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Isegrim
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I am just reading a book about the downfall of a Jorman football club (Kaiserslautern) that was run by a bunch of local halfwits for several years who caused severe lasting damage and made the club a laughing stock (they are currently facing a court trial).

 

Actually some things reminded me of the Newcastle situtation. Especially with some rumours I heard about the financial handling of the club.

 

Looking at the two games ahead I the funny feeling is growing deep inside me that another two crap results wouldn't be that bad. This feels horrible because so far I haven't had any faith in the manager and the board, but was always hoping for good results and been proven wrong. One part still hopes to be proven wrong, but the devil in me is growing. :blink:

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Aye I hope we get stuffed off bolton and Man U.

 

Shite in the short term, but potentially better in the long run.

16081[/snapback]

 

Absolute crud IMO. I cannot ever hope that we get beat cos it 'would be a good thing in the long run' Can you honestly say you'd sit there and watch us play hoping we'll be beaten?

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Yep. I wanted West ham to win on saturday. Thought they deserved it.

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They probably did deserve it, but I find that quite bizarre that you hoped we'd lose that and our next few matches. Why don't you just write this season off altogether, hope we lose all of our games, get relegated and then we can get a shiny new manager who will wave a magic wand, all will be well and we'll steam back up the leagues to claim what's rightfully ours?

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Yep. I wanted West ham to win on saturday. Thought they deserved it.

16090[/snapback]

 

They probably did deserve it, but I find that quite bizarre that you hoped we'd lose that and our next few matches. Why don't you just write this season off altogether, hope we lose all of our games, get relegated and then we can get a shiny new manager who will wave a magic wand, all will be well and we'll steam back up the leagues to claim what's rightfully ours?

16094[/snapback]

 

 

:blink:

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I wouldn't say that - Craig the superfan will come and take a hissy fit

16083[/snapback]

 

Do you agree with him then Skol?? :razz:

 

I'm with Cath on this one - why would any fan of the club hope that we'd lose??

 

I can't get my head around it :blink:

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Playing devil's advocate for a minute:

 

If winning our next 2 games under Souness meant he kept his job and went on to have a reasonably successful season, finishing 9th in the league and qualifying for the UEFA cup as FA Cup Runners up and losing them meant getting in Wenger after a shock homosexual affair went bad with David Dein and we finished 3rd and won the FA Cup. Which would you want, if you had that glimpse into the future? Would you not pray we lost the next 2 games for a brighter future?

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I wouldn't say that - Craig the superfan will come and take a hissy fit

16083[/snapback]

 

Do you agree with him then Skol?? :razz:

 

I'm with Cath on this one - why would any fan of the club hope that we'd lose??

 

I can't get my head around it :blink:

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For the greater good, it's really not a difficult concept.

 

I know I always bang on about the 99 match against the mackems, but it is a perfect example. The club was at a crossroads, and winning that match could have been disastrous. I was happy we lost it, and this was to the mackems!

 

I wouldn't go so far as to say I hope we lose against Bolton or ManU, but to be honest if we do I won't be surprised and I won't be upset, especially if it means getting rid of Souness.

 

Or would you prefer a freak win and see us get relegated?

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And how many of us went into those games hoping we'd lose....?

 

BTW, we beat the Mackems in 1991/92, I think you must be referring to the play off semi-final which was 2 years prior to that!

 

:blink:

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I wouldn't say that - Craig the superfan will come and take a hissy fit

16083[/snapback]

 

Do you agree with him then Skol?? :razz:

 

I'm with Cath on this one - why would any fan of the club hope that we'd lose??

 

I can't get my head around it :blink:

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No, I don't agree although I know a few people who would. I don't want to see us lose but I understand the reasons as to why certain supporters do.

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I wouldn't say that - Craig the superfan will come and take a hissy fit

16083[/snapback]

 

Do you agree with him then Skol?? :razz:

 

I'm with Cath on this one - why would any fan of the club hope that we'd lose??

 

I can't get my head around it :blink:

16098[/snapback]

 

No, I don't agree although I know a few people who would. I don't want to see us lose but I understand the reasons as to why certain supporters do.

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Well I can't, and I'm gob-smacked people can understand it...

 

Say we lose our next two games and Souness goes, in comes Peter Reid!!

 

We lose 70% of the remaining games of the season and end up relegated - do you think these people still would be glad the hoped we'd lost those two games??

 

I can understand people wanting Souness replaced, I cannot for the life of me understand why a Newcastle United fan would want us to lose - for ANY reason!

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But what if you had a crystal ball Craig, as in my post above, I know it's not possible but just consider what I said above and respond to it honestly.

