aimaad22

Why do people like Moore? He's better than Shambles agreed but he's far from what I'd call premier league class. He had a poor game at Old Trafford and he was no better yesterday. Of course Brambles clowning takes the eye of his performances a bit.

Taylor really isn't much better. What! Taylor has had a slippery moment or two but he's still miles better than Bramble. With a bit more experience he could turn out to be solid defender. He's already better than any of our other defenders anyway. Unfortunately that's far, far from true based on this season's form. Tayor hasnt played a lot to be honest, but yes you are right he has been nervy just like the others. But he's not as bad as Bramble, the main reason for that being nobody could possible be as bad as Bramble. Im not complimenting Taylor. Both Titus and him have been bad, but Shambles has been far worse. I still think he can do a better job than Moore and Ramage though

Taylor really isn't much better. What! Taylor has had a slippery moment or two but he's still miles better than Bramble. With a bit more experience he could turn out to be solid defender. He's already better than any of our other defenders anyway.

Its not just Bramble, Carr has been just as pathetic. Ive never seen a player loose form like he has over the last two years. He was okay when he came, solid. But now, he's probably the easiest full back to play against in the league.

When we went 2-1 down, one would expect the manager to show some movement from the sideline. Try to lift the boys, change things around a bit and push them for a fightback. But Roeder just stood there looking like an idiot and made the same changes he does everytime, after it was too late by the way. What worries me nearly as much as our comical defence is the team's lack of fighting spirit and belief, and only the manager is to be blamed for that. We just faded away today after they went up, like we always do.

Who needs defenders? We dont need defenders! What we need is two expensive new strikers in January!

I thought Emre played better than everyone else bar Taylor yesterday, and he's been very solid so far this season. But Im sure you thought Nicky Butt was better.

Bramble was rubbish from minute one on Sunday. His concentration does fade as the game goes on, but he is still more than likely to make one of his trademark errors in the first half.

We were concentrating on signing the likes of Rossi and Sibierski for nothing, while we also could have brought in Campbell, Woodgate and Bridge for nothing as well. Why that didnt cross Roeder's mind is beyond me, and thats what Im saying he should have done.

Despite that he had 3 or 4 good oppurtunities to score. So he gets into goalscoring areas allright. The worry for me is his finishing at the moment. Hopefully with a bit more match practise he'll sort that out.

Some of N'Zogbia crosses were brilliant as well. You would think Sibierski would get on the end of one of them but it wasnt to be....

Those corners were disappointing, but that is bound to happen once or twice in a match. I didnt see too much wrong with the rest of his crossing, it was just that nobody seemed to be getting on the end of one. Missing Big Al badly...........

You'd look a bit of a twat if you did say I told you so seen as we all knew it anyway. You cock. The fact is most people thought I was nuts for suggesting that in a thread I started before the season began. The fact is they didn't. Our top priority was a striker as we physically didn't have any. Next it was defenders as we had some, but they weren't good enough. Therefore, when people said a striker was top priority, it didn't mean they thought we didn't need defenders. Anyone with half a brain would have told you we needed defenders. As you've so eloquently proven. Where have I said nobody though we didnt need defenders? Ive been saying all along that the opinion was we needed strikers more. We did need strikers, but not more badly than a decent CB. I'd rather be stuck with Ameobi, Luque and Rossi than with Titus, Carr and Ramage.

Milner was class today, not only his attacking play but he tracked back a fair bit as well. Emre was decent, not creating much on the ground but his crossing and set-pieces were very accurate for the most part. Marins should have scored a hattrick, seemed a bit nervy and the finishing wasnt there. But he's got the desire and with a few more games I think he'll start taking those chances. Our undoing was again the defence, absolutely pathetic.

You can't judge Ramage based on his performances at left-back. Which is what a few seem to be doing. Yes, but I havent been impressed with him at CB either.

Solid in parts, but it was his nervy clearence that eventually led to the Everton goal. He's okay, but far from what we need.

You'd look a bit of a twat if you did say I told you so seen as we all knew it anyway. You cock. The fact is most people thought I was nuts for suggesting that in a thread I started before the season began.

Ramage is rubbish as well. To be honest, every player in defence was rubbish today although Moore was slightly more solid. We need to revamp the whole defence. But fully expect us to splash out 15M on a stiker in January. Bramble is nothing short of an embarrasement, worst player in the premiership no doubt.

So nobody still thinks we need a defender more, apart from wykikitoon? Hate to say I told you so, but its pretty obvious now which area needs more strenghtening.

Aye, if the officials had spotted that that would have been the end of the game there and then for us. What was he thinking exactly? Hope to hell, when Bernard does return, he can find his form and keep Babayaro out of the team.

