LeazesMag 0 Posted August 17, 2005 Share Posted August 17, 2005 (edited) I've never understood why all these hangers and floggers don't move to Saudi Arabia or Iran so they can live a life free from the worries of crime 13589[/snapback] good on yer Rob. Ref the threads about scumbags, and national service and your comment that it's alright for yobbos to stand around on street corners annoying and scaring people etc etc as they aren't breaking any laws, and letting them all see the law is an ass which encourages them to move onto bigger things...ie ref a few recent murders, muggings, and did you see the news tonight about that lad with cerebral palsy who has had his wheelchair nicked ? It all has its roots in hanging around on street corners and a lack of respect for the law and the knowledge if they get caught nothing much will happen to them anyway. The ones among us prepared to back moves to show such utter shitebags who mug old people, kids, women etc etc even just annoying and scaring people as stated above, and give them the feckin good hiding and treatment they well and truly deserve and a lesson they will never forget, and the best you can do is say we should be sent to live in Saudi etc. Edited August 17, 2005 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I wish I'd been brought up in the 60's where there was no crime and everyone used to share a privvy at the end of the street etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I wish I'd been brought up in the 60's where there was no crime and everyone used to share a privvy at the end of the street etc. 14186[/snapback] yeh Alex, there was crime, of course there was. Such as the Train Robbery, Myra Hindley etc there is always crime. There just seems to be more now though. I may be wrong too as I was young, but I don't recollect kids, and older kids being allowed to harras, mug or beat up old women, kids etc ... and a few lads I knew were right arseholes but they still knew that sort of thing wasn't on - and they knew would be right in the shit if they did it too. Anyway. The most important thing is what happens now and how can it be tackled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I wish I'd been brought up in the 60's where there was no crime and everyone used to share a privvy at the end of the street etc. 14186[/snapback] Somehow I don't quite remember it like that.................. apart form the privy of course ... at least the seat was always warm............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyluke 1 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 Ahh the good old days - where you could leave you door open, walk down the street at night and were dead of TB by the age of 40. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 "the best you can do is say we should be sent to live in Saudi etc." NO - I was suggesting if you are so concerned and admire they way they live you might want to move yourself there I'm afraid you can't wind the clock back - "respect" was built on a much more stratified and disciplined society. People "knew their place", there was no satire, the papers and the meeja never published personal details (good or bad) about people's (especially important people) lives, hypocrisy was rife, coppers could do no wrong and hey! if they did hang the wrong person every so often who cared? Women stayed at home and if they were lucky only got a beating once a week - and everyone knew about the weird priest or scout master but did nothing about it. Black folk kept their heads down and queers got bashed. Only 5% of the population went to University and most of those went from private schools There were 2 TV channels and they used to stop broadcasting between 18:00 and 19:00 so people could have their tea uninterrupted. We live in a different world - some of it is better, some of it is worse - but you can't unwind it I'm afraid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 "the best you can do is say we should be sent to live in Saudi etc." NO - I was suggesting if you are so concerned and admire they way they live you might want to move yourself there I'm afraid you can't wind the clock back - "respect" was built on a much more stratified and disciplined society. People "knew their place", there was no satire, the papers and the meeja never published personal details (good or bad) about people's (especially important people) lives, hypocrisy was rife, coppers could do no wrong and hey! if they did hang the wrong person every so often who cared? Women stayed at home and if they were lucky only got a beating once a week - and everyone knew about the weird priest or scout master but did nothing about it. Black folk kept their heads down and queers got bashed. Only 5% of the population went to University and most of those went from private schools There were 2 TV channels and they used to stop broadcasting between 18:00 and 19:00 so people could have their tea uninterrupted. We live in a different world - some of it is better, some of it is worse - but you can't unwind it I'm afraid 14335[/snapback] What a sensible post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 (edited) "the best you can do is say we should be sent to live in Saudi etc." NO - I was suggesting if you are so concerned and admire they way they live you might want to move yourself there I'm afraid you can't wind the clock back - "respect" was built on a much more stratified and disciplined society. People "knew their place", there was no satire, the papers and the meeja never published personal details (good or bad) about people's (especially important people) lives, hypocrisy was rife, coppers could do no wrong and hey! if they did hang the wrong person every so often who cared? Women stayed at home and if they were lucky only got a beating once a week - and everyone knew about the weird priest or scout master but did nothing about it. Black folk kept their heads down and queers got bashed. Only 5% of the population went to University and most of those went from private schools There were 2 TV channels and they used to stop broadcasting between 18:00 and 19:00 so people could have their tea uninterrupted. We live in a different world - some of it is better, some of it is worse - but you can't unwind it I'm afraid 14335[/snapback] I've never admired the way they live. However there seems to be plenty of people who are happy with them bringing their way of