Renton 27805 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 I'm curious to how detailed amendments can be. Tbh this parliamentary process is completely arcane and has lost me. I don't get why Johnson didn't just take the win. I think delay was always inevitable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anorthernsoul 1222 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 He didn't mention a GE once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 8367 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 4 minutes ago, Alex said: No because Corbyn I dunno though, not saying it's come from Corbyn but Labour have just managed to have their cake and eat it, with Corbyn standing there making an offer to work with the government to set a responsible timeframe within which to pass the bill. And Johnson just stormed off. Unless this is all part of the grand Cummings plan, i'd say that this was a clanger by Johnson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 39291 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Well if one thing is clear it’s that Cummings never had any grand plan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 8367 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 And its not up to him if we have a GE anyway. So unless he thinks he can get the EU to block the extension and blame everyone else for no deal, idk where we go from here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 22516 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 He’s going to call a vote of no confidence in himself according to sauces Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anorthernsoul 1222 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 I'm not even Armando Iannucci could have written this shambles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 63312 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 24 minutes ago, Rayvin said: I dunno though, not saying it's come from Corbyn but Labour have just managed to have their cake and eat it, with Corbyn standing there making an offer to work with the government to set a responsible timeframe within which to pass the bill. And Johnson just stormed off. Unless this is all part of the grand Cummings plan, i'd say that this was a clanger by Johnson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 42163 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 31 minutes ago, Rayvin said: I dunno though, not saying it's come from Corbyn but Labour have just managed to have their cake and eat it, with Corbyn standing there making an offer to work with the government to set a responsible timeframe within which to pass the bill. And Johnson just stormed off. Unless this is all part of the grand Cummings plan, i'd say that this was a clanger by Johnson. My point is that I think he’s pretty much unelectable. I hope I’m wrong and I’d take him in heartbeat despite my misgivings about him but I see him losing a general election no matter what 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 27805 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Aye, me too. Only comfort is he campaignwe alright last time and Johnson is obviously a fucking arsehole. But is he May levels of bad on the trail? I doubt it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayvin 8367 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 15 minutes ago, Renton said: Aye, me too. Only comfort is he campaignwe alright last time and Johnson is obviously a fucking arsehole. But is he May levels of bad on the trail? I doubt it. Corbyn doesnt need to win. Remain does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 63312 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 One thing is for sure, Johnson is flailing atm. This is not going the way he wants it to - they were desperate to win that programme motion vote tonight, offering concessions, making threats all day. Fuck knows what happens next though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 42163 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Oh aye, this is not some successful part of some master plan. Not in any deliberate sense anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 39291 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 So Tusk is recommending an extension til 31st January. I can’t see anything but a general election at this point. It’s doubtful the numbers are there for a second referendum so GE looks like the only way forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 26385 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 A GE was always the end game. I’m just surprised it took this long Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isegrim 11896 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 1 hour ago, Gemmill said: One thing is for sure, Johnson is flailing atm. This is not going the way he wants it to - they were desperate to win that programme motion vote tonight, offering concessions, making threats all day. Fuck knows what happens next though. He’s about to die in a ditch anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 63312 Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 63312 Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 As soon as the EU confirm the extension to end Jan, the opposition parties should slam in a VONC, form the GNU, amend the fuck out of Johnson's deal and take it to a referendum. If they could get their acts together, this would be the sexy play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 39291 Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 The problem with that is you need someone they can command the support to lead a GNU. But what is more difficult is getting someone capable of doing so for at least six months which is how long it would take a put together a referendum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 39291 Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 Every ERG member interviewed yesterday was saying the same thing, the deal isn't great but it's a start. It's obvious what they meant by that and any Labour member thinking of backing the deal should take notice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 63312 Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 Referendum doesn't need to take 6 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 63312 Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 Heseltine on Sky News saying he doesn't think Johnson can win an election. Says he'll lose seats in Scotland and to the Lib Dems and to assume that they can then make up for all these losses by taking seats from Labour in the North is a massive gamble. Fucking hell, almost makes me want to give them their election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 5305 Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 22 minutes ago, Gemmill said: Referendum doesn't need to take 6 months. It keeps being said that it would and I don't get it - GEs can take 6 weeks and I don't see any difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 63312 Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 15 minutes ago, NJS said: It keeps being said that it would and I don't get it - GEs can take 6 weeks and I don't see any difference. Some fit barrister wife I follow on twitter has done some work on this and she thinks 6 weeks is very doable if the will is there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 39291 Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 (edited) Six weeks my arse. Firstly you need to decide on the question. Is it going to be Johnson's deal vs remain, no deal vs remain, EEA/EFTA vs remain. And the details of each option are going to have to be explicitly laid out. The question then has to be tested by the electoral commission which is takes at least two months. We're then going to need legislation passed to allow for the referendum. There will be demands that EU citizens get to vote, that 16 year olds get to vote, that all four nations have to agree etc etc. You have to remember that this will all be happening under a GNU so consensus will have to be reached on each issue and that alone is going to delay proceedings. Then the EC has to decide who the official campaigns are, then we need time for campaigning. TLDR; never listen to women. Edited October 23, 2019 by ewerk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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