The Fish 8950 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 I don't think that's what CT was saying. Equally, I don't think he finds it 'sad' in any way. He was after a chomp, so it's mission accomplished. CT and/or Wolfy set out their bait and are pretty good at catching a Toontastic Fish to be fair to them. You're not wrong but there are times his wummery is insufferable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Definitely reacts better to carrot than stick. Creamed carrots with a butter dipping sauce, by the look of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 8950 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Creamed carrots with a butter dipping sauce, by the look of it. I reckon you could lose 1.5kg just by having a shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Me specifically? I reckon Man vs Food regularly drops 3 pound turds, so Ben Arfa is probably more than capable of dropping that sort of hardware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30251 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Me specifically? Pulling that face? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 8950 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Me specifically? I reckon Man vs Food regularly drops 3 pound turds, so Ben Arfa is probably more than capable of dropping that sort of hardware. Joking aside, you have to admit that while coming back over the expected weight is stupid, the punishment he's received is disproportionate. Fined, his rent not paid, training with the kids. It takes fuck all time to lose 1.5kg, especially for a professional sportsman so making him train with the kids and fining him is probably something to do with a disagreement with Pardew. Now, given Hatem is one of the most exciting players I've seen pull on the shirt in 30 odd years and Alan is a smarmy cunt, you'll forgive me if I give the player a little less of the responsibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 13812 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Alan Pardew talking about professionalism Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Joking aside, you have to admit that while coming back over the expected weight is stupid, the punishment he's received is disproportionate. Fined, his rent not paid, training with the kids. It takes fuck all time to lose 1.5kg, especially for a professional sportsman so making him train with the kids and fining him is probably something to do with a disagreement with Pardew. Now, given Hatem is one of the most exciting players I've seen pull on the shirt in 30 odd years and Alan is a smarmy cunt, you'll forgive me if I give the player a little less of the responsibility. The problem is that none of us know the full back story to this. The bloke has clearly turned up VERY overweight before, and has obviously had to be provided with a guideline weight, above which he knew he would be punished. And yet he's come back overweight again. And we can say it's ONLY 1.5kg, but if it's ONLY 1.5kg, why not just keep the weight off and do as you're told. Why should the club once again bend to accommodate the player who knew what the ask was of him. Also, I don't know what his fighting weight is, but it really matters what percentage 1.5kg is of the number he was given. Not 1.5kg just as a standalone figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 3997 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 I don't think that's what CT was saying. Equally, I don't think he finds it 'sad' in any way. He was after a chomp, so it's mission accomplished. Not at all good sir. Getting chomps regarding Ben Arfa on here is like shooting fish in a barrel. It's the picture added to all that's already been discussed above which I found quite sad. Regardless of my personal feeling regarding the player, it's not about getting match fit, it's about forcing him out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 10.5 stone or 67kg according to Wikipedia. So let's say he was told he could come back at 70kg and he decided that he'd rather come back at 71.5kg. So he's put on 50% more weight over the summer than the club gave the allowance for. Those are the terms you need to look at this under, not just "what's 1.5kg between friends?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26189 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 10.5 stone or 67kg according to Wikipedia. So let's say he was told he could come back at 70kg and he decided that he'd rather come back at 71.5kg. So he's put on 50% more weight over the summer than the club gave the allowance for. Those are the terms you need to look at this under, not just "what's 1.5kg between friends?" You're working on the assumption that he was told that he was allowed to put on weight over the summer. Given the pictures of him before and after I'd imagine that he was instructed to lose weight during the break and he has done, just not enough to meet his target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Possibly, but either way the point stands that the 1.5kg needs to be looked at as relative to a much lower number than his actual weight. If he's been told to lose weight and failed then it's almost more damning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChezGiven 0 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 I used to go and watch amateur boxing in Northern Paris, i had an Irish and Czech mate (yes yes) who used to fight in the leagues and it was often against north African lads from Tunisia and Morocco. They were always taking the piss out of each other for eating too many 'Merguez sausages' at home as the reason for lack of sharpness and having a few extra pounds on them. I reckon that's Ben Arfa's problem too, his mam's cous-cous is obviously far too tasty. That's not a euphemism before anyone starts. If we sell him to Lyon on exchange for Lacazette or Grenier it will be really sad to see him go but just about acceptable (Grenier is fuckin mint). Otherwise I hope they sort this out and he stays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACKANDWHITEGEORDIE 0 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 The situation between Ben Arfa and Pardew is not down to him being 'overweight'. It is that Hatem is prepared to stand up and tell Pradew that in the main his tactics are totally c**p and his coaching staff are well past their sell by date. A