life to the UK, unless a lot of them happen to move into your street that is ....... The only thing myself and the others appear to be saying is: enough is enough. Violence is increasing, especially the cowardly type we are on about, that is what the national service thread is all about. You don't directly answer my questions actually about the cerebral palsy lad or what we should do if we catch him, muggers etc, apart from past comments about similar things where you say "they've done their time set them free" - when the sentence has been a joke. IMO the victims should be the ones to get the sympathy not the perpetrators, but you clearly don't agree. You also said earlier, kids hanging around annoying people, and having no respect for others "aren't breaking the law". We are saying in that case the law is an arse and as they have no respect for others measures need to be taken to ensure they develop them, rather than the other way round. You clearly think otherwise, and just wish to bury your head in the sand and hope it goes away. Edited August 18, 2005 by LeazesMag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 (edited) If there was a simple answer someone would have found it a long time ago..... God knows I've seen just about everything tried....... Let's say we decide to bang up anyone who commits a crime of violence According to the INTERPOL data, for murder, the rate in 2001 was 1.63 per 100,000 population for United Kingdom. For rape, it was 16.50. For aggravated assault, the rate was 30.07 = 38.2 serious crimes per 100,00 0 = circa 22,000 serious crimes of violence So we're going to lock up 22,000 criminals (assuming the police can catch them of course). Now its crazy to think that this will NOT affect future crime rates so lets asssume it cuts the next year's figures by 25%.... In 9 years we will have cut crime to 10% of 2001's numbers We will have 81,000 seriously violent people in jail (= 20 new jails at a capital cost of £ 2 billion + ££ in operating cost) Now comes the problem.... when do you let them out? It's well established that prisons take in bad people and make them worse Lets assume reoffending rates are the same as today = 58% in 2 years of release ... so in year 10 you release the 22,000 you banged up in year 1 but then 12700 of then reoffend in years 11-12......................... So what do you do? keep them all in for life? I wouldn't want to work in a prison with 4000 people without any hope of release - how would you punish them if they riot for example??? Is anyone suggesting we execute 22,000 people a year????? As I said - its harder than you think Suggestions NOT on post card please.................. Edited August 18, 2005 by Rob W Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 got to go....quick answer for now, I have never suggested execution for anything other than prem-meditated murder, or terrorists. Just an attempt to improve behaviour, and standards of respect in kids to take into adult life, and a damn good lesson for those who take advantage of the vulnerable, to teach them the error of their ways, without the parents screaming that their little angel is a lovely little laddie and wouldn't do such a thing when they can't be arsed to bother with them themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jusoda Kid 1 Posted August 18, 2005 Author Share Posted August 18, 2005 their little angel is a lovely little laddie and wouldn't do such a thing when they can't be arsed to bother with them themselves. 14410[/snapback] That last line sums it up for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papa Lazaru 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 The arguemt that we live ina different world and that we can never go back and have to accept it is basicall bollocks when you see plenty of ither countries having nowhere near our problem with chavs, lack of respect, juvenile crime of the scale and all the other yobbish culture we have. A mate of mine via his Phd has been to places like Switzerland, Austria and Scandinavi and the difference in their youths to our is embrassing. If they can do it we can, or at least should have been, now it may well be a bit late to sort this generation out, but we could start on the next one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo 133 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 The arguemt that we live ina different world and that we can never go back and have to accept it is basicall bollocks when you see plenty of ither countries having nowhere near our problem with chavs, lack of respect, juvenile crime of the scale and all the other yobbish culture we have. A mate of mine via his Phd has been to places like Switzerland, Austria and Scandinavi and the difference in their youths to our is embrassing. If they can do it we can, or at least should have been, now it may well be a bit late to sort this generation out, but we could start on the next one! 14508[/snapback] You could have just cut and pasted some statistical drivel ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 Ahhh Switzerland - where they only gave women the vote a few years ago, where they sit on all that german Holocaust money and no-one makes waves............. or Austria whose relativily recent president had a... chequered past?...... and no-one had the balls to investigate him - certainly none of the meeja there Scandinavia (and Switzerland) - ever noticed how boring they are? that's because everyone thinks the same all the time........................... My point, Papa, was OUR culture has changed - for better for worse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papa Lazaru 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 Ahhh Switzerland - where they only gave women the vote a few years ago, where they sit on all that german Holocaust money and no-one makes waves............. or Austria whose relativily recent president had a... chequered past?...... and no-one had the balls to investigate him - certainly none of the meeja there Scandinavia (and Switzerland) - ever noticed how boring they are? that's because everyone thinks the same all the time........................... My point, Papa, was OUR culture has changed - for better for worse 14512[/snapback] None of the things you mentioned is relevent to the argument that its quite possible to have children and teenagers who on the whole are respectful of authority and not a bunch of chavs