Who's had the easiest start?

[Park Life 71]

Who's that by? Pam Ayres?

 

Verlaine.

[LeazesMag 0]

Think I'll use the drivel to put £20 on Villa to get relegated. You can get 20/1.

 

Think it don't matter what our results are against the top 2 (they will beat more or less everyone this year).

 

What will make or break our season given that our results against average and weak sides continues is our results against Arsenal, Liv and Spurs...Those games for me are the key indicators.

 

Did you know that Man U did not win a single away game against top half opposition last season?

 

Yet still won the league.

 

 

I make this point (in a roundabout way) quite often about Man U and it can't be underestimated tbh. They will go away and lose at places like Liverpool etc and while the Scousers are there celebrating winning their cup final Ferguson simply won't bat an eyelid at it. He knows Man U will go on and beat the sides (the inferior/'easy' sides) that Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea etc will piss points away to and he picks up the league trophy at the end of the season.

 

The importance of this applies equally to our start to the season. We've played several 'easy' sides but we would routinely piss points away to them/roll over and die in normal circumstances. This season we haven't-we've ground out results, employed gameplans, started with the mindset of not conceding goals, been cynical when necessary (towels) and had a 'never know when we're beaten' mentality and it deserves some fucking credit. As I say, the fact this is our best top flight result sequence in 60 years is an absolute disgrace and does put into perspective why we've never won owt. You can spend truckloads of money but you'll never see the best from that investment unless you've got those basic rudiments in place.

 

I hope to fuck theres just even a moderate amount of investment this winter because it could make a real difference and more to the point this team actually deserves strengthening, the way they're wanting to play for the shirt. Just get half a fucking twitch in your pants, please Mike because this is what it's about. Your coaching staff are showing that even just a few quid is likely to be well deployed so lets treat January as the opportunity to keep pushing forwards, not backwards!!

 

1. do you mean they don't get carried by either a few decent results, or conversely a few bad results, and they know the season ends in May, and not October/November ? Think about it.

 

2. We will not spend the money you advocate. If you don't see this by now, you're an even bigger fuckwit than I thought, and thats saying something.

 

Do you think we will spend this money, or are you going to continue to play the grey man. Don't worry, nobody will laugh at you if you are wrong.

Edited November 4, 2011 by LeazesMag

[Toonpack 7072]

Think I'll use the drivel to put £20 on Villa to get relegated. You can get 20/1.

 

Think it don't matter what our results are against the top 2 (they will beat more or less everyone this year).

 

What will make or break our season given that our results against average and weak sides continues is our results against Arsenal, Liv and Spurs...Those games for me are the key indicators.

 

Did you know that Man U did not win a single away game against top half opposition last season?

 

Yet still won the league.

 

 

I make this point (in a roundabout way) quite often about Man U and it can't be underestimated tbh. They will go away and lose at places like Liverpool etc and while the Scousers are there celebrating winning their cup final Ferguson simply won't bat an eyelid at it. He knows Man U will go on and beat the sides (the inferior/'easy' sides) that Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea etc will piss points away to and he picks up the league trophy at the end of the season.

 

The importance of this applies equally to our start to the season. We've played several 'easy' sides but we would routinely piss points away to them/roll over and die in normal circumstances. This season we haven't-we've ground out results, employed gameplans, started with the mindset of not conceding goals, been cynical when necessary (towels) and had a 'never know when we're beaten' mentality and it deserves some fucking credit. As I say, the fact this is our best top flight result sequence in 60 years is an absolute disgrace and does put into perspective why we've never won owt. You can spend truckloads of money but you'll never see the best from that investment unless you've got those basic rudiments in place.

 

I hope to fuck theres just even a moderate amount of investment this winter because it could make a real difference and more to the point this team actually deserves strengthening, the way they're wanting to play for the shirt. Just get half a fucking twitch in your pants, please Mike because this is what it's about. Your coaching staff are showing that even just a few quid is likely to be well deployed so lets treat January as the opportunity to keep pushing forwards, not backwards!!

