative for a two-state solution is thwarted by the Liebermans and Netanyahus, their actions guarantee that Israel’s future in coming decades is bleak. Unfortunately, the attendant trouble generated by that bleakness is likely to fall on the heads of all our children.

 

The go to guy :angry:

 

Cheers for the youtube link btw, I'll have a look at some point.

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I've not watched it, seemed appropriate to pass on though. C. Hitchens has written/talked extensively about Kissinger, he absolutely loathes him, did a book on him (The Trial Of Henry Kissinger) which is probably worth picking up as CH seems to be at his best when writing in a polemical style; his articles slating Ratzinger and the Vatican recently have been very lively.

 

 

"Lieberman, already angling for title of most corrupt politician in elective office in the world, now appears to be trying for the additional title of Worst Foreign Minister in the history of foreign ministers."

 

I'm sure he would have some stiff competition on those fronts.

Edited by Kevin S. Assilleekunt
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  • 3 months later...
Leaked documents released by al-Jazeera TV suggest Palestinian negotiators agreed to Israel keeping large parts of illegally occupied East Jerusalem.

 

The TV channel says it has thousands of confidential records covering the peace process between 2000 and 2010.

 

The papers also reportedly show Palestinian leaders proposing a joint committee to take over Jerusalem's holy sites of Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount.

 

The BBC has been unable to independently verify the documents.

 

Al-Jazeera says it has 16,076 confidential records of meetings, emails, communications between Palestinian, Israeli and US leaders.

 

The papers are believed to have leaked from the Palestinian side.

 

The alleged offers relating to East Jerusalem are the most controversial, as the issue has been a huge stumbling block in Mideast talks and both Israelis and Palestinians claim Jerusalem as their capital.

 

Israel has occupied the West Bank, including East Jerusalem, since 1967, settling close to 500,000 Jews in more than 100 settlements.

 

Increasing frustration

According to al-Jazeera, in May 2008, Ahmed Qureia, the lead Palestinian negotiator at the time, proposed that Israel annex all Jewish settlements in East Jerusalem except Har Homa (Jabal Abu Ghneim), in a bid to reach a final deal.

 

"This is the first time in history that we make such a proposition," he reportedly said, pointing out that this was a bigger concession than made at Camp David talks in 2000.

 

PLO leaders also privately suggested swapping part of the flashpoint East Jerusalem Arab neighbourhood of Sheikh Jarrah for land elsewhere, according to the leaked documents.

 

And Palestinian negotiators were reported to be willing to discuss limiting the number of Palestinian refugees returning to 100,000 over 10 years.

 

These are all highly sensitive issues and have previously been non-negotiable.

 

Current peace talks between Israel and the Palestinians have been suspended for months, ostensibly over Israel's refusal to stop building Jewish settlements on occupied Palestinian land.

 

The BBC's Wyre Davies, in Jerusalem, says that for years, the same Palestinian leaders have been talking with Israeli and American negotiators - but getting nowhere.

 

Our correspondent says there has been increasing frustration and protest among many Palestinians over what they see as Israeli expansion and the weakness of their own leaders - a view that will be reinforced by the leak of these documents.

 

The chief Palestinian negotiator, Saeb Erekat, who features in many of the leaked papers, appeared on Al Jazeera Arabic TV on Sunday to strenuously deny that he had made these sorts of offers.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-12263095

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Everything is negotiable in diplomacy - that's why they hold the meetings secretly

 

you have to give and take

 

if you don't all you are doing is setting out the ground rules for the next war

 

I'd have thought the Israelis would understand that by now

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The phrase "straw man in a wheelchair with learning difficulties" springs to mind

 

Would you say the same thing if Israel was a nation of homosexuals instead of Jews? Antisemitism rears its ugly head again. And before you mention anything about prejudice, I have already stated that my record of supporting gay rights is impeccable, having purchased every Right Said Fred album and even voted for Will Young on the X Factor, so don't even try me on that front, I can hold my head high, loud and proud.

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The phrase "straw man in a wheelchair with learning difficulties" springs to mind

 

Would you say the same thing if Israel was a nation of homosexuals instead of Jews? Antisemitism rears its ugly head again. And before you mention anything about prejudice, I have already stated that my record of supporting gay rights is impeccable, having purchased every Right Said Fred album and even voted for Will Young on the X Factor, so don't even try me on that front, I can hold my head high, loud and proud.

 

:blush:

 

And it basically is, Dana International is just the tip of the banana :lol:

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The phrase "straw man in a wheelchair with learning difficulties" springs to mind

 

http://www.sweet-david.com/

 

I swear you must be on commission from that place.

 

just showing you a website you might enjoy with some like minded souls dear

 

I'll pass, but thank you for sharing your life experience. :lol:

 

Nowt to do with me darling, I'll leave that sort of experience to the freaks.

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The phrase "straw man in a wheelchair with learning difficulties" springs to mind

 

http://www.sweet-david.com/

 

I swear you must be on commission from that place.

