Bitcoin

[Rayvin 4963]

4 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

I meant it doesn't produces anything physical, or at this stage even tangible. It doesn't produce goods or services that benefit people (yet). As for the aspiration, honestly don't know enough about it but it seems like it might be very prone to the law of unintended consequences and just as likely to result in a dystopian nightmare as a Utopian dream. Either way, I'll be dead long before it happens, and I'd rather the world isn't physically fucked up by it for my descendant's sake. 

 

Not sure it's going to take as long as you've just indicated, mind... 

 

Here is what it is meant to do:

 

So let’s unpick why there is a need for DEFI in the first place.

Many centralised financial systems are antiquated and slow… ever tried to send money to another country or drawn down from a stocks and shares ISA? There is no technological reason that these transactions shouldn’t occur within milliseconds, but they can take anything from 2-5 days.

But it isn’t just pace and modernity that can be the justification for DEFI, think about security. Centralised systems (especially antiquated ones) can be vulnerable to a new generation of nefarious hackers. Reputable financial institutions and their centralised systems can be vulnerable to data breaches, fraud and security issues. And it is customers who initially suffer in these security breach situations, by being locked out of their apps, their digital banking and being reissued cards.

DEFI aims to address the three pronged problem within crypto finance of Scale, Pace and Security, all whilst remaining completely decentralised.

 

And here is what the advantages are:

 

First and foremost, interacting with a DEFI system isn’t timebound. So they are available 24 hours a day, 365 days a year. Next, they are available wherever there is an internet connection, so they aren’t flexible in terms of both time and location.

Next, they aim to be cheap, because they leverage technology to be as fast and as scalable as possible, but also because of the lack of intermediaries, developers can offer drastically lower fees and charges.

Finally and arguably most importantly, it offers an avenue to address ‘the unbanked’. A segment of any population that due to isolation, lack of funds, lack of credit history or (in some cases) political or socio-economic oppression cannot participate in the existing financial system.

DEFI aims to be fast, secure, cheap, available, connected and egalitarian.

 

 

[Renton 17723]

I get some of this but not others. For instance, let's iimagine there is an established global cryptocurrency. Now, I wan a loan to build my business or buy my house. How is this going to avoid me using a lender wanting to profit from the money he is lending me? What is fundamentally different? Also being completely reliant on the internet, it can never really replace physical money entirely can it? There's already built in inequalities there. 

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

Why can't it? 

[Renton 17723]

8 minutes ago, TheGingerQuiff said:

Why can't it? 

 

For the same reasons that we can't completely eliminate cash now I guess. I mean maybe at some point there will be internet everywhere and everyone will have access to it (even the poorest countries), but this is pretty aspirational stuff. But anyway, what about my bank loan if banks don't exist? 

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

https://www.leewayhertz.com/how-defi-lending-works/

[Rayvin 4963]

25 minutes ago, Renton said:

I get some of this but not others. For instance, let's iimagine there is an established global cryptocurrency. Now, I wan a loan to build my business or buy my house. How is this going to avoid me using a lender wanting to profit from the money he is lending me? What is fundamentally different? Also being completely reliant on the internet, it can never really replace physical money entirely can it? There's already built in inequalities there. 

 

I think the basic idea is that it's the same principle, but relies on using crypto assets as collateral against the loan - therefore bypassing credit checks and all the things that can prevent people from getting access to money in the traditional sense. EDIT - Quiff provided the link, I think that one is a good one for explaining it.

 

As for the latter point, I was reading that something like 31% of the global population is 'unbanked' (they don't have access to a bank account). Of this 31%, two thirds use smartphones. So that tells us that 20% of the global population could stand to benefit from this if we assume that smartphones = internet access.

 

 

Edited May 14, 2021 by Rayvin

[Gemmill 34348]

1 hour ago, Renton said:

 

The biggest costs to bitcoin mining are the capital outlay (they are bespoke servers PL which can't do anything else) and the energy input. It makes sense to operate them in countries where the energy cost is lowest, such as China. Which is predominantly fossil fuel, especially coal, the worst of them all. But in any case, they aren't hooked up to their own wind farms are they? So if they're hooked up to the grid, your figure is meaningless. 