 

What an excellent post.

 

And on the "mentality" bit, I read this today, different sport, unbeaten team, coach's view:

 

Question was - can a loss be a good thing.

 

Philosophically, we could talk all day about winning and losing. Winning and losing are representative of the three reinforcement theories – positive, negative and zero. As you develop a program that gives a team the ability to grow, positive reinforcement is the best formula for growth. Historically and through case studies, that’s been proven. Negative reinforcement is a short-term answer for correction, but constant negative reinforcement inhibits growth. I think winning and losing parallels the positive versus negative theory. To answer the question, I don’t think a loss is ever good, but it can give you short-term negative reinforcement to get your focus back in line. As a leader, I feel strongly that I can keep the team focused through winning and positive reinforcement to promote growth and confidence as we move forward. As a result, winning becomes ingrained, habitual and establishes a standard. A loss can be a punch in the mouth, but it inhibits progress. In professional sports, it’s all about winning and progressing to be the best you can be, because if you’re playing the best you can, your chances of winning increase greatly.

 

do you mean "winning mentality" as in finishing 2nd [twice], 3rd [twice], 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th in 14 years ? Including "trophy signings" ie largely players who are used to winning ?

 

Or spending one year almost going down, then relegated, another season coming back, and your first season up selling your best players and pocketing the cash ?

 

Somehow I don't think this will get even a half-intelligent football based reply.

 

 

£52 Million

 

Oh and 13th three times,11th twice and 14th once, for every ying there's a yang

[Park Life 71]

Don't think we'll know what's going on till the end of Jan. That is when the table will be real and also we'll be able to evaluate the transfer window. For now we can just enjoy it whether it's luck or otherwise...Bit of both imo. We've actually got some decent players putting in performances.

[ChezGiven 0]

Who's that by? Pam Ayres?

Cant stop laughing at that

[LeazesMag 0]

Think I'll use the drivel to put £20 on Villa to get relegated. You can get 20/1.

 

Think it don't matter what our results are against the top 2 (they will beat more or less everyone this year).

 

What will make or break our season given that our results against average and weak sides continues is our results against Arsenal, Liv and Spurs...Those games for me are the key indicators.

 

Did you know that Man U did not win a single away game against top half opposition last season?

 

Yet still won the league.

 

 

I make this point (in a roundabout way) quite often about Man U and it can't be underestimated tbh. They will go away and lose at places like Liverpool etc and while the Scousers are there celebrating winning their cup final Ferguson simply won't bat an eyelid at it. He knows Man U will go on and beat the sides (the inferior/'easy' sides) that Liverpool, Arsenal, Chelsea etc will piss points away to and he picks up the league trophy at the end of the season.

 

The importance of this applies equally to our start to the season. We've played several 'easy' sides but we would routinely piss points away to them/roll over and die in normal circumstances. This season we haven't-we've ground out results, employed gameplans, started with the mindset of not conceding goals, been cynical when necessary (towels) and had a 'never know when we're beaten' mentality and it deserves some fucking credit. As I say, the fact this is our best top flight result sequence in 60 years is an absolute disgrace and does put into perspective why we've never won owt. You can spend truckloads of money but you'll never see the best from that investment unless you've got those basic rudiments in place.

 

I hope to fuck theres just even a moderate amount of investment this winter because it could make a real difference and more to the point this team actually deserves strengthening, the way they're wanting to play for the shirt. Just get half a fucking twitch in your pants, please Mike because this is what it's about. Your coaching staff are showing that even just a few quid is likely to be well deployed so lets treat January as the opportunity to keep pushing forwards, not backwards!!

 

What an excellent post.

 

And on the "mentality" bit, I read this today, different sport, unbeaten team, coach's view:

 

Question was - can a loss be a good thing.

