Pacinofan

registrations have been stopped on there. It's too busy anyway, there would be too many answers to sort through Try On The Kop CB. Send a message to the owner Peter Evo, he's usually up for things like that. OnTheKop

I go a few times a year mate, mainly for work. Though I have been on nights out in the past (not always the most comfortable experience being on the sauce over there with a Manc accent if I'm honest). I genuinely don't think my views are coloured by any hatred of Liverpool FC either, because as I say, I've always been inclined to favour them in as far as they are the rags sworn enemy and your enemy's enemy is a friend etc etc. I know thats petty minded like but I hate Man Utd and can't help it. What I will honestly say is that the single most overwhelming thing for me is (and I spose it's about first impressions really), but driving in from Manchester, before you get to the city centre of Liverpool you literally do just drive miles and miles through total urban desolation. I have never known anywhere like it. And I say that as someone who drives through Moss Side and Hulme every day! Driving in through the Edge Lane area has always been a bone of contention and most Scousers would agree with your view entirely. Legal wrangling has held up regeneration to the area for years and the council appeared to let the area run down in an effort to speed up the legal process. All the legal issues have now been resolved and the bulldozers moved in a few weeks ago. Hopefully your future journeys will be an improvement.

RAWK mostly. They also have a spyin kop feature pretty much the same as you've tried to do here.

Just out of curiosity MM, how often do you go to Liverpool? I obviously don't share your view of the city but respect the fact that you gave your honest opinion.

Get a grip you boring manc clown. You come on here thinking you know everything and continually make a complete cunt out of yourself. Your team captain lives in Mcr by the way, I know that because he's a neighbour of mine. Not exactly what I'd call a ringing endorsement for Liverpool life tbh. Apparently Colleen was thrilled to bits more than Rooney himself when he signed for Man United, as its' where she used to do all her shopping. There was quotes with that too. Always hear plenty of Mickey Mousers around Deansgate, shopping. Colleen being the most famous obviously. Only 30 miles away but another planet really tbf. Spending 95% of your life in Manchester you can give an unbiased view, how would you compare Newcastle upon Tyne to Liverpool? Did they move her favourite shop 'Cricket' to Manchester then? No doubt she shops in Cheshire, Manchester, Liverpool and London but Coleens always been pretty popular round here for her support of local up and coming designers.

Born and bred Scousers as were their parents. Bit of Irish heritage back a bit but no Welsh, sorry to upset your self made up statistics.

Hate going back on a I'm outta here but just a point. Three times ayyyyyyyyym. No wonder the life expectancy in Liverpool is about 57, you'll have yourself a coronary me old son. You're right again, I'm made up me Ma and Da are bucking the trend, both being in their 70's.

Aye last minute volley in the corner. He scored one or two for Liverpool it always struck me how little the other players wanted to celebrate with him especially Gerrard, was like you're shit you shouldn't be on here you lucky cunt. PMSL yet again, you just don't give up making things up do you? That fucking opera soundtrack. You should be ashamed. Cringeworthy tbh.

Aye last minute volley in the corner. He scored one or two for Liverpool it always struck me how little the other players wanted to celebrate with him especially Gerrard, was like you're shit you shouldn't be on here you lucky cunt. PMSL yet again, you just don't give up making things up do you? Second time you've come back when you said you were away. Make your mind up eh chump? You're only right but it's hard to keep from showing you up as the lying phoney you are. You were wrong yet again. You were making things up, yet again.

Aye last minute volley in the corner. He scored one or two for Liverpool it always struck me how little the other players wanted to celebrate with him especially Gerrard, was like you're shit you shouldn't be on here you lucky cunt. PMSL yet again, you just don't give up making things up do you?

Hate going back on a I'm outta here but just a point. 100 Players Who Shook the Kop wasn't about the best players, it was about players making an impact on the fans whether it be by their playing, their personality or a one off act of genius. Of course great players always make an impact but this was also about the not so great players who do something and you say "fucking hell, how did he do that?" or a wow. Neil Mellor only played 12 games for the first team but one of those was against the recently crowned invincible team, Arsenal. He scored a stunning winner in the last minute to give us the three points, when most of us were praying that we could hold on to the draw. For him it wrote his name in to the Liverpool history books regardless of how good or bad he was. Carra isn't the greatest footballer, but as I say this wasn't about that. Carra's personality alone would have gotten him high up the chart, but few can forget his outstanding display in Istanbul where he was still blocking shots and making last ditch tackles while riddled with cramp.