player with the ability of Ben Arfa can have very little to learn from the likes of Pardew, Carver and Stone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 19739 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 muscle weighs more than fat. you can see from the picture posted a few pages back that he is in good shape. there is another issue, off-field i suspect, that explains why the club are trying to force him out. reminds me of the kevin pietersen situation for england. we don't know the full story. ben arfa might be a cunt, his manager and team mates might hate him, but he's potentially our best player and should be managed accordingly. you don't give up on talent like that. you find a way of managing him, motivating him and getting him playing to his best capabilities. not something i reckon pardew is capable of. i can't imagine keegan or sir bobby ever giving up on a player with such natural talent. they both would have put an arm round his shoudler, told him how good he is and got the best out of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26189 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Possibly, but either way the point stands that the 1.5kg needs to be looked at as relative to a much lower number than his actual weight. If he's been told to lose weight and failed then it's almost more damning. He's claiming that it's muscle isn't he? Perhaps a body fat target might have been a better choice. Either way it all seems very petty. And I'm one who has been a critic of Ben Arfa's attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 He's claiming that it's muscle isn't he? Perhaps a body fat target might have been a better choice. Either way it all seems very petty. And I'm one who has been a critic of Ben Arfa's attitude. Aye but so is ClubSpinDoctor in the How Tall Are You... Thread, and they're both full of shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 The situation between Ben Arfa and Pardew is not down to him being 'overweight'. It is that Hatem is prepared to stand up and tell Pradew that in the main his tactics are totally c**p and his coaching staff are well past their sell by date. A player with the ability of Ben Arfa can have very little to learn from the likes of Pardew, Carver and Stone. It's not his weight that's the problem it's his lack of professionalism and vocal lack of respect for the manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Robson and Keegan were both exceptional man managers and romantics, so they would have loved a project like Ben Arfa. Alex Ferguson, also an excellent man manager, would have fucked him off ages ago. The point is not to compare Pardew to the above (there's none to be made), but to point out, contrary to prevailing forum opinion, that it's not just Pardew that would have given up on this lad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 (edited) Sorry but you don't have the record that Ferguson has without being an exceptional man manager. That doesn't mean he's never going to get rid of players or that he'll be able to mould every individual to his will, obviously that's impossible. It's his way or the highway, but he gets an awful lot of players to agree on his way. That's man management. Edited August 5, 2014 by Gemmill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34185 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 McGrath was a functioning alcoholic, he wasn't a bit difficult. Beckham had allowed his public persons to overtake his function as a footballer. These are exceptional cases. If you think he hasn't overcome challenges with the players that he's had at that club down the years, you're not thinking right. The point is that we don't get to hear a lot about most of them because he handles it. The ones that we hear about, we hear about because he gets shot of them. This is another argument really, but it's absolutely crazy to look at Ferguson's record and say that he's the exact opposite of a good man manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew 4183 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 It's his way or the highway, but he gets an awful lot of players to agree on his way. That's man management. Easy enough when you can guarantee medals and success, he had no need to man manage after a point, his record at Manchester United did it for him, it wouldn't work at a lesser club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aimaad22 3419 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 We may not know whats happened behind the scenes but it seems as though Ben Arfa probably fell out with Pardew sometime during the latter part of last season, probably over tactics and his role in the team, and the weight thing is being used as an excuse to herd him out. Its petty but just like NUFC. Reconcile your differences and get him back in the setup. Otherwise have a quite word with him one professional to another and find him another club so both parties can move on.What's happening right now is just plain silly and helping noone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonasjuice 0 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 Lack of professionalism could mean lots of things. Maybe he doesn't take training seriously enough. Maybe he doesn't follow tactical instructions. With the weight thing, if he's already been warned about his professionalism/fitness, then it's going to be a bigger deal than if it was an isolated incident. Like being 30 minutes late for work after being repeatedly warned about your timekeeping versus a model employee having an off-day. And it's all very well saying you have to make exceptions for particular talents, but it hardly inspires the rest of the team to work as hard as possible if you see someone be allowed more leeway than others. Sometimes you have to set an example to keep everyone else working hard. Having said that none of us have actually any idea what goes on behind the scenes so it's all just speculation, and I think most of us can agree that we wish he'd be in the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 19739 Posted August 5, 2014 Share Posted August 5, 2014 It's not his weight that's the problem it's his lack of professionalism and vocal lack of respect for the manager. can't blame him him for the latter tbh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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