 

Philosophically, we could talk all day about winning and losing. Winning and losing are representative of the three reinforcement theories – positive, negative and zero. As you develop a program that gives a team the ability to grow, positive reinforcement is the best formula for growth. Historically and through case studies, that’s been proven. Negative reinforcement is a short-term answer for correction, but constant negative reinforcement inhibits growth. I think winning and losing parallels the positive versus negative theory. To answer the question, I don’t think a loss is ever good, but it can give you short-term negative reinforcement to get your focus back in line. As a leader, I feel strongly that I can keep the team focused through winning and positive reinforcement to promote growth and confidence as we move forward. As a result, winning becomes ingrained, habitual and establishes a standard. A loss can be a punch in the mouth, but it inhibits progress. In professional sports, it’s all about winning and progressing to be the best you can be, because if you’re playing the best you can, your chances of winning increase greatly.

 

do you mean "winning mentality" as in finishing 2nd [twice], 3rd [twice], 4th, 5th, 6th and 7th in 14 years ? Including "trophy signings" ie largely players who are used to winning ?

 

Or spending one year almost going down, then relegated, another season coming back, and your first season up selling your best players and pocketing the cash ?

 

Somehow I don't think this will get even a half-intelligent football based reply.

 

 

£52 Million

 

Oh and 13th three times,11th twice and 14th once, for every ying there's a yang

 

I see, and under your man he has matched/beaten the worst of the old owners once, and been relegated, and is selling our best players.

 

so far under your man, its all "yangs". When will he start backing his manager with the money from sales, and get near matching his predecessors on the pitch etc - and maybe attract supporters like YOU back to games again ?

[peasepud 59]

 

£52 Million

 

Oh and 13th three times,11th twice and 14th once, for every ying there's a yang

Taking the above into account

Average league position 7.6th

Average Ashley league position 15.75th

[Toonpack 7072]

 

£52 Million

 

Oh and 13th three times,11th twice and 14th once, for every ying there's a yang

Taking the above into account

Average league position 7.6th

Average Ashley league position 15.75th

 

It's not about "versus Ashley" it's about sustainability and that 15.75th would have looked mighty good when we had no money.

 

BTW Post 1st Keegan spell, 9.4th (which madly, is good for 5th best evidently)

 

Wonder what £52 Mill would have bought SBR

 

The only ownership in football that has ever made HUGE personal gain, for not a penny risked, whilst in charge of a club (that was genius, of a sort). That in itself should tell you something.

[Happy Face 29]

 

£52 Million

 

Oh and 13th three times,11th twice and 14th once, for every ying there's a yang

Taking the above into account

Average league position 7.6th

Average Ashley league position 15.75th

 

It's not about "versus Ashley" it's about sustainability and that 15.75th would have looked mighty good when we had no money.

 

BTW Post 1st Keegan spell, 9.4th (which madly, is good for 5th best evidently)

 

Wonder what £52 Mill would have bought SBR

 

The only ownership in football that has ever made HUGE personal gain, for not a penny risked, whilst in charge of a club (that was genius, of a sort). That in itself should tell you something.

 

That no-one else has been able to take a club from 3rd division relegation bait to sustained champions league qualification in the past 20 years?

[Toonpack 7072]

 

£52 Million

 

Oh and 13th three times,11th twice and 14th once, for every ying there's a yang

Taking the above into account

Average league position 7.6th

Average Ashley league position 15.75th

 

It's not about "versus Ashley" it's about sustainability and that 15.75th would have looked mighty good when we had no money.

 

BTW Post 1st Keegan spell, 9.4th (which madly, is good for 5th best evidently)

 

Wonder what £52 Mill would have bought SBR

 

The only ownership in football that has ever made HUGE personal gain, for not a penny risked, whilst in charge of a club (that was genius, of a sort). That in itself should tell you something.

 

That no-one else has been able to take a club from 3rd division relegation bait to sustained champions league qualification in the past 20 years?

 

Short lived and intermittent would be more apt, maybe if the team had another £52 Million to play with it might have been sustained.

