martins' pace

[Guest alex]

Given the pace of the Italian game, I can imagine he looked like shit off a stainless steel shovel over there-but would only look average pace over here.

 

Our games played at far too high a tempo tbh, to the detriment of technical ability. Which is why we are always ultimately fucking gash at international level, where skill will nearly always win out over athleticism.

 

Not sure I quite subscribe to that logic.

Agree with the second bit but not the first.

Seconded. But I think the difference between defending in Italy and England is that it is here far more physical. In Italy players can run with the ball and deep positioned and use their pace to get past them. In England players normally don't even get time to control the ball without being under pressure. That is why Martins looked horrible in his first to games. He more or less got man-marked by Mellberg and Knight who didn't even give him a iota of space to break free and as soon as he got the ball were pushing him around. Only if Martins is getting used to this and being able to shake off defenders he will be able to become a hit in the Premierleague.

Tino was great in Europe and poor in the Premier League for similar reasons. Ditto: Boumsong, Luque and Viana not making it here.

Edited September 19, 2006 by alex

[manc-mag 1]

My logic is flawless WAISAD

[Guest alex]

My logic is flawless WAISAD

Wouldn't you say the difference in the pace of the game in Italy and England is more down the tempo at which the game is played as a whole, rather than the pace at which the players themselves can run though?

[manc-mag 1]

My logic is flawless WAISAD

Wouldn't you say the difference in the pace of the game in Italy and England is more down the tempo at which the game is played as a whole, rather than the pace at which the players themselves can run though?

 

Yes, I'd say the pace is driven by the way we play the game (mentality) as opposed to it being simply due to a proponderance of fast players speeding it up. However I think because of the way we play it (fast) it places a premium on fast players and they tend to rise to a high level in the domestic game. However this is probably a level which is beyond their competence (as footballers) at international level.

 

The same applies to the numerous 'athletes' we have in our team who can run and run about all day. Excellent ability to have of course, but not as good as the ability to simply keep hold the ball in the first place and use it judisciously.

[Guest alex]

My logic is flawless WAISAD

Wouldn't you say the difference in the pace of the game in Italy and England is more down the tempo at which the game is played as a whole, rather than the pace at which the players themselves can run though?

 

Yes, I'd say the pace is driven by the way we play the game (mentality) as opposed to it being simply due to a proponderance of fast players speeding it up. However I think because of the way we play it (fast) it places a premium on fast players and they tend to rise to a high level in the domestic game. However this is probably a level which is beyond their competence (as footballers) at international level.

 

The same applies to the numerous 'athletes' we have in our team who can run and run about all day. Excellent ability to have of course, but not as good as the ability to simply keep hold the ball in the first place and use it judisciously.

Would agree there and although I think pace is highly-valued in all types of football I reckon the ability of players to be able to 'run all day' is probably of more concern in England than in, say, Spain or Italy.

[manc-mag 1]

Good, cos you were close to getting laced there tbf.

[Guest alex]

Good, cos you were close to getting laced there tbf.

[Dr Gloom 20030]

anyone reckon martins will be able to play alongside owen whenever he recovers from injury? i can't see them working that well together tbh.

[nufc4ever 0]

I only saw the highlights on Sunday, but at times he looked pretty bloody swift to me.

[luckyluke 1]

Given the pace of the Italian game, I can imagine he looked like shit off a stainless steel shovel over there-but would only look average pace over here.

 

Our games played at far too high a tempo tbh, to the detriment of technical ability. Which is why we are always ultimately fucking gash at international level, where skill will nearly always win out over athleticism.

 

Not sure I quite subscribe to that logic.

Agree with the second bit but not the first.

Seconded. But I think the difference between defending in Italy and England is that it is here far more physical. In Italy players can run with the ball and deep positioned and use their pace to get past them. In England players normally don't even get time to control the ball without being under pressure. That is why Martins looked horrible in his first to games. He more or less got man-marked by Mellberg and Knight who didn't even give him a iota of space to break free and as soon as he got the ball were pushing him around. Only if Martins is getting used to this and being able to shake off defenders he will be able to become a hit in the Premierleague.

 

He managed to hold of that defender pretty well to set up Duff on Sunday.

[Bombadil 0]

Given the pace of the Italian game, I can imagine he looked like shit off a stainless steel shovel over there-but would only look average pace over here.

 

Our games played at far too high a tempo tbh, to the detriment of technical ability. Which is why we are always ultimately fucking gash at international level, where skill will nearly always win out over athleticism.

 

Not sure I quite subscribe to that logic.

Agree with the second bit but not the first.

Seconded. But I think the difference between defending in Italy and England is that it is here far more physical. In Italy players can run with the ball and deep positioned and use their pace to get past them. In England players normally don't even get time to control the ball without being under pressure. That is why Martins looked horrible in his first to games. He more or less got man-marked by Mellberg and Knight who didn't even give him a iota of space to break free and as soon as he got the ball were pushing him around. Only if Martins is getting used to this and being able to shake off defenders he will be able to become a hit in the Premierleague.

 

He managed to hold of that defender pretty well to set up Duff on Sunday.

 

That was Mascherano though. Another lazy foreigner tbh.

[Baggio 0]

anyone reckon martins will be able to play alongside owen whenever he recovers from injury? i can't see them working that well together tbh.

 

I can't see why not, Arsenal don't play with a big man up front and IMO they play the best football in the league, Wenger has said before that he doesn't play a target man as players will often play long balls rather than keep it on the ground.

 

As for his pace, just because we haven't seen him make a 50 yard sprint doesn't mean he can't do it as fast as they say, seems a little knee jerk tbh

[2bias 3]

seeing some of martins goals for inter he can show some brilliance at times and i think after hes got a couple more games under him we'll start seeing the best of him.

