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Anyone else downloading or downloaded the beta? I'm downloading it just now. Not sure when I'll get round to putting it on though. :icon_lol:

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I've had the beta for about 2 weeks now and am running it on a seperate machine.

 

It looks and feels like Vista but then XP looked and felt like Windows Me but was considerably better. First impressions suggest the same with this.

 

It'll be the 'next' Windows O/S. Vista will die off pretty soon tbh.

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It's basically what Vista should have been.

 

Going to sting a lot of Vista buyers though as MS aren't going to be very interested in long-term (or even short-term) support for Vista when they've got a newer better OS to sell (I also wonder if they'll withhold DX11 from Vista to force migration again).

 

 

 

The really weird thing is Win7 looks incredibly like Linux running KDE 4.1 :icon_lol:

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It looks and feels like Vista but then XP looked and felt like Windows Me but was considerably better. First impressions suggest the same with this.

Win ME was, like Vista, released too soon and was basically a buggy cash cow (or wanted to be) that was eventually more or less made ok with enough patches, but ME was old tech compared to 2000 and then XP/2000SE.

 

Win7 is basically VistaSE or Vista done right (well with the first advances to a pay per use OS rip off like Win Live is intended to be).

 

A serious lesson in MS business policy for anyone that bought Vista, because basically you bought Win7 beta in Vista.

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I've been forced into running Vista64 for gaming/blu ray in the last two weeks (xp just didn't like my 4870x2... couldn't get it to run 3dapps properly at all cause of the hdtv)

 

Once the first week passed and i had vista tweaked and sorted out the way i like things, it's not to bad to be fair just took some getting used to.

Especially when you get rid of UAC fuck that took away a wild amount of irritation.

 

"Windows Mail" client is utter shite though

 

 

Vista is the new WinME though, it'll die soon as windows7 comes out

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Microsoft is accused by EU again

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The EU and Microsoft have clashed several times over the years

 

The European Commission has accused Microsoft of harming competition by bundling its Explorer web browser with its Windows operating system.

 

The commission said it had reached the preliminary view that the US software giant had undermined consumer choice and infringed EU rules.

 

Microsoft and the European Union have engaged in legal battles over competition issues for years.

 

Last year, the EU fined Microsoft 899m euros ($1.4bn; £680.9m).

 

Browser battle

 

In its statement on Friday the Commission said: "Microsoft's tying of Internet Explorer to the Windows operating system harms competition between web browsers, undermines product innovation and ultimately reduces consumer choice."

 

Microsoft that it was studying the commission's preliminary finding, and did not rule out requesting a formal hearing.

 

It has been given eight weeks to reply.

 

The US software firm controls the majority of the web-browsing market through its Explorer browser.

 

Analysts say the company has diversified enormously and is now no longer so reliant on its Windows operating system, with revenue coming from Xbox sales and server software.

 

In February 2008, the EU fined Microsoft 899m euros for defying sanctions imposed on it for anti-competitive behaviour.

 

The penalty - which was then one of the largest imposed by the European Commission - came after Microsoft failed to comply with an earlier 2004 ruling that it had abused its market position.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7834792.stm

 

:devil:

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If they didn't include IE with Windows, how would people get online to download Firefox?

That is pretty much the EU's point - although not in the way you are meaning.

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Seriously though, it has to come with a browser doesn't it. Why would it not be the microsoft one given that it's microsoft windows. Apple comes with safari too.

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Seriously though, it has to come with a browser doesn't it. Why would it not be the microsoft one given that it's microsoft windows. Apple comes with safari too.

 

That's the thing though, this is a post-IE monopoly point of view/reality, and it's the very crux of the issue; the utter dependence (seeming, if not actual) that MS has created.

 

Once upon a time it was viable to sell a browser :devil:, MS stopped that (although it still "sells" its browser - it is just incorporated into the OS price), which again goes back to monopoly exploitation.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

As to how you could download FF3 without having IE bundled?

