Alex 30239 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Part of the establishment that delivered us Trump and Brexit tbh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 4949 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Part of the establishment that delivered us Trump and Brexit tbh You joke but I am resolute in my belief that the establishment did indeed deliver us those things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 19735 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 The great unwashed delivered those things tbf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 4949 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 The great unwashed delivered those things tbf Who do you blame? The people in power or the people who they failed? It's a tough one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30239 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 The great unwashed delivered those things tbf That sort of attitude is part of why those things happened Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 19735 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 The people in power failed too, don't get us wrong. Voters at the ballot box delivered it though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 19735 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 That sort of attitude is part of why those things happened No you're right, plenty of Middle England wankers deserve some stick too. As well as a few poshos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30239 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 No you're right, plenty of Middle England wankers deserve some stick too. As well as a few poshos It was one posh cunt's reckless politcal gamble that made it even a remote possibility. He's done with public service now though, bless him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 19735 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 It was always a danger that the electorate would be stupid enough to vote against the country's interest, so perhaps the ultimate blame lies with Cameron, who basically gambled our future away on the back of a popularity contest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 4949 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 I absolutely do blame Cameron for this tbf. For the referendum, for austerity, for all of it. He is the personification of side of the establishment that brought us here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30239 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Basically, yeah. If it was so much in the country's interests to stay in the EU (as he argued) then it wasn't something that should be decided by a plebiscite. Especially on a complex issue that most laymen couldn't really get their heads around and even more so on an emotive subject. The timing of it was fucking awful too. Brilliant stuff all round from the best PM in the world eva Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toonotl 2406 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 Studies show that evidence opposing ideologically held views will entrench or even strengthen misconceptions people might hold... http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Backfire_effect Yep. I wouldn't say I'm a victim of this effect (as I think about my positions a lot), but I've certainly seen it in action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toonotl 2406 Posted December 20, 2016 Share Posted December 20, 2016 I'd hate to think I've ever been less than civilised or reasonable To be fair it is mostly me being the arsehole. See above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted December 23, 2016 Share Posted December 23, 2016 https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/dec/23/british-policy-syria-former-ambassador-peter-ford Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 4949 Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 Grim stuff - in the first 5 years of the civil war, Assad hanged up to 13,000 people in secret: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/feb/07/up-to-13000-secretly-hanged-in-syrian-jail-says-amnesty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 19735 Posted February 7, 2017 Share Posted February 7, 2017 Lovely chap Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 17603 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 (edited) So, listening to the radio this morning and two former diplomats were interviewed, one US and one Russian. They were both of the opinion that war between the US and Russia is now a real possibility due to the personalities of the two "alpha male" dickheads in charge of the respective countries. This is becoming eerily reminiscent of the cause of the nuclear war in that horrific 1980s film "Threads". Makes me laugh people thinking Trump would be a more stabilising and less hawkish leader than Clinton. In all seriousness, who is more likely to trigger WW3? I've said it before, but maybe you have to have been alive during the cold war to appreciate the risks involved. Somehow I don't think neoliberalism will be such a concern when the world is reduced to a apocalyptic waste ground. Edited April 12, 2017 by Renton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 19735 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 small willy syndrome tbh. maggot cocks aren't much use when it comes to waving Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30239 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 I blame the centrists. And the MSM. And the SJWs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 17603 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 (edited) It's canny simple to me. Let's say the chance of WW3 in the next 5 years was 0.01% under Clinton. Let's be optimistic and say it's 1% under Trump. Given the consequences, why the fuck would anyone take the increase in risk? Of course, my fatal mistake here is listening to so called experts spouting fake news. Edited April 12, 2017 by Renton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 13959 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 (It's an obvious meme, but I do enjoy it. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 (edited) It's not Trump it's the neo-cons. Most of which he brought into his administration. I doubt he's even had a proper discussion on Syria or really knows what's going on. No matter who's in charge Balkanisation of the Middle east is the goal. What I am annoyed about is that he's gone against his non-interventionist post election rhetoric and played straight into the hands of the Chicken Hawks. Edited April 12, 2017 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 4949 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 It's canny simple to me. Let's say the chance of WW3 in the next 5 years was 0.01% under Clinton. Let's be optimistic and say it's 1% under Trump. Given the consequences, why the fuck would anyone take the increase in risk? Of course, my fatal mistake here US listening to so called experts spouting fake news. Given everything Clinton has said about putting Russia back in their box, I just don't think that's a supportable statement. You're basing this entirely on your 'feeling' that Trump is more likely to take us to war. To say again, as I note it has been entirely unanswered previously, as usual, Trump's response in Syria was less severe than what Clinton was calling for. Which was for all of his airbases to be destroyed. How do you think Russia would have responded to that, exactly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 17603 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 It's not Trump it's the neo-cons. Most of which he brought into his administration. So it is Trump then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted April 12, 2017 Share Posted April 12, 2017 Clinton would have been busy with brinkmanship and no fly zones from the get go. Both as bad as each other. McCain and the like seem to think Russia will back down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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