 

25 years ago Man U were in the bottom 4 (along with us), having a few years previously been relegated ('74) and come back.

[Happy Face 29]

 

£52 Million

 

Oh and 13th three times,11th twice and 14th once, for every ying there's a yang

Taking the above into account

Average league position 7.6th

Average Ashley league position 15.75th

 

It's not about "versus Ashley" it's about sustainability and that 15.75th would have looked mighty good when we had no money.

 

BTW Post 1st Keegan spell, 9.4th (which madly, is good for 5th best evidently)

 

Wonder what £52 Mill would have bought SBR

 

The only ownership in football that has ever made HUGE personal gain, for not a penny risked, whilst in charge of a club (that was genius, of a sort). That in itself should tell you something.

 

That no-one else has been able to take a club from 3rd division relegation bait to sustained champions league qualification in the past 20 years?

 

Short lived and intermittent would be more apt, maybe if the team had another £52 Million to play with it might have been sustained.

 

25 years ago Man U were in the bottom 4 (along with us), having a few years previously been relegated ('74) and come back.

 

Funnily enough, Martin Edwards profited to the tune of......£52m

 

http://m.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/oct/09/martin-edwards-manchester-united-glazers?cat=sport&type=article

 

 

[Toonpack 7072]

 

£52 Million

 

Oh and 13th three times,11th twice and 14th once, for every ying there's a yang

Taking the above into account

Average league position 7.6th

Average Ashley league position 15.75th

 

It's not about "versus Ashley" it's about sustainability and that 15.75th would have looked mighty good when we had no money.

 

BTW Post 1st Keegan spell, 9.4th (which madly, is good for 5th best evidently)

 

Wonder what £52 Mill would have bought SBR

 

The only ownership in football that has ever made HUGE personal gain, for not a penny risked, whilst in charge of a club (that was genius, of a sort). That in itself should tell you something.

 

That no-one else has been able to take a club from 3rd division relegation bait to sustained champions league qualification in the past 20 years?

 

Short lived and intermittent would be more apt, maybe if the team had another £52 Million to play with it might have been sustained.

 

25 years ago Man U were in the bottom 4 (along with us), having a few years previously been relegated ('74) and come back.

 

Funnily enough, Martin Edwards profited to the tune of......£52m

 

http://m.guardian.co...rt&type=article

 

Edwards divested some of his shares periodically to "the city", he made his big wedge at sale. He didn't, for example, sell his shares back to the club and they (Man Utd) have had real sustained success, I think you would agree. He took reasonable dividend and admittedly large salary BUT they were making money and were really succesful.

Man U was floated to raise the money to expand the Stretford end (they said) but it was equally done to make money for the directors. The subsequent behaviour of the directors in terms of share disposal and dividend etc. is incomparable. Especially so, given the financial performance backdrop of us and them.

If we'd had half the success of Man U, do you think I'd begrudge the £52 Mill (which does not include the profit from sale), no way would I. But we haven't and that £52 Mill could have made a huge difference, shit even if it was creaming off profits I'd have less of a gripe, but it wasn't, it was leveraging personal gain from the very fabric of the club, which the club could not afford and had to borrow to pay.

Think of it like performance related pay, you’re saying the owner of Maxwell’s DIY should be rewarded the same as the majority shareholder of B&Q

Good try, but no cigar.

[LeazesMag 0]

oh dear.

 

Toonpack posting about football again, and his exciting visions of the profits Mike Ashley is going to make from continually selling any good player we find and pocketing the cash.

 

We must be the only club in the country not to have matched the success of ManU in the last 25 years, it was obviously because we bought all those "trophy players".

[Happy Face 29]

Outside bottom 6 opponents we've still only won 2 games.

 

I'm still certain we won't beat last seasons finish.

 

And if that means these bell ends keep churning out results and making me look a fucking idiot, then so be it, I prefer to look like a complete Christmas Tree than credit us with a long term chance and jinx it completely.

