Martins is canny good

[Isegrim 8870]

Its a damn shame we haven't got enough cover to handle Martins like Liverpool are handling Kuyt, Kuyt is being brought in gently, where as Martins has been dropped in firmly at the deep end:

 

Go on lad, here's the number nine shirt, you've just got 206 goals to go.

 

That is exactly what I am about. Even West Ham have the possibilty to give Tevez time to adjust to the league because they have enough in form strikers. Martins probably would be really "canny good" if he was used at the moment as a sort of super sub you can throw in with his pace against tiring defences. But he is of absolutely no use how he is used at the moment. I haven't seen a lot of him in recent years (because I hate watching Italian football). And I don't care if he was once able to hold off Campbell. All I have seen so far is that in Mellberg and Knight two defenders had him absolutely in the pocket by dominating him physically.

 

yep, that is correct. It also makes you scratch your head and wonder why some people also think our bigger priority was defenders ....

 

One thing that also bothers me - and I say this even if he is successful - is that it is obvious that he is not a player who will play football in build up play, he is a penalty box player like Owen, Defoe etc. And so they will not play together in the same team when - or if - Owen is fit again, so what is going to happen then.

 

I am not sure about your last comment. If Owen is to be seen as Shearer's replacement and Martins as speedy player to play alongside him who chases after all sort of balls (you know, the B-word) then it could be working (highly hypothetical).

 

And for the record, I was advocating the signing of defenders. Not because I thought they were a priority, but because they were also badly needed. And because I accept that finances are not unlimited at Newcastle I thought money (i.e. 10m for Martins) could have been spent much more wisely for about 2-3 strikers who could do a job (e.g. Hasselbaink, Angel, Nugent) AND at least one defender to tighten up things at the back.

[skhwoody 0]

I didn't see the game today so fook off! I based that comment on past performances, sheesh!

196095[/snapback]

 

Every performance this season with the possible exception of Villa (I wasn't in the country to judge), Emre has been 100% committed and busy. Quite how you can write at length concerning the team based on this game that you haven't seen is beyond me.

 

Emre's problem has been keeping hold of the ball in previous matches. His undoubted skill is not in question, only the fact in some previous matches he gave the ball away more than any other player ont he pitch

[LeazesMag 0]

Its a damn shame we haven't got enough cover to handle Martins like Liverpool are handling Kuyt, Kuyt is being brought in gently, where as Martins has been dropped in firmly at the deep end:

 

Go on lad, here's the number nine shirt, you've just got 206 goals to go.

 

That is exactly what I am about. Even West Ham have the possibilty to give Tevez time to adjust to the league because they have enough in form strikers. Martins probably would be really "canny good" if he was used at the moment as a sort of super sub you can throw in with his pace against tiring defences. But he is of absolutely no use how he is used at the moment. I haven't seen a lot of him in recent years (because I hate watching Italian football). And I don't care if he was once able to hold off Campbell. All I have seen so far is that in Mellberg and Knight two defenders had him absolutely in the pocket by dominating him physically.

 

yep, that is correct. It also makes you scratch your head and wonder why some people also think our bigger priority was defenders ....

 

One thing that also bothers me - and I say this even if he is successful - is that it is obvious that he is not a player who will play football in build up play, he is a penalty box player like Owen, Defoe etc. And so they will not play together in the same team when - or if - Owen is fit again, so what is going to happen then.

 

I am not sure about your last comment. If Owen is to be seen as Shearer's replacement and Martins as speedy player to play alongside him who chases after all sort of balls (you know, the B-word) then it could be working (highly hypothetical).

 

And for the record, I was advocating the signing of defenders. Not because I thought they were a priority, but because they were also badly needed. And because I accept that finances are not unlimited at Newcastle I thought money (i.e. 10m for Martins) could have been spent much more wisely for about 2-3 strikers who could do a job (e.g. Hasselbaink, Angel, Nugent) AND at least one defender to tighten up things at the back.

 

Owen must certainly be seen as Shearers replacement, bought early when he became available, simply because of his status, and transfer fee - most people also would actually say that it is looking ahead and calling it a good idea and commending such foresight and ambition.

 

Anyway - what I said is based on - from first viewing - that Martins appears to be a penalty box player. If he turns out to be a support striker too - like Beardsley as you suggest - then of course alongside Owen it could be a very good partnership, although one that would need to keep the ball on the deck.

