Happy Face

That's like blaming an obese kid for being fat. If sweets and Maccy D's are available, they'll gorge themselves. It's not like in the 50's all this credit was available and people had a more level headed view about taking it on. Regulations that served a purpose were relaxed to the point of non-existence.

Why not do both, let those millionaire's defray some of the cost of saving the banking system as we know it? Already at pre WW2 level of income inequality, and heading quickly towards pre WW1 and pre social security. Undone in 30 years since thatcher what we'd achieved in the 70 years previous. Shameful.

This is the attitude I hope the players aren't starting to feel, especially against a team like Chelsea. Not saying having your tails up is necessarily a bad thing, but in our case points have all been won on effort. I don't think I've truly expected us to win a single game this season...or since the championship...and it's that relegation bait/underdog mentality which I think the players have busted a gut to overcome game after game. Hate to see it all fall apart badly with raised expectations.

So then, plenty of people like Mike Ashley (they don't) and it's irrelevant if they do or not anyway. Great stuff Leazes. I agree with you and will happily remind you that I do in four years time. Incidentally, to employ one of your favourite argumentative techniques, when will this 'flash in the pan' be lengthy enough to be considered genuine progress? End of the year, end of next year or when everyone declares their undying agreement with you? Make idiotic statement to support argument. Be quantitatively proven wrong. Declare said statement irrelevent. Move the goal posts. Repeat. I've been correct in how I've called Mike Ashley since he got his feet under the table chum. I'm not moving any goal posts, I've said exactly the same thing as I've been saying for years. More fool you and certain thick twats who were completely unable to see the blatantly obvious. Apart from when you predicted he'd bring back Champions league.

Incredible powers of ignorance in blanking the results of the poll.

Another 5 bookings for dirty chelsea.

Eh? Why would there be a backlash?

Handy for us getting compensated if another club poach him though

Keep saying "over 5 years". In the short term it was an additional cost, of course, but it was done to save money long term. This is also why I don't think Pardew would be sacked irrespective of performance. His basic pay for the whole 5 year contract is £2.25m. Allardyce and Keegan were on more than that every year. Hughton would (in my opinion) have at least been looking for parity with other managers of relegation bait teams who are generally on £1m a year or more. So Ashley saves £2.75m. Sort of agree but I don't see how Hughton would've got more, Ashley simply wouldn't have offered it. It's moot though because Hughton was never in his long-term plans. If it was just about money the obvious option would have been to keep Hughton until his contract expired, say ta very much, then appoint Pardew. That would've been cheaper, no? Also, he didn't have to offer anyone a 5 and 1/2 year deal. It's almost unheard of for a manager's contract. Maybe I'm being unfair saying it's always the cheapest option. Best value is probably a better choice of words. Could be that Pardew took another opportunity in those 6 months if hughton was left in place and Ashley wanted to avoid that, or that it was better to for the club to move on sooner rather than later given a managerial change was inevitable by the end of the season. There was always the chance that Hughton could move us further up the table and he'd be harder to shift with the "more experienced manager" cover story. Pardew was in the wings for ages, but Ashley had to wait out a few good results to justify the sacking as it was.

Keep saying "over 5 years". In the short term it was an additional cost, of course, as much as £200k maybe, but it was done to save money long term. This is also why I don't think Pardew would be sacked irrespective of performance. His basic pay for the whole 5 year contract is £2.25m. Allardyce and Keegan were on more than that every year. Hughton would (in my opinion) have at least been looking for parity with other managers of relegation bait teams who are generally on £1m a year or more. So Ashley saves £2.75m.

Not sure what you or Alex are basing Pardew being more expensive on, given his basic salary is £450,000. Chris Hughton only had months left on a championship salary of £400k, so he was certainly going to exceed Pardew for the next 5 years if he was renewed. Was he not the lowest paid PL manager on £250k? I'm going off this... http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/dec/06/chris-hughton-newcastle-united-manager

I'm not sure what the achievement is though, is it just recognition that he got lucky? On the other hand he sacked a manager who had stabilised the club and was doing a great job, his decision could have just as easily seen us go into meltdown and end up relegated. As his decisions had done two years previously. I'll recognise that he's a risk-taker but I won't give him any credit for it. I just think it's fair. If you slate every decision irrespective of outcome then you're just Leazes It's all about the reasoning and rationale behind such decisions and with the Pardew scenario that reasoning was flawed and simply more evidence that he has not learned his lesson at all. Yeah, like I said, i think it's wrong to credit him with vision no-one else had in hindsight. But even if I have a mate who marries a slag and gets divorced, then he marries another slag and EVERYONE's saying she's a whore, i don't keep reminding him she's a whore for the reast of their life together, even while she's being a doting wife and parent who's cut out the drink and left players spouses alone.