 

just showing you a website you might enjoy with some like minded souls dear

 

I'll pass, but thank you for sharing your life experience. :lol:

 

Nowt to do with me darling, I'll leave that sort of experience to the freaks.

 

I'm glad you've either bookmarked the URL or committed it to memory, though. You never know when it might come in "handy" one night. :blush:

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The phrase "straw man in a wheelchair with learning difficulties" springs to mind

 

http://www.sweet-david.com/

 

I swear you must be on commission from that place.

 

just showing you a website you might enjoy with some like minded souls dear

 

I'll pass, but thank you for sharing your life experience. :lol:

 

Nowt to do with me darling, I'll leave that sort of experience to the freaks.

 

I'm glad you've either bookmarked the URL or committed it to memory, though. You never know when it might come in "handy" one night. :blush:

 

I doubt it sweetie. You're obviously quite a bit of an expert yourself, with lots of experience.

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The phrase "straw man in a wheelchair with learning difficulties" springs to mind

 

http://www.sweet-david.com/

 

I swear you must be on commission from that place.

 

just showing you a website you might enjoy with some like minded souls dear

 

I'll pass, but thank you for sharing your life experience. :lol:

 

Nowt to do with me darling, I'll leave that sort of experience to the freaks.

 

I'm glad you've either bookmarked the URL or committed it to memory, though. You never know when it might come in "handy" one night. :blush:

 

I doubt it sweetie. You're obviously quite a bit of an expert yourself, with lots of experience.

 

I'm flattered. :icon_lol: Just for that, I'll PM you some links for when you get bored of David and his "special friends".

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The phrase "straw man in a wheelchair with learning difficulties" springs to mind

 

http://www.sweet-david.com/

 

I swear you must be on commission from that place.

 

just showing you a website you might enjoy with some like minded souls dear

 

I'll pass, but thank you for sharing your life experience. :lol:

 

Nowt to do with me darling, I'll leave that sort of experience to the freaks.

 

I'm glad you've either bookmarked the URL or committed it to memory, though. You never know when it might come in "handy" one night. :blush:

 

I doubt it sweetie. You're obviously quite a bit of an expert yourself, with lots of experience.

 

I'm flattered. :icon_lol: Just for that, I'll PM you some links for when you get bored of David and his "special friends".

 

nah lad, keep your helping hand for your own special friends.

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Papers reveal how Palestinian leaders gave up fight over refugees

• Negotiators agreed just 10,000 to return

• PLO agreed Israel could be a 'Jewish state'

• US suggested Palestinians live in Latin America

 

 

 

Palestinian refugees, who fled the besie Palestinian refugees, who fled the besieged camp of Nahr al-Bared in north Lebanon. Photograph: Ramzi Haidar/Getty

 

Palestinian negotiators privately agreed that only 10,000 refugees and their families, out of a total refugee population exceeding 5 million, could return to Israel as part of a peace settlement, leaked confidential documents reveal. PLO leaders also accepted Israel's demand to define itself as an explicitly Jewish state, in sharp contrast to their public position.

 

The latest disclosures from thousands of pages of secret Palestinian records of more than a decade of failed peace talks, obtained by al-Jazeera TV and shared exclusively with the Guardian, follow a day of shock and protests in the West Bank, where Palestinian Authority (PA) leaders angrily denounced the leaks as a "propaganda game". The documents have already become the focus of controversy among Israelis and Palestinians, revealing the scale of official Palestinian concessions rejected by Israel, but also throwing light on the huge imbalance of power in a peace process widely seen to have run into the sand.

 

The latest documents to be released reveal:

 

• The then Israeli foreign minister, Tzipi Livni, repeatedly pressed in 2007-08 for the "transfer" of some of Israel's own Arab citizens into a future Palestinian state as part of a land-swap deal that would exchange Palestinian villages now in Israel for Jewish settlements in the West Bank.

 

• The US secretary of state, Hillary Clinton, and other American officials refused to accept any Palestinian leadership other than that of Mahmoud Abbas and the prime minister, Salam Fayyad. The US "expects to see the same Palestinian faces", one senior official explained, if it was to continue funding the PA.

 

Condoleezza Rice, secretary of state under George Bush, suggested in 2008 Palestinian refugees could be resettled in South America. "Maybe we will be able to find countries that can contribute in kind," she said. "Chile, Argentina, etc." :blush::lol:

• Livni told Palestinian negotiators in 2007 that she was against international law and insisted that it could not be included in terms of reference for the talks: "I was the minister of justice", she said. "But I am against law – international law in particular."

 

The scale of the compromise secretly agreed on refugees will be controversial among Palestinians who see the flight or expulsion of refugees when Israel was created in 1948 as their catastrophe (nakba) – while most Israelis regard the Palestinian right of return as incompatible with a democratic Jewish state.

 

 

Condolizard the fucking witch.

Edited by Park Life
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