LeazesMag 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Author Share Posted January 8, 2006 It's actually amazing reading LM's posts when you point out the basic facts to him that Shepherd has appointed Souness and Shepherd is standing by Souness, and yet when you say "So....Shepherd....does he have to share ANY of the blame for the current situation?". "Nope. All Souness's fault" Unbelievable. LM, you keep saying it's Souness who decides what players come in, and when he brings in a bad one, he gets both barrels - it's all his fault, and none of it is Shepherd's. By the same token, it's Shepherd who decides what manager comes in, and how long that manager then gets to do the job. How does he not then get the blame in the same way that Souness does? And it's no use saying "he's only made one mistake", given how BIG a mistake you keep telling us it's been. 76078[/snapback] i think it's not half so amazing as you not being able to admit you thought Souness would be a success, and got it wrong Gem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howaythelads 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Course our chairman makes no input whatsoever and the comments about the specific player that he makes to the press are naturally bullshit.... 76028[/snapback] What's that supposed to mean? Just answer a question, it's pretty easy. Who identifies the players to bring to the club in order to build a team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Author Share Posted January 8, 2006 Question for Craig etc If Shepherd appoints Hiddink or Hitzfeld you will be pleased, no doubt. If they fail however, will you still say, or then say, it was a bad appointment or FS is a shit chairman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howaythelads 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 (edited) I haven't come across anybody, anywhere, who hasn't acknowledged the mistake by FS in the appointment of Souness. Craig, why do you keep banging on as though nobody is admitting this? The responsiblity for team affairs belongs with the manager. It is the manager who either gets it right or gets it wrong. Souness has got it wrong all on his own, the responsibility is his. As said above, FS fcuked up by appointing him. So what now, Craig? Why does this make FS responsible for all of the duff decisions made by the manager? How would people react if FS appointed a manager, but then it became known he stuck his nose into everything going on, and wouldn't allow the manager to actually manage? That would make him a really shit Chairman in my eyes. Q. Have we ever had a decent team with FS as Chairman? Edited January 8, 2006 by Howaythelads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adios 717 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Question for Craig etc If Shepherd appoints Hiddink or Hitzfeld you will be pleased, no doubt. If they fail however, will you still say, or then say, it was a bad appointment or FS is a shit chairman 76121[/snapback] You know that's different, look at their pedigree, the same reason we can't blame him for Dalglish. I was looking at the comments made on the backup board last week from when Souness came in and a quote from a Blackburn forum had been posted, it was basically word for word what Souness has done to us. He could have got the same info from any number of club's supporters, you for example. I support Freddie but it was his job to know what Souness was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howaythelads 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 (edited) Question for Craig etc If Shepherd appoints Hiddink or Hitzfeld you will be pleased, no doubt. If they fail however, will you still say, or then say, it was a bad appointment or FS is a shit chairman 76121[/snapback] You know that's different, look at their pedigree, the same reason we can't blame him for Dalglish. I was looking at the comments made on the backup board last week from when Souness came in and a quote from a Blackburn forum had been posted, it was basically word for word what Souness has done to us. He could have got the same info from any number of club's supporters, you for example. I support Freddie but it was his job to know what Souness was. 76132[/snapback] Aye, and FS made a mistake which has been acknowledged by everybody. Having appointed a manager the role of FS is to support the manager, he has to allow any manager to actually manage. Nobody should want a Chairman to interfere with decisions regarding who is brought in and who leaves the club, that's the role of the manager. When Souness is eventually sacked ( too late, which is another FS mistake ) he will fall back on excuse after excuse, interference from a Chairman would be a good one if he could use it. He won't be able to though, because the team and personnel decisions have all been his own. Edited January 8, 2006 by Howaythelads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 8870 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 (edited) Aye, and FS made a mistake which has been acknowledged by everybody. Having appointed a manager the role of FS is to support the manager, he has to allow any manager to actually manage. Nobody should want a Chairman to interfere with decisions regarding who is brought in and who leaves the club, that's the role of the manager. When Souness is eventually sacked ( too late, which is another FS mistake ) he will fall back on excuse after excuse, interference from a Chairman would be a good one if he could use it. He won't be able to though, because the team and personnel decisions have all been his own. 76136[/snapback] I don't agree with the 'not interfering' bit. I do think FS does back his managers, but also wants to have too much of a word to say in dealing with the team himself. That is at least how I understand some remarks from Bobby Robson. I think businesswise FS is probably not as bad as often is made out (though I am a bit sceptical about some things). But in my opinion it would certainly be better if Shepherd would concentrate on these things and let managers run the team affairs and also be a bit more media shy. Edited January 8, 2006 by Isegrim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adios 717 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 I don't agree with the 'not interfering' bit. I do think FS does back his managers, but also wants to have too much of a word to say in dealing with the team himself. That is at least how I understand some remarks from Bobby Robson. I think businesswise FS is probably not as bad as often is made out (though I am a bit sceptical about some things). But in my opinion it would certainly be better if Shepherd would concentrate on these things and let managers run the team affairs and also be a bit more media shy. 76140[/snapback] My impression from Bobby's autobiography was that FS did not interfere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 8870 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 (edited) I don't agree with the 'not interfering' bit. I do think FS does back his managers, but also wants to have too much of a word to say in dealing with the team himself. That is at least how I understand some remarks from Bobby Robson. I think businesswise FS is probably not as bad as often is made out (though I am a bit sceptical about some things). But in my opinion it would certainly be better if Shepherd would concentrate on these things and let managers run the team affairs and also be a bit more media shy. 76140[/snapback] My impression from Bobby's autobiography was that FS did not interfere. 