 

Well there are a plethora of ways to get around that (from having FF3 etc. bundled with windows, to a linux live-CD, to a APT/YUM/urpmi style repository (or basically something that can download software via an internet connection that isn't actually a browser - it could probably be done currently with a few modifications to windows update :o).

 

But all of those options fail before they are born, because of Microsoft's abuse of its monopoly in the desktop OS market.

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I'm not sure of the stats but surely more people now are using alternative browsers than in the past? I don't think this is an issue.

 

Any one with any sense is now not using Internet Explorer (and probably for years now).

 

However that leaves a lot of people with no sense/that don't know better that are still using Internet Explorer..... still some 75% of the desktop market or so.

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I'm not sure of the stats but surely more people now are using alternative browsers than in the past? I don't think this is an issue.

 

Any one with any sense is now not using Internet Explorer (and probably for years now).

 

However that leaves a lot of people with no sense/that don't know better that are still using Internet Explorer..... still some 75% of the desktop market or so.

 

I was half way through replying there and realised that I don't care enough to bother formulating the argument but I assume you're just going to go into one of your anti-MS rants so please proceed.

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I'm not sure of the stats but surely more people now are using alternative browsers than in the past? I don't think this is an issue.

 

Any one with any sense is now not using Internet Explorer (and probably for years now).

 

However that leaves a lot of people with no sense/that don't know better that are still using Internet Explorer..... still some 75% of the desktop market or so.

 

I was half way through replying there and realised that I don't care enough to bother formulating the argument but I assume you're just going to go into one of your anti-MS rants so please proceed.

 

What argument? That IE still has the vast marketshare? They do. Or that anyone with any sense is using something else?

 

 

"anti-MS" :rolleyes: Is the EU "anti-MS"? Or just not wanting to let MS keep getting away with illegal practices?

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I'm not sure of the stats but surely more people now are using alternative browsers than in the past? I don't think this is an issue.

 

Any one with any sense is now not using Internet Explorer (and probably for years now).

 

However that leaves a lot of people with no sense/that don't know better that are still using Internet Explorer..... still some 75% of the desktop market or so.

 

some users simply dont have the option but to use ie. for example, me as a civil servant at work, even though i know better.

 

Theres zero chance of me at work being able to use an open source browser on an open source os. which is probably the point of the eu's recent action.

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I'm not sure of the stats but surely more people now are using alternative browsers than in the past? I don't think this is an issue.

 

Any one with any sense is now not using Internet Explorer (and probably for years now).

 

However that leaves a lot of people with no sense/that don't know better that are still using Internet Explorer..... still some 75% of the desktop market or so.

 

some users simply dont have the option but to use ie. for example, me as a civil servant at work, even though i know better.

 

Theres zero chance of me at work being able to use an open source browser on an open source os. which is probably the point of the eu's recent action.

 

Surely that was a decision made by your IT department rather than Microsoft?

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Downloading this now, going to see if I can put it on my partition that currently holds XP.

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I'm not sure of the stats but surely more people now are using alternative browsers than in the past? I don't think this is an issue.

 

Any one with any sense is now not using Internet Explorer (and probably for years now).

 

However that leaves a lot of people with no sense/that don't know better that are still using Internet Explorer..... still some 75% of the desktop market or so.

 

some users simply dont have the option but to use ie. for example, me as a civil servant at work, even though i know better.

 

Theres zero chance of me at work being able to use an open source browser on an open source os. which is probably the point of the eu's recent action.

 

Surely that was a decision made by your IT department rather than Microsoft?

 

Indeed it is - but at work i dont have a choice.

 

upon further thought - if there was a choice, would you as a taxpayer be happy with paying for 100k civil servants being retrained to use firefox and possibly open office and ubuntu? there would also be the additional cost of testing if all the benefit computer systems would work with linux, not to mention that the whole process of going opensource would probably take decades and be 12x over budget.

 

fops point was that everyone has a choice but some dont. and even if that choice was there - who would switch?

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