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We're in for at least 10 years of Tory rule if the people whose viewpoints Tom aligns with and the people whose viewpoints ewerk aligns with, can't meet in the middle.

 

We need very similar policies next time out albeit more focused and less scattergun, and a flourish of patriotic zeal for the weak minded, along with media savvy.

 

We need to be a moderate left wing party that is slick and ruthless.

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34 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

We're in for at least 10 years of Tory rule if the people whose viewpoints Tom aligns with and the people whose viewpoints ewerk aligns with, can't meet in the middle.

And just what are my viewpoints?

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18 hours ago, Rayvin said:

I don't care if Farage gets to become a bit more powerful because in the end, none of the other parties will agree to his more radical desires. The point will be that Labour and the Tories will need to occasionally work together.

From my experience in Australia, which has PR in the Senate, and which has just elected a right wing evangelical PM who won the unwinnable election against a deeply unpopular (with the people, but not with the unions) leader, PR results in pandering to the extremists, not cooperation in the middle.  

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Lad at work on Friday said he voted Tory.  Lives on the edge of a deprived area.  He's a good lad (despite voting for them cunts) and works hard.

I was stunned when he told me he voted Tory as he had health issues and same with his wife.  He tried to get a GPs appointment last month and was told it would be 2 weeks.  I tried telling him Friday that is gonna get worse under these cunts.

 

Last night his old man was taken into hospital, he's just come back off holiday and has a virus, had serious shits and vomiting and kept passing out.  Went to A&E and had to wait 9 hours apparently.  He said he was shocked why it was so busy on a Monday and why there were so many trolleys out in the waiting area.

 

Yet he voted Tory

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It’s difficult to have much sympathy when you think about how highly publicised the problems with the NHS are. Shame it’s also shitting on people who aren’t to blame. When you look at the figures though it’s the over 45s who’ve shit on everyone else. Obviously it’s more nuanced than that but the older generations were very pro Brexit and anti-Corbyn. 

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As I was saying yesterday people are so used to problems with the NHS to a degree they sort of accept it and think it's too costly or too much effort to change. When I try and tell them that waiting lists were all but abolished under Blair they think it's bullshit. 

 

(Yes on certain issues they did really well, as I've said I just think they accepted the status quo on things like housing and privatisation as well) 

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11 minutes ago, Alex said:

It’s difficult to have much sympathy when you think about how highly publicised the problems with the NHS are. Shame it’s also shitting on people who aren’t to blame. When you look at the figures though it’s the over 45s who’ve shit on everyone else. Obviously it’s more nuanced than that but the older generations were very pro Brexit and anti-Corbyn. 

 

Aye. YouGov had 66% of over 65s saying they would be "dismayed" if Corbyn became PM. :ph34r:

 

This is the 1981-2011 trend and it goes some way to explaining the places that have switched. If Labour wants them back again, it's not just about getting jobs and opportunities back into these places, but also the kind of cultural and leisure and other options that will stop quite so many younger people from leaving for cities.

 

 

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15 hours ago, Meenzer said:

I thought this thread was clearly articulated & worth a read 

 

 

No one liked it when I posted it earlier in the thread. Anti MSM bias on here 

Edited by Dr Gloom
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1 hour ago, wykikitoon said:

Lad at work on Friday said he voted Tory.  Lives on the edge of a deprived area.  He's a good lad (despite voting for them cunts) and works hard.

I was stunned when he told me he voted Tory as he had health issues and same with his wife.  He tried to get a GPs appointment last month and was told it would be 2 weeks.  I tried telling him Friday that is gonna get worse under these cunts.

 

Last night his old man was taken into hospital, he's just come back off holiday and has a virus, had serious shits and vomiting and kept passing out.  Went to A&E and had to wait 9 hours apparently.  He said he was shocked why it was so busy on a Monday and why there were so many trolleys out in the waiting area.

 

Yet he voted Tory

Were his health issues dementia?

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6 hours ago, RobinRobin said:

From my experience in Australia, which has PR in the Senate, and which has just elected a right wing evangelical PM who won the unwinnable election against a deeply unpopular (with the people, but not with the unions) leader, PR results in pandering to the extremists, not cooperation in the middle.  

 

Well idk man, we tend to always have a progressive majority in this country that is suppressed by FPTP. Maybe Australia is just full of right wingers.

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3 hours ago, Alex said:

It’s difficult to have much sympathy when you think about how highly publicised the problems with the NHS are. Shame it’s also shitting on people who aren’t to blame. When you look at the figures though it’s the over 45s who’ve shit on everyone else. Obviously it’s more nuanced than that but the older generations were very pro Brexit and anti-Corbyn. 

 

Yeah, thats quite clear. I've been thinking about this over the past few days. Do you think the older generation are led by the media (i mean my mother only gets her information from red tops or other elderly friends) or do you think they are inherently racist or to put politely pro-uk. Perhaps they even see it has even hording everything they have worked for over the years as they perceive a socialist gov is going to take everything they have worked for.

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2 hours ago, Rayvin said:

 

 Something something centrism something something.

You haven’t been paying attention then. I said several times that other than the nationalisation pledge that the Labour manifesto was pretty decent. So Tom and my viewpoints aren’t that far apart on the issues.

The problem with the article he linked to was clearly the cult of Corbyn.

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1 hour ago, ewerk said:

You haven’t been paying attention then. I said several times that other than the nationalisation pledge that the Labour manifesto was pretty decent. So Tom and my viewpoints aren’t that far apart on the issues.

The problem with the article he linked to was clearly the cult of Corbyn.

 

;)

 

Wasn't serious mate. I read your posts, I know more or less what you're about.

 

All I really mean is we need to stick together and not polarise.

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1 hour ago, Holden McGroin said:

 

Yeah, thats quite clear. I've been thinking about this over the past few days. Do you think the older generation are led by the media (i mean my mother only gets her information from red tops or other elderly friends) or do you think they are inherently racist or to put politely pro-uk. Perhaps they even see it has even hording everything they have worked for over the years as they perceive a socialist gov is going to take everything they have worked for.

I read something about a lot of older voters thinking they paid into a system which extends beyond tax and NI - they've stayed patriotic and quiet, saluted the Queen and the flag and now feel they're entitled to keep what they have and more so expect deferential treatment when it comes to health and care - especially over non-Whites. Hence the GP surgeries full of foreigners trope. I think this is an extreme view but one where I see elements being true. These are the people who supposedly reacted most strongly to Corbyn. 

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4 hours ago, Holden McGroin said:

 

Yeah, thats quite clear. I've been thinking about this over the past few days. Do you think the older generation are led by the media (i mean my mother only gets her information from red tops or other elderly friends) or do you think they are inherently racist or to put politely pro-uk. Perhaps they even see it has even hording everything they have worked for over the years as they perceive a socialist gov is going to take everything they have worked for.

All of those things to a large extent 

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