[McFaul 35]

Outside bottom 6 opponents we've still only won 2 games.

 

I'm still certain we won't beat last seasons finish.

 

And if that means these bell ends keep churning out results and making me look a fucking idiot, then so be it, I prefer to look like a complete Christmas Tree than credit us with a long term chance and jinx it completely.

Outside of top one we've lost nen. Anyone can twist stats. You're too methodical for a young lad you like.

[Happy Face 29]

Woosh?

[ChezGiven 0]

We've without been lucky this season but the early comments about us papering over the cracks no longer hold up. If we go into christmas with 33+ points then I dont think we need to worry about jinxing it, the proof of out credentials as a side will be incontrovertible by then (if they aren't already).

[Happy Face 29]

We've without been lucky this season but the early comments about us papering over the cracks no longer hold up. If we go into christmas with 33+ points then I dont think we need to worry about jinxing it, the proof of out credentials as a side will be incontrovertible by then (if they aren't already).

 

I'm pretty much convinced...but won't be happy until we see what fuck face has up his sleeve in January.

[McFaul 35]

One of the things I'm taking from the last few games is the fact our best player, and without doubt in my view, best players in the Premiership hasn't been there in Tiote. I honestly believe aspects of Tiote's game are as good as Essien, and I can't give him higher praise than that. He's been missing and we've coped very well. Make no mistake about it, in the whole world there's not more than 5 sides better than Man Utd and Man City, and we've competed. If we can just beat Chelsea it could open so many doors for us.

[Guest alex]

Does anyone now think we can come higher than 7th? I don't want to get carried away but looking at the current form and the run of games after Chelsea it's a bit hard not to.

[McFaul 35]

Does anyone now think we can come higher than 7th? I don't want to get carried away but looking at the current form and the run of games after Chelsea it's a bit hard not to.

No one expected Chelsea and Arsenal to be this shit, Chelsea look a spent force like genuinely. Anyone can beat Wolves 3-0, while look at Arsenal like this. They've hammered no one, and I can't think of a team in Europe who would miss a player more than they'd miss van Persie. Look at him like this, he's never went a whole season in his career where he hasn't had at least 6 weeks injured, so it would be a surprise if he lasts looking at it like that, and if he does get injured hand on heart we have a realistic chance, like not bigging us up of finishing ahead of Arsenal. Liverpool well the jury are still out about them, Tottenham nailed for third, but we're still in there, like an unwelcome guest. If we did the unimaginable and came fourth, it would feel like Rocky 4, but it would do wonders for the club in terms of rebuilding the stature internationally, as our last Champions League campaigns did.

[Happy Face 29]

it would feel like Rocky 4

 

 

quality

[Brock Manson 0]

Does anyone now think we can come higher than 7th? I don't want to get carried away but looking at the current form and the run of games after Chelsea it's a bit hard not to.

 

As HF said, it's all up to the fat fuckwit whether we can compete or not.

 

It would be a complete idiot to disrupt a team that's so driven and gelling well, but I fear Colo will be sold in Jan and not be adequately replaced (or at all). It'd leave us severely lacking at the back and on course for an unspectacular mid table finish.

[Guest alex]

Ba and Ben Arfa could definitely cause Chelsea's defence problems. I think Jonas will be a miss for us though as he really helps Ryan Taylor out. That said, hopefully Tiote will be back.

[Guest alex]

Does anyone now think we can come higher than 7th? I don't want to get carried away but looking at the current form and the run of games after Chelsea it's a bit hard not to.

 

As HF said, it's all up to the fat fuckwit whether we can compete or not.

 

It would be a complete idiot to disrupt a team that's so driven and gelling well, but I fear Colo will be sold in Jan and not be adequately replaced (or at all). It'd leave us severely lacking at the back and on course for an unspectacular mid table finish.

It would certainly be a statement of intent to bring a couple of players in and give him a new contract.