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Official EU negotiations Thread


Park Life
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3 hours ago, Park Life said:

''The chancellor, Philip Hammond, said this week in Berlin that the UK would not seek to remain members of the EU single market or the customs union but also called for early discussions on a lengthy transition period. He said the UK might want to negotiate a deal that was equivalent to being in the single market or the customs union without taking that legal form.'' :spit:

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/jun/30/eu-states-examine-whether-uk-likely-reverse-brexit

 

Thats pretty much what most brexiteers have said from day one???

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Think all the signs are now we will get a soft Norway type Brexit, which isn't ideal but not the worst case scenario. May will have to go first though, which begs the question, would a new Tory PM have any legitimacy at all without a GE?

 

Would you agree CT this has been an utter disaster so far and we would have been better off remaining? 

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We're basically going to end up losing loads of money for a situation which is slightly worse than when we were inside the union. We had the best deal of any member nation - outside of shenghen and the Euro, thatcher's rebate and we pissed it away over an immigration lie

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1 hour ago, Renton said:

Think all the signs are now we will get a soft Norway type Brexit, which isn't ideal but not the worst case scenario. May will have to go first though, which begs the question, would a new Tory PM have any legitimacy at all without a GE?

 

It was irresponsible enough to hold one election during the two year countdown, two would be madness.

 

A Norway style situation where we still have freedom of movement won't be acceptable to the Little Englanders who don't want any more foreigners in the country.

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22 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

We're basically going to end up losing loads of money for a situation which is slightly worse than when we were inside the union. We had the best deal of any member nation - outside of shenghen and the Euro, thatcher's rebate and we pissed it away over an immigration lie

Completely agree. Also pot out of closer union. I remember arguing vociferously before the referendum we had by far the best deal in the EU and it would be impossible to better it. Contrary to popular belief, Cameron also got some important concessions, 

I never understood his weakness in broadcasting this. 

 

Thong is, a Norway EEA deal won't appease the IMMUGRANTS OUT crowd. This will rumble on for decades. 

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20 minutes ago, Park Life said:

 

Which is fair enough. We're the smaller party who wants to trade with them. It's only logical that we do so by their rules.

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2 minutes ago, ewerk said:

 

It was irresponsible enough to hold one election during the two year countdown, two would be madness.

 

A Norway style situation where we still have freedom of movement won't be acceptable to the Little Englanders who don't want any more foreigners in the country.

 

There will be a fudge. The reality of WTO rules will change things of everyone but the true lunatics. Our economy will already be down the shitter by the time any deal is done. 

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1 hour ago, Renton said:

Think all the signs are now we will get a soft Norway type Brexit, which isn't ideal but not the worst case scenario. May will have to go first though, which begs the question, would a new Tory PM have any legitimacy at all without a GE?

 

Would you agree CT this has been an utter disaster so far and we would have been better off remaining? 

 

Disaster was not getting a thumping majority.

 

The arguments for Brexit are still sound and perfectly sensible.

 

Free access to single market

 

ability to do our own trade deals with fast growing economies

 

control over laws

 

control over immigration.

 

its basically what any country wanting a free trade deal with the EU has.

 

The problem is whether this lot can deliver it. The awkward parts are the customs union and freedom of movement. The latter being the most politically sensitive area to get round for con and labour.

 

i think we'll end up paying a contribution to keep things sweet and have some sort of fudged break on immigration.

 

This would give any government time to skill up our workforce and address some of the underlying problems that lead to Brexit. (Housing, public services etc).

 

Problem is we are still massively in debt so don't really have the money to do all that needs to be done (regardless what Corbyn says).

 

Add to all that, household savings are dangerously low and the next downturn (it will come), could send us back to 2008 and even worse austerity.

 

hopefully we'll get through the next year of negotiations, a transitional deal will calm business, the economy will grow, deficit reduced all ready for the hard left to come in and fuck it up ;)

 

Basically decades of poor government has got us where we are and it will take the same to put right.