 

I read that mining will continue until 2140. Great, 120 years of meaningless energy waste, which will increase exponentially each year. Sounds like a great idea. 

 

There's no way there'll still be a human race in 2140, so I wouldn't worry about that. We'll all look like fucking kettle chips by then. 

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

1 minute ago, Gemmill said:

 

There's no way there'll still be a human race in 2140, so I wouldn't worry about that. We'll all look like fucking kettle chips by then. 

It's why us evolved lads are dark haired. You albinos will bite the dust within a couple of decades

[Gemmill 34348]

Don't worry about me, I never leave the house.

 

If Renton thinks late-noughties Tilleys was hot though, he better fucking strap in. 

[Renton 17723]

Twat. 

[Alex 30339]

9 hours ago, Rayvin said:

Just gonna remind everyone that Elon Musk believes himself to be a literal Elven Overlord and wants to pivot humanity towards a technocracy, which would naturally involve himself and the other elves taking control.

 

His son is also named X Æ A-12, something even he struggles to pronounce. He's a narcissistic fruitloop and not the real world Bruce Wayne his personality cult seem to believe him to be.

He seems like a twat.

 

11 hours ago, PaddockLad said:

Someones going to have to explain this to thicko here. As far as I can make out Bitcoin is basically a fuckin IT unicorn? which roams the fertile plains of hard drives? What the fuck are people banging on about?  Can someone post a picture of a Bitcoin mine? Is it like Percy Main or Bilston Glen? Why are people talkimg about the environmental impact of a fairy story?  I get that it’s an electronic currency marketplace, but now it’s apparently a physical manifestation that’s going to kill the planet? 

Read an article about it on the BBC’s website. Somehow I understand it even less than before

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

Just bought some poocoin

[sammynb 2929]

My biggest issue with crypto currency is those that want it are the same tax dodging cunts that are happy to not help society by actually paying their fair and equatible share of tax.

How does a country have a functioning healthcare system or education or affordable housing for those that are less fortunate if crypto currencies "decentralise" the current financial systems?

Yes banks are shit and are no longer about providing services to their clients, just profits to their shareholders but there has to be a better way than just fucking the whole system!

Surely? Paying taxes is a necessity.

 

People like Trump, Boris and Musk are happy for the gap of divide between the haves and have-nots to continually increase but the world and society cannot survive if just the 1% get what they want.

[Rayvin 4963]

A fair point but I think Pandora's box is open now. I'll declare my earnings through it for the purposes of paying tax but that's because I believe in taxation. Many won't.

[sammynb 2929]

19 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

A fair point but I think Pandora's box is open now. I'll declare my earnings through it for the purposes of paying tax but that's because I believe in taxation. Many won't.

 

You would think that a world wide pandemic would be enough for people to see that a functioning health service is a must and therefore we need to pay taxes.

But as Renton said in the Politics thread:

Quote

Just shows as a species we learn nothing. 

 

We are the architect of our own extinction.

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

Bowtiedbull substack $10/month is a decent resource @Rayvin. 

[Rayvin 4963]

Will give it a look mate, cheers.

 

I reckon ETH might have gone down about as far as it's going to unless we're entering into a far bigger market correction than I realised, so I've gone in on it a bit now. Honestly though this last few days has been pretty grim so I'm expecting to get burned

 

 

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

I've been buying the dip but nowt mental. I don't mind either way what happens. I didn't buy enough after the last big crash, I know what to do next time

[Rayvin 4963]

You and me both.

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

Btb reckons goldman sachs have been running a demo account on AAVE and reckon institutional investment in defi July/August. Dyor of course

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

Wouldn't be surprised at all if this dip is a way of creating an entry point for big lads 

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

 

[Rayvin 4963]

Well, that's going to put the cat amongst the pigeons. What are they going to go in on, I wonder.

[Rayvin 4963]

So this has been an exciting day  

 

I bailed on everything as soon as I woke up, and it was an incredibly good decision based on how things have progressed since then. Holy fuck...

[Dr Gloom 19788]

what happened to buying the dip?