 

Nobody is saying we don't need defenders, of course we do, but going into the season with only Ameobi and Luque, I think it was paramount we brought in 2 forwards, and if they cost money and so there is none left to spend on defenders, then it is simply tough shite, and bringing in short term defenders until more money is found is unavoidable and a necessity and we have to accept it.

 

If Martins flops though that is a different ball game, which is why I posted the comments about the 37m quid, such a situation just cannot be allowed to keep going on. People on here who keep saying we need half a team all the time and the board are shite if they can't find the money, are being totally unrealistic and ridiculously naive, this is the real world, it can't be done. They have to make better signings, and be happy with them, and in my view there has been too many foreign players - taking time to adjust - if they adjust - and poor judgement. I think it is staggering the amount of players that have came to this club for big money and flopped, and it is a fact that most of them are foreigners. I don't know the reason why this is so .. does anybody ? But we have to look at it and take less risks in future. The premiership is a very physical and fast league, and if the managers and scouts and staff have any doubts at all about players attributes and abilities in these areas then they should not be bringing them in, and this is of course a difficult situation for the board. You are supposed to back your managers, and they also can't go on sacking them and interfering with them doing their job either, or as I said, they will be rightly held to account themselves.

 

I had high hopes that Roeder would get his signings right and take more care with money being tight and I sincerely hope that Martins can - and does - better than we have seen so far, a LOT better, he has to.

[Renton 17744]

Funny like, cos I think pretty much everyone who's commented has said that it's very early days. We are still allowed first impressions, aren't we?

 

 

Agreed. It is early days, but there are serious causes for concern. Plus the transfer windows shut, so there is little we can do to strengthen the team until the new year.

 

I reckon we are seriously going to regret not getting a proven manager in. I know I sound like a stuck record, and again it is early days, but look how Villa have improved with largely the same players.

 

 

Yes still early days but Martins was abysmal just standing there waiting for the ball, when he did get it he just passed it on i only saw him do 1 run even allowing for settling in you have to wonder.

Lets hope Dyer comes back and manages to play more than a couple of games before going off injured again.

Two games we should have won easy have been thrown away we need to improve big time over the next few weeks or we will be in BIG trouble by Christmas.

Have to agree some of our transfer window signings havent set the world allight we must improve or come the next one nobody will want to come.

 

As for Roeder at least he seems to know what he`s doing just not getting the results at the moment. Forget Villa they are on a lucky streak one day it will come our way lets just hope its sooner rather than later.

 

 

Why should Villa away be an easy fixture? Since when has it ever been, for that matter? That's also ignoring the fact they have done the sensible thing and brought in a proven manager, unlike us.

 

Roeder was NOT our manager last year, he was a caretaker, which is a completely different proposition. Nothing he has done since getting the job has impressed me, and now he is coming up with the same type of bullshit as Souness. For instance, he is quoted in the Sunday Sun today as saying Martins and Ameobi have already formed a brilliant patnership. Err, no, I don't think so - does anyone else see this?

 

There's no such thing as a lucky streak, everything happens for a reason. West Ham and Watford were relegated for a reason. And that reason is the manager at our club.

 

Funny reading that considering you've written off every game Roeder's been in charge of the club except the most recent two.

 

Sorry, you seem to misunderstand me. I am not writing off what he did last season, but that was not as our manager, but as a caretaker, which is completely different. For instance, I have always been skeptical at his ability to spot players, an essential part of being a manager, and it looks like I may be right.

 

Also I'd like to draw your attention to something that Leazes mentioned, and which I forgot to. Although it's fashionable to knock him (or at least it was last year when he was playing), I suspect Shearer had a massive role and impact on the team last year with Roeder in charge. But now he, and Craig, have gone. My impression is that the management of this club leaves a lot to be desired, from top to bottom. I hope you have grounds for your confidence, but I suspect you just enjoy having a pop at those who are trying to appraise our situation realistically.

Edited September 10, 2006 by Renton

[Isegrim 8870]

like Beardsley as you suggest

 

Nice one. I don't really disagree with the rest.

[Guest alex]

The point about West Ham being able to bring Tevez in gradually is a good one. Sheringham is thinking of leaving because he is now the number 6 striker. Imagine having that much depth? They also brought on Carlton Cole as a sub yesterday. A player superior imo to Shola (who will start every game for us, when fit, probably). And their England striker and record signing (iirc) is injured too.

[Gemmill 34413]

West Ham's squad was pissing all over ours even before they got Tevez and Mascherano tbh.

 

How ugly is Tevez though?! You know on The Fly where the fly gets into his teleporting machine? Tevez looks like what would happen if you put Dennis The Menace and Taz into it.