Happy Face 29 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Form is temporary. After the first 8 games we were a point off Chelsea. I'll tell you what, if we drop as low as 13th (where we finished last year) we can all say he might deserve the sack. Until then why don't we all get behind him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26602 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 I advocate patience. As am I, I'm just not seeing many signs of improvement. After the first 8 games we were a point off Chelsea. After one of our easiest starts to a PL season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34998 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Since when did more time become the universal cure for shite management ? Since when did you become chief fucking moaner? Honestly, I thought you had more sense than to advocate getting shot of a manager 14 games into a campaign. If we were rock bottom and hadn't won a game, fine, but fucking hell the way you're going on you would think we were dead certs for the drop. Changing a club from top to bottom takes time. I'm amazed you don't see that. Conceding ten goals in three games and I dread to think how many against Arsenal, is relegation form. I'm amazed you don't see that Do you think we'll get relegated then? "Relegation form" has to last for a full season for you to be relegated. It shouldn't be used after a run of a few games as an excuse to sack a newly appointed manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face 29 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 After the first 8 games we were a point off Chelsea. After one of our easiest starts to a PL season. If you think we're better than we are. But half of our first 8 games were against teams who finished above us last season. And 4 of the last 6 have been. So we've played more teams better than us, than worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo 133 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Since when did more time become the universal cure for shite management ? Since when did you become chief fucking moaner? Honestly, I thought you had more sense than to advocate getting shot of a manager 14 games into a campaign. If we were rock bottom and hadn't won a game, fine, but fucking hell the way you're going on you would think we were dead certs for the drop. Changing a club from top to bottom takes time. I'm amazed you don't see that. Clearly Allardyce to me, is what Martins is to you. As I've said before, I don't understand the logic that giving a manager more time is the universal guarantee for success, I don't think Allardyce is going to turn us into a top side, his reputation is purely based on his record at Bolton, I don't see it as an outstanding track record of consistancy, and yes, taking a club from the bottom to the top does take time, but only when it works, giving a manager more time can equally guarantee disaster as often as it can guarantee success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James_coDurham Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Changing a club from top to bottom takes time. I'm amazed you don't see that. Agreed, but it doesn't excuse consistently shite tactics and baffling team selections. He's testing the water, finding his feet. The fact is we do need to defend better and he's experimenting. It's not an exact science. If he picked the predictable team and tactics what would be different between him and last season's regime? We can't attack nor defend, Roeder proved that last season. Sam is trying to address the latter first, evident by his signings, and whilst he hasn't got it right instantly, that doesn't mean he won't. And how long do you suggest we should haemorrage goals before he thinks about changing it? Yes we've adopted a more defensive approach but it still hasn't stopped us conceding. And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26602 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimbo 133 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Well said, one thing that does amaze me is how poorly drillled our defence seems, virtually all of our senior coaching staff were defenders and recent performances aside, we have bought some quality defensive players recently, I just find it so hard to believe that we have seen no improvement with our problems at the back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James_coDurham Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Well said, one thing that does amaze me is how poorly drillled our defence seems, virtually all of our senior coaching staff were defenders and recent performances aside, we have bought some quality defensive players recently, I just find it so hard to believe that we have seen no improvement with our problems at the back. Amazing what booing does to even the best defender's confidence, eh? If Carragher or Terry fuck up, they get the support and bounce back. Our defence fucks up, they get booed, which means they don't recover and effectively get worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Well said, one thing that does amaze me is how poorly drillled our defence seems, virtually all of our senior coaching staff were defenders and recent performances aside, we have bought some quality defensive players recently, I just find it so hard to believe that we have seen no improvement with our problems at the back. Amazing what booing does to even the best defender's confidence, eh? If Carragher or Terry fuck up, they get the support and bounce back. Our defence fucks up, they get booed, which means they don't recover and effectively get worse. I see in the minds of the vocal minority (or is it majority now?) that Cacapa has gone from being better than Woodgate to worse than Boumsong due to 15 minutes in the Portsmouth game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest James_coDurham Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Well said, one thing that does amaze me is how poorly drillled our defence seems, virtually all of our senior coaching staff were defenders and recent performances aside, we have bought some quality defensive players recently, I just find it so hard to believe that we have seen no improvement with our problems at the back. Amazing what booing does to even the best defender's confidence, eh? If Carragher or Terry fuck up, they get the support and bounce back. Our defence fucks up, they get booed, which means they don't recover and effectively get worse. I see in the minds of the vocal minority (or is it majority now?) that Cacapa has gone from being better than Woodgate to worse than Boumsong due to 15 minutes in the Portsmouth game. Cringeworthy isn't it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 34998 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 (edited) And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Well said, one thing that does amaze me is how poorly drillled our defence seems, virtually all