Where do you possibly start with a post like this, every single bit of it uninformed clueless, laughable and bordering on obsessive. Lets start with our shameful gates. Three under 20,000 (none in the top flight) in our history, despite having won 20 multiplied by zero domestic trophies in 55 years. Shameful. A club utterly raped, pillage, mismanaged and scorned for over half a century, outside the 10 best supported clubs in England a massive EIGHT times in our history shameful. Only twice getting above 25,000 between 1978 and 1992, yes shameful during a time of unprecedented unemployment in the north, a time where clubs were utterly ravaged by hooliganism, a time where a club Everton, won a FA Cup in a season came in the top 7 in the top flight, and even won the title with the best side in their history the season after with an average of just 19,000 - shameful. A time where every other season our best players were sold - shameful. A time when we were languishing going no where in the Second Division in 9 of those 14 seasons - shameful. If that's so shameful, what about Liverpool who were a spor away from winning all four trophies they entered, winning three (league, league cup and european cup) and averaged just 31,000, just two thousand than second division Newcastle, now that is what I call shameful. We'd have had 100,000 wanting to go to games with a team that in the 14 years you mentioned won 7 league titles, 4 league cups, 3 fa cups and 4 european cups. What a fucking utter mug. You must know you're a mug. I don't care what anyone says. Shameful. The Keegan thing, he even said it after the FA Cup Final in 74, "If these supporters had the success their support merited they'd win every trophy in every season." As for Liverpool fans falling out of love with them, two sources that spring to mind, were several people saying exactly that, that when he came to Newcastle he spoke about us in flattering terms compared to Liverpool in Stephen F Kelly's book the Kop, and it's even mentioned in the clubs top 100 players that he would've been higher but for those remarks. You don't know anyone who hates our club pmsl, you don't really need to say anything more than that, because clearly you're a young clueless lad. That's a bit like Jermaine Jenas doesn't know any gay men. What are you on about different names? You are a boring scouse cunt with nothing to say, looking for a lol when all you'll get, as you have had since this post is a collective pipe down you utter bindipping tool. tbf you're quoting someone's comments where they have specifically mentioned attendances post 92 and you've made comments about two decades before that. Hasn't gone unnoticed that you haven't backed up your claims with any figures of any note. For the record if you'd bothered to do any background research before you made those claims, you'd have learned that the 'Popular' terrace was replaced by a stand in the early 70s which reduced our capacity by around 30% whilst the building work too place. Then during the late 70s the Leazes End was demolished and we were left with a terrace more than half the size of what we had before vastly reducing our capacity further. Fast forward to the late 80s and the tragedy at Bradford rendered the West Stand condemned and that too was rebuilt - again reducing our capacity massively during the demolition and construction phase. The important factor is that with a few rare exceptions, we almost always filled the capacity we had available to us. Personally I think the average gates argument is poor - but if you're going to attack it, at least get your fucking facts straight dickhead. So, are you saying that for a period of some 15 years your capacity was only 16,000 at one point and rising to only 25.000 at another point? PMSL. I hope it hasn't gone unnoticed, as I said only supafans start at '92. Well done for completely ignoring his point. I think you are giving yourself a bit too much credit there. To be able to "pick on clubs" would imply that your knowledge of such clubs was significant enough to really have a go, but much of the time you make it up as you go along and get one of your alter egos to agree with you. I wouldn't be so ridiculously inane to debate such an obviously drunken/doped up statement. Having no idea what dippers are your last sentence makes no sense to me. Then you're a cunt. No idea what the rest of the noise is you're mumbling on about is I doubt you even know yourself. ...and how could you not know what a fucking dipper is, it's what you're known as nationally for fuck sake, just shows what a bubble Merseyside must be when you're not aware of that. Fuck this is getting boring. But, but, but-----------you’re the attendance man, man ! You’re the one banging on about them, couldn’t give a fuck myself but if you want to throw brickbats you should make sure you have nothing for others to come back with, surely that’s obvious even to a deluded bigot like you. No matter how you try to cloud the figures of your attendances they are still pretty dismal at times, just like other clubs. Many clubs have been raped and pillaged at times in their history, all suffered from the hooliganism, and all suffered from Thatchers cutting policies, stop trying to come up with excuses ffs. The more finals you’re in, the more money you need, and as you’ve pointed out the ‘80’s were hard financially, all round. You might well have had a 100,000 wanting to go, as did Liverpool, but when you’re playing so many games in the UK as well as Europe, season after season there comes a point where economics dictate you have to make choices. You’ve made yourself into a mug by banging on about how fantastic your attendances have always been when in reality you’ve had good and bad, just like most clubs. Our 2nd div attendances were better than your earlier ones, ner, ner, ner. I see nothing wrong with Keegan saying that after the ’74 final, that’s what winning teams do, give credit to the losers and their fans, he was also gushing about Liverpool fans outside of St Georges Hall the next day. I really don’t remember that in Kellys book but I’ll take your word for it, and still don’t see how that negates the fact that he was disliked because of the money grabbing way he left the club. Keegan was only number 8 in the top 100 because of the class and greatness of players we’ve had at the club and there might well have been a bias against him in some people but you’re totally deluding yourself if you think it had anything to do with something he supposedly said. I would have placed him at number 7, ahead of Carra, but wouldn’t have changed any of the other players ahead of him. I’m neither young nor clueless and unlike you I live here in Liverpool and go to the match. If you walk round thinking Newcastle fans or club are a topic of conversation you’re even more seriously deluded than I thought. Get this in to your thick head soft lad, Scouse hate is reserved for each of our own clubs and Man United, Chelsea maybe at a push, but Newcastle just don’t figure at all in the hate stakes. My condolences if that upsets you but that’s how it is. You’re spoken of about as much as the rest of the Prem, by all means though carry on deluding yourself. You know exactly what I’m talking about you using different names. You talk to yourself as different people trying to give credibility to your bigoted views. How fucking sad is that? Why am I not surprised you don’t have any idea about the rest of my post? I go on many sites that involve people from all over the country, also travel a lot and I don’t hear bindipper at all. I presume it’s derived from one of those Manc songs you love so much, personally I lose track they’ve got so many Scouse hate songs. Used to wonder why they spent so much time making up and singing songs about us when they could be singing about their own glorious history. I read the site below a lot where there's often debates between Mancs and Scousers, not seen us called bindippers. Your city and club aren't talked about a great deal here neither, strange as you might find it, although when mentioned your city gets a few compliments. I'm outta here now, carry on spewing your sad jealous bile, in as many different names as you can of course. http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=60