Not sure what you or Alex are basing Pardew being more expensive on, given his basic salary is £450,000. Chris Hughton only had months left on a championship salary of £400k, so he was certainly going to exceed Pardew for the next 5 years if he was renewed.

I'm not sure what the achievement is though, is it just recognition that he got lucky? On the other hand he sacked a manager who had stabilised the club and was doing a great job, his decision could have just as easily seen us go into meltdown and end up relegated. As his decisions had done two years previously. I'll recognise that he's a risk-taker but I won't give him any credit for it. I just think it's fair. If you slate every decision irrespective of outcome then you're just Leazes

I think there's an argument to be made that their enthusiasm for a top flight job, having thought they were finished, can be worth twice what someone like Mark Hughes would bring. As much as Ashley deserves pillorying for appointing Kinnear, he deserves credit for Pardew...but both were total risks, based on cost rather than ability. Again, no. If I go and buy a lottery ticket and win the jackpot, does that make me the world's most astute investor or does it make me incredibly lucky? There are no guarantees though. At the moment I'm much happier with Pardew than I ever was with "proven quality" like Allardyce or Souness. Of course there are no guarantees with any appointment but you can look at most successful appointments and see the rationale behind them. Ashley didn't sit down and take a balanced look at where we're at and then scour the world for the right manager, he appointed the guy he knew from the casino. It isn't much more complicated than that. Looking back it appeared more likely to fail than to succeed but Ashley has gotten lucky, he isn't reaping the benefits of an inspired decision. He's reaping the benefits of his decision though. Whatever the rationale for it. Elsewhere in the thread you'll see I'm in total agreement that he deserves no credit for his rationale at that time, despite others trying to suggest he saw something in Pardew none of us could see, but when a risk is paying off you have to hold your hands up and recognise the achievement, despite expectation.

I think there's an argument to be made that their enthusiasm for a top flight job, having thought they were finished, can be worth twice what someone like Mark Hughes would bring. As much as Ashley deserves pillorying for appointing Kinnear, he dereves credit for Pardew...but both were total risks, based on cost rather than ability. I'm not sure I agree. Kinnear was reputed to be on a lot of money, with an additional big bonus if we stayed up. Now, I'm not suggesting for a second it was a good decision, it was a crazy decision at the time and in even dafter in retrospect. I still struggle to believe he did it when I think about it sometimes. As for Pardew, bringing him in and getting rid of Hughton was more expensive than just keeping Hughton until the end of the season. I totally accept both decisions were risky (and I didn't agree with either of them) but the logic that it was done purely to save money doesn't quite add up for me. I don't think Kinnear was anywhere close to Keegan money....or Hughton was close to Shearer money after going down. Giving Pardew a 5 year contract was cheaper than improving Hughton's for 5 years when he was far exceeding expectations. Adds up from where I'm standing.

I think there's an argument to be made that their enthusiasm for a top flight job, having thought they were finished, can be worth twice what someone like Mark Hughes would bring. As much as Ashley deserves pillorying for appointing Kinnear, he deserves credit for Pardew...but both were total risks, based on cost rather than ability. Again, no. If I go and buy a lottery ticket and win the jackpot, does that make me the world's most astute investor or does it make me incredibly lucky? There are no guarantees though. At the moment I'm much happier with Pardew than I ever was with "proven quality" like Allardyce or Souness.

I think there's an argument to be made that their enthusiasm for a top flight job, having thought they were finished, can be worth twice what someone like Mark Hughes would bring. As much as Ashley deserves pillorying for appointing Kinnear, he deserves credit for Pardew...but both were total risks, based on cost rather than ability.

Appointing Pardew was little more inspired than appointing Kinnear tbh. Neither were anything more than cheaper options who'd gladly tow the line to get an opportunity back in the game. Our start doesn't mean Ashley saw anything in the bloke the rest of us didn't.

Think I'll go with ISAM by Amon Tobin.

7.69% margin of error.

Pride in a sports direct hoarding of a stadium, ambition to balance the books. The stuff CT dreams of.

Quick poll to see if Leazes is right.

Think (think) think (think) think (think) Think (think) think (think) think (think) You better think (think) think about what you're trying to do to me Yeah, think (think, think), let your mind go, let yourself be free Let's go back, let's go back, let's go way on back when I didn't even know you, you came to me and too much you wouldn't take I ain't no psychiatrist, I ain't no doctor with degree It don't take too much high IQ's to see what you're doing to me You better think (think) think about what you're trying to do to me Yeah, think (think, think) let your mind go, let yourself be free Oh Leazes (Leazes), Leazes (Leazes), Leazes, yeah Leazes Leazes (Leazes), Leazes (Leazes), Leazes, oooh Leazes