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Rayvin

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Rayvin last won the day on September 23

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About Rayvin

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  1. Politics

    Apparently it's up to Bercow what happens next. So yeah, I think we can assume Parliament is coming back. The UK is just hilarious at the moment
  2. Politics

    Why is the BBC reporting that this is just the first part of the case? What else will follow?
  3. Politics

    It sounded to me like they would just prorogue again.
  4. Politics

    I wasn't especially impressed with his handling of the stop and search nonsense from a couple of years back. Although I suppose in the end I begrudgingly admitted to myself that holding his hands up on it was a positive. Also, I know it's his job but he talks about London as if it's entirely separate to the rest of the UK, and I find it tedious and unnecessarily divisive.
  5. Politics

    I mean, they'll ignore it and carry on as before - what else
  6. Politics

    I struggle with Sadiq Kahn a bit but sounds like he handled himself well here.
  7. Europe --- In or Out

    Fair enough, I'm just saying that the vote's outcome, if all options are clearly specified beforehand, must be honoured. As an aside - YouGov carried out a useful poll: Labour pro-remain campaigners are flagging up some figures from a poll conducted for the People’s Vote campaign. It found that 72% of Labour leave voters said they would definitely not vote Conservative, and 48% said they would definitely not vote for the Brexit party. But only 14% of Labour remain voters said they would definitely not vote Lib Dems. Labour remainers think this shows that the fear of Labour losing millions of voters to leave parties is exaggerated; they claim the real risk is from Labour losing remain votes to the Lib Dems and the Greens. I think it's irrelevant to look at the 72% figure for the Tories since the BP are Tory-lite, so let's say that just over half of Labour Leave voters would consider switching to a Leave Party. Ok, so the numbers on the Remain side are far more damaging to Labour itself, as we all acknowledge. But from the standpoint of getting a referendum, if we can pull some of that 52% of Labour Leave Voters who would be tempted to vote for Farage, back into voting for Labour, it's a victory. On the other hand, it's strangely selfless of Labour to be doing this...
  8. Europe --- In or Out

    If it's another leave victory on a specific set of terms then IMO it has to be enforced. There is no legitimacy in undermining a democratic outcome with a clear direction. The mandate for action would be there, and even if it was no deal, at least it would have been a clear vote. I don't see how anyone can oppose that really. Plenty may leave the country though.
  9. Europe --- In or Out

    But what are you saying, that the EU will deliberately undermine the negotiation to force a Remain vote? That seems unlikely to me since, if they do that, there's still a chance that Labour's deal will 1 - win a referendum and 2 - fail to get through Parliament. This is exactly what Cameron should have done before the original vote. Nail down the terms of what leaving means and put it to the people. But again, how does this -actually- hurt the idea of getting a remain outcome? What you've described about it being incoherent surely only hurts Labour in the eyes of Remainers. Who are going to vote for a Remain party anyway.
  10. Europe --- In or Out

    Good for them. I don't think anyone in here was particularly excited about them having committed crimes or not anyway - it's not like bring found guilty would change anything, as we will see in 30 mins from the government.
  11. Europe --- In or Out

    But how is Labour's stance bad for remaining? It isn't. Honestly, it's better than coming out for remain. I don't believe this idea that no one, in a country of people who bought Brexit, will buy Labours neutrality. It will be worth some votes.
  12. Europe --- In or Out

    Yeah, it's almost as if the party in government should mitigate the damage by getting a "least damaging Brexit deal" option to stand against remain in a referendum, thus giving the people a reasonably safe and informed democratic exercise which can be used to resolve this matter once and for all. Its actually a real shame it's Labour who are doing that since if any other party did it the media would be talking about it as if it was the most sensible thing anyone anywhere had ever proposed. Because it's Labour the whole strategy is being consumed by rabid anti-Corbynism. I've been paying attention to Swinson over the past few days for the first time and am not sold on her at all. I don't like throwing around labels about people being closet Tories but fucking hell. Were the Lib Dems always like this or is it new? I'm wondering if i just never really noticed - I always had them as soft left.
  13. Europe --- In or Out

    Sure, but for all the hand wringing over Labour's position I'm yet to hear anyone tell me why it is actually a bad thing other than emotional hysteria, at least in terms of remaining in the EU. I mean sure, if you want an outright Labour government it's very dubious that the current position will enable that, but does anyone getting worked up about that care very much on this front? And surely any variant of Mays deal kills FOM. I can't support it on that basis alone. Even taking my personal feelings out of it, if we lose FOM then we also lose Scotland. And probably NI.
  14. Europe --- In or Out

    The Daily Mail was rubbing its hands with glee for the chance to openly call Labour a Remain party yesterday. Also I suspect the opportunity to make Corbyn look weak. I don't understand this knee jerk hysteria from the media. I mean i know that's a fairly standard position for me but they're off the deep end this time, at least the ones who want to remain. I can see why the right wing press would make a big fuss about this. I suspect there is a large enough chunk of society that is not enthusiastically supporting Leave or Remain, to whom Labour's middle ground position might appeal, for this to be a worthwhile gamble. Any remain voters will go for Labour in their usual seats anyway because we still get a second referendum. All yesterday confirms is that they won't fight an election with the LDs as their primary opponents.
  15. Europe --- In or Out

    Also, were you not coming around to Labour's position the other day?

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