I think you are giving yourself a bit too much credit there. To be able to "pick on clubs" would imply that your knowledge of such clubs was significant enough to really have a go, but much of the time you make it up as you go along and get one of your alter egos to agree with you. I wouldn't be so ridiculously inane to debate such an obviously drunken/doped up statement. Having no idea what dippers are your last sentence makes no sense to me.

Agreed Tom, attendance debates are ridiculous anyway and mean fuck all in the real football world.

tbf you're quoting someone's comments where they have specifically mentioned attendances post 92 and you've made comments about two decades before that. Hasn't gone unnoticed that you haven't backed up your claims with any figures of any note. For the record if you'd bothered to do any background research before you made those claims, you'd have learned that the 'Popular' terrace was replaced by a stand in the early 70s which reduced our capacity by around 30% whilst the building work too place. Then during the late 70s the Leazes End was demolished and we were left with a terrace more than half the size of what we had before vastly reducing our capacity further. Fast forward to the late 80s and the tragedy at Bradford rendered the West Stand condemned and that too was rebuilt - again reducing our capacity massively during the demolition and construction phase. The important factor is that with a few rare exceptions, we almost always filled the capacity we had available to us. Personally I think the average gates argument is poor - but if you're going to attack it, at least get your fucking facts straight dickhead. So, are you saying that for a period of some 15 years your capacity was only 16,000 at one point and rising to only 25.000 at another point? PMSL. I hope it hasn't gone unnoticed, as I said only supafans start at '92.