Edited by DotBum
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I wouldn't say that - Craig the superfan will come and take a hissy fit

16083[/snapback]

 

Do you agree with him then Skol?? :razz:

 

I'm with Cath on this one - why would any fan of the club hope that we'd lose??

 

I can't get my head around it :blink:

16098[/snapback]

 

No, I don't agree although I know a few people who would. I don't want to see us lose but I understand the reasons as to why certain supporters do.

16106[/snapback]

 

Well I can't, and I'm gob-smacked people can understand it...

 

Say we lose our next two games and Souness goes, in comes Peter Reid!!

 

We lose 70% of the remaining games of the season and end up relegated - do you think these people still would be glad the hoped we'd lost those two games??

 

I can understand people wanting Souness replaced, I cannot for the life of me understand why a Newcastle United fan would want us to lose - for ANY reason!

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Once again, Newcastle vs Sunderland, 1999.

 

How many people were complaining on the next home match, which we won 8-0? Would that have happened under Gullit, emphatically no.

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People need to seperate two different things.

 

In terms of actually being at the individual match in question you can't want us to lose it just goes against everything about you.

 

But, if people are putting forward an argument thus:

 

Would you accept two defeats (or whatever it is required) if it meant Souness out, rather than have him scarpe by and slowly but surely (with Freds help) strangle the life out of the club we all love.

 

Its always hypothetical and so people should feel free to take whichever option they prefer!

 

But the mackem games are prime examples where we were saved/turned around.

 

Playoffs, instead of going up and being like the mackems yo-yoing back and forth we get Sir John, KK and become what we did.

 

The mackems again with Gullit, he's out, Bobby's in, prevents relegation and turns us into CL team.

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But what if you had a crystal ball Craig, as in my post above, I know it's not possible but just consider what I said above and respond to it honestly.

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I can't comprehend the idea of any Newcastle fan wanting their team to lose, end off....

 

I've sat and watched some dross in my time (most notably the relegation season of 1988/89) and no matter how much I despised the management at the time and thought that their ejection would be in the best interests of the club, I went to all the games that season hoping that Newcastle would win....

 

Personally I think even if we replace Souness, the problems will exist (if not actually be worse). The main problem is further upstairs - we have a depleated squad and the chairman seems reluctant to cough up to improve it. We all know we could have had Boa Morte and Anelka by now, we all know they'd have improved the team and we all know that Souness wanted them....

 

Why haven't we got them? Cos Freddy Shepherd won't pay for them!

 

That's the problem - it's no use pulling the weeds out if you're gonna leave to roots in place...

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In fairness, we can't really use the play off defeat as an example of a turn around....

 

SJH had been trying to get control of the club over 3 years prior to that game, and he didn't actually manage it until 18 months afterwards...

 

Sure, the game was within that period, but it was hardly a turning point. We started the 1990/91 season as one of the favourites to go up - we finished mid-table. Hardly a turn around at that point....

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If you knew losing the next 2 games meant Souness & Fred and the Halls would go, Sultan of Dubai would hand Newcastle 1 billion for nothing, KK as Director of Football and Mourinho as manager would you wish for it then?

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How many times....?

 

I would never go into a game hoping that Newcastle would lose - put forward all the 'pie in the sky' hypothetical situations you like, I still say the same....

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Fair enough mate, no need for that.

 

I was just trying to point out if there was a situation where you would consider it then you could at least see where some people are coming from.

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In fairness, we can't really use the play off defeat as an example of a turn around....

 

SJH had been trying to get control of the club over 3 years prior to that game, and he didn't actually manage it until 18 months afterwards...

 

Sure, the game was within that period, but it was hardly a turning point. We started the 1990/91 season as one of the favourites to go up - we finished mid-table. Hardly a turn around at that point....

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If we went up we just wouldn't have ended up with Keegan and everything that happened. I know what you're saying, but without that game things would be alot dfferent!

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In fairness, we can't really use the play off defeat as an example of a turn around....

 

SJH had been trying to get control of the club over 3 years prior to that game, and he didn't actually manage it until 18 months afterwards...

 

Sure, the game was within that period, but it was hardly a turning point. We started the 1990/91 season as one of the favourites to go up - we finished mid-table. Hardly a turn around at that point....

16123[/snapback]

 

 

If we went up we just wouldn't have ended up with Keegan and everything that happened. I know what you're saying, but without that game things would be alot dfferent!

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OK PL, I get where you're coming from with that but then we could say that about many games....

 

What if we'd won at Anfield and Ewood Park in 1996?

 

What if we'd beaten Partizan Belgrade in the CL qualifier??

 

I think the present outcome would have been very different had we done so!

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