76141[/snapback] Oops, then please ignore me. I just went by what I gathered via the media as I only have the old edition that doesn't involve his time at Newcastle. Edited January 8, 2006 by Isegrim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adios 717 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Oops, then please ignore me. I just went by what I gathered via the media as I only have the old edition that doesn't involve his Newcastle stint. 76142[/snapback] I could be wrong, I'm sure there's a bot in it where he specifically talks about people thinking Butt, Kluivert et al were FS purchases and he emphatically denies it. I have got an awful memory though. I can see it it on the bookshelf, if I could bother be bothered to get off my fat arse and find the quote! I think FS is a fantastic Chairman from a business point of view, as well, very few better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Author Share Posted January 8, 2006 Question for Craig etc If Shepherd appoints Hiddink or Hitzfeld you will be pleased, no doubt. If they fail however, will you still say, or then say, it was a bad appointment or FS is a shit chairman 76121[/snapback] You know that's different, look at their pedigree, the same reason we can't blame him for Dalglish. precisely my point. Hw's only made one appointment the majority were unhappy with, although those who said "give him tme" must have been, by defnition I was looking at the comments made on the backup board last week from when Souness came in and a quote from a Blackburn forum had been posted, it was basically word for word what Souness has done to us. He could have got the same info from any number of club's supporters, you for example. I support Freddie but it was his job to know what Souness was. 76132[/snapback] of course, the comments the Blackbun fans made echo the comments those who correctly had serious reservations about Souness But FS presumably appointed him to clear out the "bad eggs", a point which I disagreed with, but the Souness backers did/do agree with, meaning they supported Freddies decision, so there is little point in slagging him off now when they agreed with him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34422 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 It's actually amazing reading LM's posts when you point out the basic facts to him that Shepherd has appointed Souness and Shepherd is standing by Souness, and yet when you say "So....Shepherd....does he have to share ANY of the blame for the current situation?". "Nope. All Souness's fault" Unbelievable. LM, you keep saying it's Souness who decides what players come in, and when he brings in a bad one, he gets both barrels - it's all his fault, and none of it is Shepherd's. By the same token, it's Shepherd who decides what manager comes in, and how long that manager then gets to do the job. How does he not then get the blame in the same way that Souness does? And it's no use saying "he's only made one mistake", given how BIG a mistake you keep telling us it's been. 76078[/snapback] i think it's not half so amazing as you not being able to admit you thought Souness would be a success, and got it wrong Gem 76119[/snapback] To coin a phrase dear to your heart: answer the question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Author Share Posted January 8, 2006 It's actually amazing reading LM's posts when you point out the basic facts to him that Shepherd has appointed Souness and Shepherd is standing by Souness, and yet when you say "So....Shepherd....does he have to share ANY of the blame for the current situation?". "Nope. All Souness's fault" Unbelievable. LM, you keep saying it's Souness who decides what players come in, and when he brings in a bad one, he gets both barrels - it's all his fault, and none of it is Shepherd's. By the same token, it's Shepherd who decides what manager comes in, and how long that manager then gets to do the job. How does he not then get the blame in the same way that Souness does? And it's no use saying "he's only made one mistake", given how BIG a mistake you keep telling us it's been. 76078[/snapback] i think it's not half so amazing as you not being able to admit you thought Souness would be a success, and got it wrong Gem 76119[/snapback] To coin a phrase dear to your heart: answer the question. 76189[/snapback] Aside from the fact I have clearly said Shepherd appointed the wrong man [which i've said since September 2004] I haven't a clue what you are on about Gem. If you mean to imply a question along the lines of should Shepherd resign because he's made one bad appointment, my answer to that is quite clear too, but I'll spell it out for you anyway. No, not for one bad appointment that I knew would fail. I can say that, because I criticed FS at the time, however you can't because you agreed with him that Souness would be a success. Now, having backed Souness to be successful, do you now accept you were wrong ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Does anyone else get the feeling that Souness is in a job PURELY because nobody else actually wants it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Author Share Posted January 8, 2006 Does anyone else get the feeling that Souness is in a job PURELY because nobody else actually wants it? 76281[/snapback] wouldn't you like it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 8870 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Does anyone else get the feeling that Souness is in a job PURELY because nobody else actually wants it? 76281[/snapback] As I said in other threads (and on other forums), I think it would become more attractive if the tosser wasn't in charge anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Author Share Posted January 8, 2006 Does anyone else get the feeling that Souness is in a job PURELY because nobody else actually wants it? 76281[/snapback] As I said in other threads (and on other forums), I think it would become more attractive if the tosser wasn't in charge anymore. 