Look at the Premiership since 1993. Villa have had 19,000 Everton have had 13,000 Spurs have had 17,000 on more than one occasion Liverpool have had 22,000 in Arsenal had a 19,000 We remain the only club to have never had a gate under 30,000 in the Premiership, even Man Utd have. So it's easy to get carried away with stats like that, but EVERYONE in football knows the truth, and I'm not going to say what it is because I don't need to, everyone knows what the truth is, you can base it on opinion or even fact. OK I'll bite just this once although I happen to agree with how good Uniteds support has been for many decades, not just since the supafans start of '92. Gates are all about averages and some of yours through the 70's and 80's were shameful, a couple of 16 and 17 thousand averages. Between '78 and '92 only twice getting above 25, 000. I guess they were the decades when you were 'boycoutting' Honestly,PMSL. I read loads of things about their opinion of Keegan, they fell out of love with him due to the amount of flattering comparisons he made comparing us to them. I think a lot of scouse people certainly hate NUFC. I think it's largely that they think we shouldn't think that we count, but we do, we're part of the nations psyche and they hate it because our last 40 years certainly don't merit being so. The media kick us more than love us, for every Henry Winter who imo, is a closet toon fan. Couldn't stop laughing when I read the above. The Kop fell out of love with Keegan when he left for Hamburg for three times the amount of money he was getting here, and that was long, long before he went as a 30 yr old to your club and "sang your praises". Not sure what he's supposed to have sang your praises about like, never really put much store in Keegans words, I remember him once saying he cries when he hears the Kop singing YNWA which I thought was bollocks, but other than that I've no idea. The leaving of keegan, great player though he was, was one of the best things that happened to the club, it brought our greatest player ever. I genuinely don't know anyone who hates your club, the majority of Scouse hate is reserved for Everton or Liverpool and United. Can't say I hear Newcastle mentioned much at all other than when you're the butt of jokes now and again. I suggest you read Henry Winters offerings about Liverpoool. He's even written on the official site about how much regard he has always held the club and fans in. Not to say he's a Liverpool fan, I hope he's not myself. Are you talking to yourself in different names? Surely there aren't that many Geordies like you, there'd be a major inquiry about what drugs your Mams were taking while pregnant.

Tell your mate not to worry on the ticket front as i am sure all your fickle fans will soon fuck off when you aren't in the C/L next year, glad you have a good relationship with Madrid fans must be the only lot in Europe that have any time for scousers. It's never kept them away before, why would it now? I've never had problems with the European fans I've come in to contact with, they're very welcoming and there's always a bit of a party attitude with the locals.

Is it just Liverpool fans you have a problem with or does your xenophobia stretch to all fans who aren’t Newcastle fans? Our foreign fans wouldn’t have been able to get there last night, so what? West Ham only brought half their quota and many LFC fans started off for Madrid yesterday morning if that helps. I wouldn’t mind the attendance staying at 37,000 for a season or two, it would mean that all the locals who aren’t prepared to spend hours on the phone trying to get a ticket for their home town team would be able to go to as many matches as they want.. One of my mates who isn’t an STH has to pay 30 quid to be a member of the PTS scheme, which allows him to spend anything between 30 minutes and two hours on the phone applying for a ticket. It wouldn’t be so bad if being a member allowed you to drop in to the TO and buy a ticket from there but there are no window sales anymore. Don't all fans think they're the best in the world? Your view is so full of bile it ceases to have any real meaning. Unbelievable excuses there. If you had a proper local fanbase you would've had a gate better than our worst in the Championship this season, but you don't so you didn't. Unreal you can't fill a little ground like that in the Premiership imo. For it to be an excuse I'd have to be a person who cared about attendances in the first place. That our attendances don't match yours isn't something I'd lose any sleep over, I was just offering an explanation. Your opinions are too skewed to have any relevance. You care enough to contradict yourself and tell lies though? Good luck on Thursday though I hope you do Merseyside proud in your customary manner. I wasn't aware that I'd done either of those things. I won't be there on Thursday but I'm sure we'll enjoy ourselves as we have a good relationship with Madrid fans.

I think without Torres we'll need it. Last nights score looks good but Liverpool were flat and WHAM were just bad.

This cunt must think we came up the Tyne on a rich tea. You've already made your excuses you doil, now it was sold out... oh dear. Sorry, I thought it was accepted that it was sold out, just like the upcoming Burnley game is, and I was offering some explanation/excuse for last night.

