The Fish 8986 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 Careful... It was deliberate. I should use smileys more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26273 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 (edited) I'm one of the IRA supporting bog trotters. Nice to meet you again. Edited October 21, 2014 by ewerk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mincepie 0 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 I don't believe raising the retirement age was the deciding factor in the reduction of jobs for young people. I think raising the retirement age is a ham fisted attempt to deal with the shortfall in pensions. Now, are you going to answer my question? It probably was. But young people are now going to university because there is nowhere else for them to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mincepie 0 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 I'm one of the IRA supporting bog trotters. Nice to meet you again. You think you have met me? I don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 8986 Posted October 21, 2014 Share Posted October 21, 2014 It probably was. But young people are now going to university because there is nowhere else for them to go. You're discounting the global crash, the change in the job markets, the various governments and putting the lack of jobs purely on the retirement age rising? Then adding that kids are going to university because they've nowhere else to go? Even though (among many other reasons) Uni is no longer as cheap as it once was for school leavers, the huge push on apprenticeships and that the armed forces still exist as an option? Be honest, you're pulling my leg, aren't you? Also how are you paying for all these extra retired people? Given the Right won't tax the fuckers who could swell the country's coffers and the ones they're happy to tax can't afford it. It's not simple, it's hugely complicated and simply lowering the age of retirement wouldn't suddenly create job for young people, just like banning burkas won't stop the extremists you seem so affected by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I notice no one is offerinbg to pay more tax to fund all this extra expenditure..................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30370 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 It probably was. But young people are now going to university because there is nowhere else for them to go. Less kids are going to uni since the financial crisis began because they can't afford to take on the debt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Dynamite 5900 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I'm not going to disagree that most NHS staff have been fucked over in recent years. It's just that the story has been framed as the government denying NHS staff a 1% rise while lining their own pockets. My understanding is that what they've proposed is a fairer deal where those who are in line for automatic increments aren't getting the 1% on top of that. Either way it's still a shit deal for all involved. They haven't proposed anything other than bumping the pay freeze up to 5 years now. Increments are a part of many professions, nursing, medicine, police etc. they were agreed years ago and in no way count towards cost of living increases. Once I finish my independent prescribing I will be diagnosing and prescribing as a lone worker, for £26500 pa. It's ludicrous. I work with band 3s who make more than that with a bit of overtime chucked in Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 3976 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I notice no one is offerinbg to pay more tax to fund all this extra expenditure.....................A one-off 20% levy on all non-property based wealth over a million would be a start. Would need global action but I'd also confiscate all offshore accounts - all either dodgy, tax-evaded or un-needed imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 8986 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I notice no one is offerinbg to pay more tax to fund all this extra expenditure..................... I think the fairest way, is to tighten the existing tax codes and laws. If the UK collected all the tax it was due the whole country would be better off. However the top 1% don't want to pay anything, the next lot want to pay as little as possible because "all of it goes on wasters" instead of on them, then the rest of the country has to pick up the financial slack. I know it's unlikely (if not impossible), but if America, China, Russia, & the EU could get the collective act together and make it impossible for corporations and independently wealthy individuals to sidestep the tax they owe, we'd all be immeasurably better off. Right leaners will tell you that if this were to happen those companies and individuals would fuck off elsewhere, but they just frankly wouldn't. Microsoft isn't going to up sticks from the US to Uganda just because they'd save a few 100 million in tax (or whatever), there's more to it than that. Mike Ashley will be doing everything he can to dodge the tax he and his company owes, he's not going to emigrate to Paraguay, is he. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26273 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Isn't that exactly what they have been doing though? Tax havens are now having to disclose details of accounts held there, the UK and EU are cracking down on companies nominally headquartering themselves in countries with lower tax rates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 8986 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Isn't that exactly what they have been doing though? Tax havens are now having to disclose details of accounts held there, the UK and EU are cracking down on companies nominally headquartering themselves in countries with lower tax rates. Still too easy to avoid tax and there's still too much protection given to the wealthy who don't want to pay; that there needs to be a distinction between tax avoidance ad tax evasion is proof of that. However, I was just answering Rob's question about how we were going to pay for stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 (edited) Every few years they say they are going to crack down on it.... It's the equivalent of taking on their 'masters'....Believe it when I see it. Nominee (not you) accounts in offshore banks are notoriously difficult to pin down as they hide behind a layer of names, trusts and financial tools. The big fish move their money around anyway...The only way is to inavade the 63 or so islands and city states and shut them the fuck down. Edited October 22, 2014 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 8986 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Every few years they say they are going to crack down on it.... It's the equivalent of taking on their 'masters'....Believe it when I see it. Nominee (not you) accounts in offshore banks are notoriously difficult to pin down as they hide behind a layer of names, trusts and financial tools. The big fish move their money around anyway...The only way is to inavade the 63 or so islands and city states and shut them the fuck down. So lets get the military–industrial complex on board Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 Ultimately we're never going to get the rich or big companies to pay proper tax, there just isn't the will or political capital in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 8986 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 True. Good job that trickle-down economics works so well then, isn't it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 3976 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Thing is the Cyprus haircut happened and it could set a sort of precedent. Very unlikely of course especially against companies rather than individuals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26273 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 And you saw how quickly everyone tried to take their money out of the country after that. The pound would fall through the floor and never recover if the government tried that in the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 8986 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 And you saw how quickly everyone tried to take their money out of the country after that. The pound would fall through the floor and never recover if the government tried that in the UK. That's why I said you'd need the planet's major players to get together on it. If the UK were to try and tackle it alone, the wealthy would simply move banking somewhere else. If everyone gets involved, then where would they move their banking through? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26273 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 You would soon find the world's banks suddenly very short of liquidity but a massive surge in property prices with most of us enslaved to mega-rich landlords. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fish 8986 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 All because man is an inherently selfish and greedy animal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26273 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 What Cyprus did is essentially theft. I'm all for taxing income and profits but just helping yourself to what people have in the bank is wrong imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 70 Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 (edited) What Cyprus did is essentially theft. I'm all for taxing income and profits but just helping yourself to what people have in the bank is wrong imo. We're signed up to bail ins btw. Although it might be counterproductive as you suggested earlier. There isn't a single UK bank in the safest top 20 list... Edited October 22, 2014 by Park Life Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 3976 Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 What Cyprus did is essentially theft. I'm all for taxing income and profits but just helping yourself to what people have in the bank is wrong imo.The vast majority of the account holders were Russians avoiding scrutiny or chasing inflated interest rates. I had sympathy for the locals or ex-pats affected but not the Russians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 I'd bring in a straight tax on turnover BEFORE allowing any deductions for wages, fees and other taxes - catch people liek Amazon, Starbucks etc If they want to trade here they pay some tax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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