 

Your kids will have a great time though :lol:

 

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700 page documents slamming onto desks at the FO and Whitehall is the reality of Brexit deal making. How many more mandarins are we going to need to hire? Brexit to all intents and purposes is dead all that we are waiting for is to see which canary is going to sing first. Now UKIP are dead the shire Tories will perhaps have enough courage to make a move. It's clear to me that we have to get May out the way.

Edited by Park Life
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28 minutes ago, Christmas Tree said:

 

Disaster was not getting a thumping majority.

 

The arguments for Brexit are still sound and perfectly sensible.

 

Free access to single market

 

ability to do our own trade deals with fast growing economies

 

control over laws

 

control over immigration.

 

its basically what any country wanting a free trade deal with the EU has.

 

The problem is whether this lot can deliver it. The awkward parts are the customs union and freedom of movement. The latter being the most politically sensitive area to get round for con and labour.

 

i think we'll end up paying a contribution to keep things sweet and have some sort of fudged break on immigration.

 

This would give any government time to skill up our workforce and address some of the underlying problems that lead to Brexit. (Housing, public services etc).

 

Problem is we are still massively in debt so don't really have the money to do all that needs to be done (regardless what Corbyn says).

 

Add to all that, household savings are dangerously low and the next downturn (it will come), could send us back to 2008 and even worse austerity.

 

hopefully we'll get through the next year of negotiations, a transitional deal will calm business, the economy will grow, deficit reduced all ready for the hard left to come in and fuck it up ;)

 

Basically decades of poor government has got us where we are and it will take the same to put right.

 

Your kids will have a great time though :lol:

 

What makes you think future governments will put things right? Have you not noticed a trend for things getting worse? As try always do under Tories. ;)

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4 minutes ago, Renton said:

Should I be concerned that when it comes to politics I'm increasingly agreeing with Parky? 

A fulcrum of sanity in a sea of madness bro. :D

 

I think when I have my sensible face on we're not that far apart.

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The push from the other side is that the banking architecture of the EU will be seriously weakened by a hard Brexit. We don't need to wonder if back channels are running red hot with reg to shoring up a counter narrative to Brexit. The financial instruments at play in London are very much key to shoring up the Euro. London is the bridge between Wall Street and Frankfurt.

 

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-06-23/europe-s-banking-union-is-dying-in-italy

 

https://www.ft.com/content/18dcf566-5025-11e7-bfb8-997009366969?mhq5j=e2

Edited by Park Life
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17 minutes ago, Renton said:

What makes you think future governments will put things right? Have you not noticed a trend for things getting worse? As try always do under Tories. ;)

 

Thats because they always inherit a shit storm from Labour.

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You listed the arguments for Brexit, which most of knew from the outset were, well, bollocks. 

 

I'm still struggling to comprehend why you voted Corbyn given your concerns about the magic money tree.

 

Still, it seems like a few branches of the tree can be shaken for the important stuff, like whoreing the DUP to prop up a failed government. Just not the trivial stuff like paying nurses, police and firefighters properly. 

 

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16 minutes ago, ewerk said:

And how are the government going to 'skill up' the workforce when we have huge tuition fees and they're cutting funding for student nurses?

 

The training of nurses point I've made many times. Tuition fees is a whole can of worms that isn't solved by simply getting rid of them. I heard a suggestion the other day that sort of suggested certain core degrees should be free. (skills we are desperate for such as mathematics, certain engineering, robotics etc). Let the media studies crowd cough up.

 

Im certainly not sure we have the politicians in parliament to deliver this over the next decade.

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8 minutes ago, Christmas Tree said:

 

Thats because they always inherit a shit storm from Labour.

Interesting. 

Things get better under  Labour.

Things get worse under Tories.

 

CT logic. Give Tories credit for labour's success and blame labour for Tories mess.

 

:CT:

 

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