Will definitely download that. But isnt posting these clips illegal now?

Ah Pascal's dilemma - If I'm right and death is death then you've lost nothing but if you're right then I've lost everything. Only problem is your "specific" truth has to be the right one so your's is just as much a "gamble" as mine. Mine is not a gamble, it is a firm belief and I have no problems dying with it. You guys dont exactly live in a haven for islamic scholars do you? So im not surprised you havent met any. Im not pulling out of this debate because you've shattered my belief misters, its because i am not disillusioned about my capabilites on the matter. I am 18 and i know my knowledge of religion and philosphy is not extensive enough for me to rage on about it in such a situatuon, yet. I suggest you go and sart this debate on an islamic board where you will expect to find serious answers.

Would just like to say that the verse from the Quran which explains God has blinded the people who refuse to look into the truth leaps to my mind after reading this thread. The funny thing is that after reading the posts here my faith has been doubly strenghtened, because your reaction is exactly what the Quran said a 1500 years back it would be. This has almost been like a laboratory experiment. Im astonished to be honest. Of course you dont believe in any of that so you think im talking rubbish. So I think convincing you people is beyond me now, its a job for a proper scholar, not me. We have our own beliefs, once we die with them we'll see what happens. Until then enjoy life and be happy

What the......where did you get that from?? Its says nothing of the sort. Only in self-defence. Thats what most people dont get. Its not Islam or Christianity that have bought the world to war, its exactly the opposite. Its people either forgetting, or completely altering the teachings of Islam and Christianity that has led to this stage. How many people on this thread have said 'I dont give a crap about religion'? Thats happening all over the world, people forgetting true religion or altering it to suit whatever they feel like at the time. Its not just happening to religion, while muslims and christians are forgetting what their religion tells them, ethics morals etc are disappearing gradually on the world level, no doubt about it. Out of context no doubt On your second point its the usual "atheists have no morals" bollocks. As part of my interest in evolution/creationism debates I found out that there were MORE murders in the US before Darwin produced his "satanic" book - this was used to counter the argument that the "downfall" of religion had led to ethical decline. Tell me who has better morals - someone like me who is "good" because I believe in the good of humanity as a whole or someone who is "good" because he desires a reward of paradise or avoidance of hell? Where does the Quran say to kill the non-believers?? Its seems to be stressing the point that Allah is the one who will deal with them. One who wants paradise will also want the good of humanity, since that is the way to heaven according to all religions. A lot of evil in this world is brought about by people who dont believe in heaven or hell thus not giving a damn as to their behaviour on the planet. But the answer to your question can vary from person to person. According to religion, both will lead you to heaven.

A good post. Anyone who thinks all muslims are like the lunatics we hear from all the time is wrong, but that doesn't hide certain facts. And one of those is that as a religion it has far more angry, volatile, over the top and at times extremely violent reactions to any random slight they percieve. To challenge the view your religion is evil and hate filled by bombing churches, attacking a nun and holding mass protests round the world wanting the pope dead etc. because he mentioned some quote from years ago is just frightening! And that following on from attacks on all things Danish when they published some cartoons in a newspaper, and there are other examples which always result in mass angry protests. I hate all orgaised religions to be honest, but if somebody had come out and said the same comments about christianity you would probably have had a few priests on tv have a whinge and a few people getting mildly annoyed and probably not much else, particularly as the quote was from the bloody middle ages or soemthign like that! People who think all muslims are like that and think they are actually evil etc. would be morons, but anyone who doesn't think as a religion it has far more dangerous and over the top reactions than other religions and leads to more trouble these days are being naive. I mean when was the last time you can ever remember any catholics, protestants, jews, buddhists, mormons, quakers, jedis...etc. etc. going around burning, torching and destroying things and demanding the death of people who have insulted them, not very likely is it? And i don't like those religions either (except the Buddhists and Jedis of course!) but you don't see this same problem en masse with them. And as somebody mentioned earlier in the thread i found it amusing that the pope apologised since he's infalible and represents the will/word of god. He should be sacked tbh! Most christian these days openly say they dont give a damn about God. So I wouldnt expect much trouble from them if someone was to openly abuse the faith tomorrow. The religion is just about dead.... But you are right about certain muslims, they do overreact. Protests etc would be fine but burning churches is way over the top, and I will stress again, completely against the true teachings of Islam!! Again this religion is also going dead, most people calling themselves muslims havent even read the Quran and then this extremism thing is absolute madness. Islam does not tell people to go around killing people who've insulted them, in fact its tells them to show patience. Islam is not at fault, its them human beings.