Is it just Liverpool fans you have a problem with or does your xenophobia stretch to all fans who aren’t Newcastle fans? Our foreign fans wouldn’t have been able to get there last night, so what? West Ham only brought half their quota and many LFC fans started off for Madrid yesterday morning if that helps. I wouldn’t mind the attendance staying at 37,000 for a season or two, it would mean that all the locals who aren’t prepared to spend hours on the phone trying to get a ticket for their home town team would be able to go to as many matches as they want.. One of my mates who isn’t an STH has to pay 30 quid to be a member of the PTS scheme, which allows him to spend anything between 30 minutes and two hours on the phone applying for a ticket. It wouldn’t be so bad if being a member allowed you to drop in to the TO and buy a ticket from there but there are no window sales anymore. Don't all fans think they're the best in the world? Your view is so full of bile it ceases to have any real meaning. Unbelievable excuses there. If you had a proper local fanbase you would've had a gate better than our worst in the Championship this season, but you don't so you didn't. Unreal you can't fill a little ground like that in the Premiership imo. For it to be an excuse I'd have to be a person who cared about attendances in the first place. That our attendances don't match yours isn't something I'd lose any sleep over, I was just offering an explanation. Your opinions are too skewed to have any relevance.

It was already a sold out game before the ash problem.

Is it just Liverpool fans you have a problem with or does your xenophobia stretch to all fans who aren’t Newcastle fans? Our foreign fans wouldn’t have been able to get there last night, so what? West Ham only brought half their quota and many LFC fans started off for Madrid yesterday morning if that helps. I wouldn’t mind the attendance staying at 37,000 for a season or two, it would mean that all the locals who aren’t prepared to spend hours on the phone trying to get a ticket for their home town team would be able to go to as many matches as they want.. One of my mates who isn’t an STH has to pay 30 quid to be a member of the PTS scheme, which allows him to spend anything between 30 minutes and two hours on the phone applying for a ticket. It wouldn’t be so bad if being a member allowed you to drop in to the TO and buy a ticket from there but there are no window sales anymore. Don't all fans think they're the best in the world? Your view is so full of bile it ceases to have any real meaning.

It's definitely not the UK's second city (that would be Manchester now imo) but the centre is no way a dump either, so it's not 'every one else' is it? The one thing that grabs me about both LFC and MUFC when I go and see them away (always stay overnight), is the huge number of Irish and Scandinavian supporters they both have. In theory, it would be easier for them (Scandinavians at least) to support Newcastle mind. But would we want that? I was referring to Manchester with the second city quote Renton. The two owners of LFC have had offers already that they've turned down. Sheik Mohammed had 500 million on the table for quite a while before the crunch and only recently Gilett was apparently offered 450 million which he firstly accepted and then reneged on so it's anyones guess how much they'll eventually get, or if they want to sell at all in the present financial climate. As for the attractiveness of each club, take away the history and just looking at the two clubs as they stand it would depend on what the buyer is looking for. Newcastle have a great ground but with the listed houses down one side there isn't much scope for improvement to the overall look, though it does look ok as it is. A new build gives the owners more scope to place their own personality on it and also more room for the hated corporate boxes. It's all down to money and how much they'd be willing to spend, and if a new ground is the choice, how long they'd be willing to wait for a return on their investment.

Oh aye so the 30-odd million tonnes of cargo a year that they deal with is all imagination is it? Christ, when was the last time you were there? Late December back in '63. Not always Rob W but it is now. Since the IRA bomb they have gone from strength to strength and now claim themselves to be the second city of the UK. This is helped by the government who want to make Manchester the capital of the north, not just North West, their Whitehall of the north if you will. Manchester has sold itself superbly over the last 20 years, it doesn't matter if what they say isn't strictly true, it's the perception that counts and I wish Liverpool authorities had been as successful at it. Greater Manchester also has 7 or 8 districts who all sing from the same hymn sheet, unlike Liverpools who have petty squabbles about who should get the lions share. The likes of Liverpool, Newcastle and other Northern cities only get a few crumbs in the hope that we won't notice what's going on, but being on our doorstep and sharing the same development agency Liverpool has a birds eye view and is poweless to stop it so it seems. There's one instance that you'll know about because I think your city bid for it, not sure. The super casino. Out of all the places that bid for it Blackpool looked to be the obvious choice. In dire need of investment, a holiday town with plenty of hotel rooms and all of the infrastructure that something like a super casino would need. With a boost like that it could have began to grow and maybe a couple of decades down the line it would have been the UK's answer to Las Vegas. Manchester was picked. It went tits up because of the outcry and now nobody is getting it. All cities have their ups and downs Rob W, Liverpool is on the up.