and yobs! I'm not claiming those countries are perfect in every possible way. Though since its a favourite of yours its noticeable that Switzerland still has national service and has well behaved youths! As for them being boring, firstly thats pretty offensive to them and secondly if they were, so what? you yourself don't have to be boring but you can live in a better society and atmosphere away from some of the vermin we have. Ours has changed i agree with you, but doesn't mean you can't sort kids and youths out starting with parents, schools, juvenile crime ad punishment and any other area you think affects the situation, just that the people in charge won't as they're idiots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo 133 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 Ahhh Switzerland - where they only gave women the vote a few years ago, where they sit on all that german Holocaust money and no-one makes waves............. or Austria whose relativily recent president had a... chequered past?...... and no-one had the balls to investigate him - certainly none of the meeja there Scandinavia (and Switzerland) - ever noticed how boring they are? that's because everyone thinks the same all the time........................... My point, Papa, was OUR culture has changed - for better for worse 14512[/snapback] None of the things you mentioned is relevent to the argument that its quite possible to have children and teenagers who on the whole are respectful of authority and not a bunch of chavs and yobs! I'm not claiming those countries are perfect in every possible way. Though since its a favourite of yours its noticeable that Switzerland still has national service and has well behaved youths! As for them being boring, firstly thats pretty offensive to them and secondly if they were, so what? you yourself don't have to be boring but you can live in a better society and atmosphere away from some of the vermin we have. Ours has changed i agree with you, but doesn't mean you can't sort kids and youths out starting with parents, schools, juvenile crime ad punishment and any other area you think affects the situation, just that the people in charge won't as they're idiots. 14543[/snapback] Can I seek asylum in Switzerland ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I blame Julie Burchill to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papa Lazaru 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 Ahhh Switzerland - where they only gave women the vote a few years ago, where they sit on all that german Holocaust money and no-one makes waves............. or Austria whose relativily recent president had a... chequered past?...... and no-one had the balls to investigate him - certainly none of the meeja there Scandinavia (and Switzerland) - ever noticed how boring they are? that's because everyone thinks the same all the time........................... My point, Papa, was OUR culture has changed - for better for worse 14512[/snapback] None of the things you mentioned is relevent to the argument that its quite possible to have children and teenagers who on the whole are respectful of authority and not a bunch of chavs and yobs! I'm not claiming those countries are perfect in every possible way. Though since its a favourite of yours its noticeable that Switzerland still has national service and has well behaved youths! As for them being boring, firstly thats pretty offensive to them and secondly if they were, so what? you yourself don't have to be boring but you can live in a better society and atmosphere away from some of the vermin we have. Ours has changed i agree with you, but doesn't mean you can't sort kids and youths out starting with parents, schools, juvenile crime ad punishment and any other area you think affects the situation, just that the people in charge won't as they're idiots. 14543[/snapback] Can I seek asylum in Switzerland ? 14546[/snapback] As long as you adhere to their strict rule on no masturbation whatsoever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Papa Lazaru 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 I blame Julie Burchill to be honest. 14547[/snapback] I'm always happy to shove blame for various things on to her, its basically deserved whether its her fault or not! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 "Can I seek asylum in Switzerland ?" they don't DO asylum - ask the German Jews.... oh... there don't seem to be any around.......................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob W 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 Jimbo wrote "You could have just cut and pasted some statistical drivel !" I'll have you know I worked that out myself in the company's time and the scientific method is to come up with YOUR numbers - of course if you can't add up or you don't understand the maths ............... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 The arguemt that we live ina different world and that we can never go back and have to accept it is basicall bollocks when you see plenty of ither countries having nowhere near our problem with chavs, lack of respect, juvenile crime of the scale and all the other yobbish culture we have. A mate of mine via his Phd has been to places like Switzerland, Austria and Scandinavi and the difference in their youths to our is embrassing. If they can do it we can, or at least should have been, now it may well be a bit late to sort this generation out, but we could start on the next one! 14508[/snapback] You could have just cut and pasted some statistical drivel ! 14510[/snapback] I didn't have time to add that !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14085 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 96% of British Muslims think statistics are bollocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyluke 1 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 "Can I seek asylum in Switzerland ?" they don't DO asylum - ask the German Jews.... oh... there don't seem to be any around.......................... 14587[/snapback] We're not exactly guilt-free in that regard either Rob. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted August 18, 2005 Share Posted August 18, 2005 96% of British Muslims think statistics are bollocks. 14689[/snapback] what about german ones ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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