[luckyluke 1]

anyone reckon martins will be able to play alongside owen whenever he recovers from injury? i can't see them working that well together tbh.

 

I can't see why not, Arsenal don't play with a big man up front and IMO they play the best football in the league, Wenger has said before that he doesn't play a target man as players will often play long balls rather than keep it on the ground.

 

But then again Arsenal don't have Bramble twatting it upfield every time he gets the ball.

[Park Life 70]

anyone reckon martins will be able to play alongside owen whenever he recovers from injury? i can't see them working that well together tbh.

 

I can't see why not, Arsenal don't play with a big man up front and IMO they play the best football in the league, Wenger has said before that he doesn't play a target man as players will often play long balls rather than keep it on the ground.

 

But then again Arsenal don't have Bramble twatting it upfield every time he gets the ball.

 

That is one thing that HAS to STOP.

[Tooj 17]

You can clearly see the pace is there, but with a player of such pace opposition defences are playing alot deeper thus not allowing him not to get in behind, and we really should be exploiting this with our midfield players driving forward, unfortunately this is not happening.

[Baggio 0]

Clicky

 

Van Der Mayde thinks he's the fastest player on Earth.

Edited September 22, 2006 by Baggio

[Guest alex]

Love the start of Van Der Meyde's bit about Emre: "He is an aggressive little man.."

[Baggio 0]

Love the start of Van Der Meyde's bit about Emre: "He is an aggressive little man.."

 

[David Kelly 1117]

You can clearly see the pace is there, but with a player of such pace opposition defences are playing alot deeper thus not allowing him not to get in behind, and we really should be exploiting this with our midfield players driving forward, unfortunately this is not happening.

 

This is why I think Dyer could be very important for us if he ever plays again. His pace and running from midfield would give opposition defences something to think about and create more space for Martins to run into.

[Guest Patrokles]

anyone reckon martins will be able to play alongside owen whenever he recovers from injury? i can't see them working that well together tbh.

 

I can't see why not, Arsenal don't play with a big man up front and IMO they play the best football in the league, Wenger has said before that he doesn't play a target man as players will often play long balls rather than keep it on the ground.

 

But then again Arsenal don't have Bramble twatting it upfield every time he gets the ball.

 

Think Bramble's days are close to numbered now, to be fair.

[gram 0]

anyone reckon martins will be able to play alongside owen whenever he recovers from injury? i can't see them working that well together tbh.

 

I can't see why not, Arsenal don't play with a big man up front and IMO they play the best football in the league, Wenger has said before that he doesn't play a target man as players will often play long balls rather than keep it on the ground.

 

But then again Arsenal don't have Bramble twatting it upfield every time he gets the ball.

 

Think Bramble's days are close to numbered now, to be fair.

they would be if peter ramage showed talent or steven taylor justified anywhere near the hype. Neither have

[Guest Patrokles]

anyone reckon martins will be able to play alongside owen whenever he recovers from injury? i can't see them working that well together tbh.

 

I can't see why not, Arsenal don't play with a big man up front and IMO they play the best football in the league, Wenger has said before that he doesn't play a target man as players will often play long balls rather than keep it on the ground.

 

But then again Arsenal don't have Bramble twatting it upfield every time he gets the ball.

 

Think Bramble's days are close to numbered now, to be fair.

they would be if peter ramage showed talent or steven taylor justified anywhere near the hype. Neither have

 

I'd prefer either to Bramble, though. His first-team days aren't entirely assured now.

[gram 0]

anyone reckon martins will be able to play alongside owen whenever he recovers from injury? i can't see them working that well together tbh.

 

I can't see why not, Arsenal don't play with a big man up front and IMO they play the best football in the league, Wenger has said before that he doesn't play a target man as players will often play long balls rather than keep it on the ground.

 

But then again Arsenal don't have Bramble twatting it upfield every time he gets the ball.

 

Think Bramble's days are close to numbered now, to be fair.

they would be if peter ramage showed talent or steven taylor justified anywhere near the hype. Neither have

 

I'd prefer either to Bramble, though. His first-team days aren't entirely assured now.

That is quite illogical. Bramble is poor at times but to prefer Ramage is just bizarre. Could be wrong but smacks of anyone but him. Believe me Ramage will get murdered at centre half this season. He is also more than capable of fucking up - sadly he has done it this season and against our opponents on Sunday, amongst others.

None of the above are the answer but Bramble is more accomplished than the other two at present by a country mile despite his obvious flaws.

[Guest Patrokles]

anyone reckon martins will be able to play alongside owen whenever he recovers from injury? i can't see them working that well together tbh.

 

I can't see why not, Arsenal don't play with a big man up front and IMO they play the best football in the league, Wenger has said before that he doesn't play a target man as players will often play long balls rather than keep it on the ground.

 

But then again Arsenal don't have Bramble twatting it upfield every time he gets the ball.

 

Think Bramble's days are close to numbered now, to be fair.

they would be if peter ramage showed talent or steven taylor justified anywhere near the hype. Neither have

 

I'd prefer either to Bramble, though. His first-team days aren't entirely assured now.

That is quite illogical. Bramble is poor at times but to prefer Ramage is just bizarre. Could be wrong but smacks of anyone but him. Believe me Ramage will get murdered at centre half this season. He is also more than capable of fucking up - sadly he has done it this season and against our opponents on Sunday, amongst others.

None of the above are the answer but Bramble is more accomplished than the other two at present by a country mile despite his obvious flaws.

 

Until you've seen Ramage play more than two games (in which he's done better than Bramble) at centre-back, I find it hard to work out how you've come to the conclusion that you have. Mr. logic.