76294[/snapback] it will stop anyone who really fancies our job not to go somewhere else if they can see it is available and we are looking Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Southern Mag 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Now, having backed Souness to be successful, do you now accept you were wrong ? 76226[/snapback] I actually thought Souness, although not an exciting appointment, was more shrewd than it appeared at the time. I thought he might just be the right man at the right time. I have since changed my opinion and fear he has not done enough with the rest of the squad, nor got the team playing with any sort of plan or cohesion. Yes he's had some bad luck with injuries, but I believe a good coach (Curbishley springs to mind) manages to get a team playing better football with far fewer resources. I'm man enough to admit I was wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6302 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Question for Craig etc If Shepherd appoints Hiddink or Hitzfeld you will be pleased, no doubt. If they fail however, will you still say, or then say, it was a bad appointment or FS is a shit chairman 76121[/snapback] As I have said in many previous posts, I won't have an opinion of them either way until they've proved themselves one way or another after some time at the club... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Author Share Posted January 8, 2006 Question for Craig etc If Shepherd appoints Hiddink or Hitzfeld you will be pleased, no doubt. If they fail however, will you still say, or then say, it was a bad appointment or FS is a shit chairman 76121[/snapback] As I have said in many previous posts, I won't have an opinion of them either way until they've proved themselves one way or another after some time at the club... 76358[/snapback] so you want it both ways.....you really have no right to criticise mate if you only use hindsight, anyone can do that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6302 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Course our chairman makes no input whatsoever and the comments about the specific player that he makes to the press are naturally bullshit.... 76028[/snapback] What's that supposed to mean? Just answer a question, it's pretty easy. Who identifies the players to bring to the club in order to build a team? 76120[/snapback] The scouts! OK, pedency apart, it's Souness, but then I've never disputed that! Answer this simple one then in return: Who has the final say-so by slapping his signature on the cheque and has the power to say "not on your life am I buying that piece of shit!"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6302 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 I haven't come across anybody, anywhere, who hasn't acknowledged the mistake by FS in the appointment of Souness. Craig, why do you keep banging on as though nobody is admitting this? The responsiblity for team affairs belongs with the manager. It is the manager who either gets it right or gets it wrong. Souness has got it wrong all on his own, the responsibility is his. As said above, FS fcuked up by appointing him. So what now, Craig? Why does this make FS responsible for all of the duff decisions made by the manager? How would people react if FS appointed a manager, but then it became known he stuck his nose into everything going on, and wouldn't allow the manager to actually manage? That would make him a really shit Chairman in my eyes. Q. Have we ever had a decent team with FS as Chairman? 76129[/snapback] Certain people won't have a wrong word said about Shepherd - never said it was you.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6302 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Question for Craig etc If Shepherd appoints Hiddink or Hitzfeld you will be pleased, no doubt. If they fail however, will you still say, or then say, it was a bad appointment or FS is a shit chairman 76121[/snapback] As I have said in many previous posts, I won't have an opinion of them either way until they've proved themselves one way or another after some time at the club... 76358[/snapback] so you want it both ways.....you really have no right to criticise mate if you only use hindsight, anyone can do that 76360[/snapback] You seem to think that my only problem with Shepherd is the appointment of Souness - wrong! That's your view... I've pointed out his other failings many times in recent weeks - not going there again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howaythelads 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 Course our chairman makes no input whatsoever and the comments about the specific player that he makes to the press are naturally bullshit.... 76028[/snapback] What's that supposed to mean? Just answer a question, it's pretty easy. Who identifies the players to bring to the club in order to build a team? 76120[/snapback] The scouts! OK, pedency apart, it's Souness, but then I've never disputed that! Answer this simple one then in return: Who has the final say-so by slapping his signature on the cheque and has the power to say "not on your life am I buying that piece of shit!"? 76361[/snapback] This is something a manager would say should a club have a Chairman who is involved in team affairs when he shouldn't be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howaythelads 0 Posted January 8, 2006 Share Posted January 8, 2006 I haven't come across anybody, anywhere, who hasn't acknowledged the mistake by FS in the appointment of Souness. Craig, why do you keep banging on as though nobody is admitting this? The responsiblity for team affairs belongs with the manager. It is the manager who either gets it right or gets it wrong. Souness has got it wrong all on his own, the responsibility is his. As said above, FS fcuked up by appointing him. So what now, Craig? Why does this make FS responsible for all of the duff decisions made by the manager? How would people react if FS appointed a manager, but then it became known he stuck his nose into everything going on, and wouldn't allow the manager to actually manage? That would make him a really shit Chairman in my eyes. Q. Have we ever had a decent team with FS as Chairman? 76129[/snapback] Certain people won't have a wrong word said about Shepherd - never said it was you.... 76362[/snapback] Struggling, I see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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