of our senior coaching staff were defenders and recent performances aside, we have bought some quality defensive players recently, I just find it so hard to believe that we have seen no improvement with our problems at the back. We've not been playing with a fixed back 4 though, have we? Due to injuries there's had to be a lot of chopping and changing. When you combine that with the fact that they didn't know one another a few months back, I think you can expect us to be dropping a few clangers. EDIT! If there's one thing you could say about Bolton, it's that they were well drilled. They probably weren't 14 games after he took over there though. Edited December 2, 2007 by Gemmill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jusoda Kid 1 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Since when did more time become the universal cure for shite management ? Since when did you become chief fucking moaner? Honestly, I thought you had more sense than to advocate getting shot of a manager 14 games into a campaign. If we were rock bottom and hadn't won a game, fine, but fucking hell the way you're going on you would think we were dead certs for the drop. Changing a club from top to bottom takes time. I'm amazed you don't see that. Conceding ten goals in three games and I dread to think how many against Arsenal, is relegation form. I'm amazed you don't see that Ten? Seven, isn't it? And Blackburn have conceded 7 too, but people talk up Hughes like we should get him in. Sorry, I had erased the mackems game from my memory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jusoda Kid 1 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 Since when did more time become the universal cure for shite management ? Since when did you become chief fucking moaner? Honestly, I thought you had more sense than to advocate getting shot of a manager 14 games into a campaign. If we were rock bottom and hadn't won a game, fine, but fucking hell the way you're going on you would think we were dead certs for the drop. Changing a club from top to bottom takes time. I'm amazed you don't see that. Conceding ten goals in three games and I dread to think how many against Arsenal, is relegation form. I'm amazed you don't see that Do you think we'll get relegated then? "Relegation form" has to last for a full season for you to be relegated. It shouldn't be used after a run of a few games as an excuse to sack a newly appointed manager. No, purely because there is worse teams out there but our defending is comical at best which doesn't look good for the rest of the campaign. Our goals against record is on par with all the bottom teams, worrying imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol 0 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Well said, one thing that does amaze me is how poorly drillled our defence seems, virtually all of our senior coaching staff were defenders and recent performances aside, we have bought some quality defensive players recently, I just find it so hard to believe that we have seen no improvement with our problems at the back. We've not been playing with a fixed back 4 though, have we? Due to injuries there's had to be a lot of chopping and changing. When you combine that with the fact that they didn't know one another a few months back, I think you can expect us to be dropping a few clangers. EDIT! If there's one thing you could say about Bolton, it's that they were well drilled. They probably weren't 14 games after he took over there though. Bolton used to go on a run of not winning before going on a run of wins. They've never been consistent. Seems we're going the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Well said, one thing that does amaze me is how poorly drillled our defence seems, virtually all of our senior coaching staff were defenders and recent performances aside, we have bought some quality defensive players recently, I just find it so hard to believe that we have seen no improvement with our problems at the back. We've not been playing with a fixed back 4 though, have we? Due to injuries there's had to be a lot of chopping and changing. When you combine that with the fact that they didn't know one another a few months back, I think you can expect us to be dropping a few clangers. EDIT! If there's one thing you could say about Bolton, it's that they were well drilled. They probably weren't 14 games after he took over there though. Bolton used to go on a run of not winning before going on a run of wins. They've never been consistent. Seems we're going the same way. is that right ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gram 0 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Well said, one thing that does amaze me is how poorly drillled our defence seems, virtually all of our senior coaching staff were defenders and recent performances aside, we have bought some quality defensive players recently, I just find it so hard to believe that we have seen no improvement with our problems at the back. We've not been playing with a fixed back 4 though, have we? Due to injuries there's had to be a lot of chopping and changing. When you combine that with the fact that they didn't know one another a few months back, I think you can expect us to be dropping a few clangers. EDIT! If there's one thing you could say about Bolton, it's that they were well drilled. They probably weren't 14 games after he took over there though. Bolton used to go on a run of not winning before going on a run of wins. They've never been consistent. Seems we're going the same way. is that right ? That is what I have heard when he first took over but have no idea cos I havent looked it up. They still did pretty well with him there. Just not sure about him at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeazesMag 0 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 And can you think of a manager that we could appoint that would guarantee that he'd be instantly successful at first attempt? Also consider that our start to the season was one of our best for years. I consider it fucking outrageous that anybody is calling for his head because of a poor spell. In fact, it sums up everything that is wrong with the fans of this club. Joey Barton made a good point. I'm not demanding instant success, nor am I calling for his head. What I've said is that what I have seen thus far has been very worrying, especially considering the quality of opposition we've faced. We've seen no sign of effective tactics or team selections, something which should be fairly basic for a decent manager. What I have seen is a manager trying to implement a system that was successful with his previous club but simply doesn't translate to the squad of players we currently have and this has been evident in the performances and results this season. 14 games should be more than enough for any decent manager to see the mistakes he is making and rectifying them, if results and performances don't improve between now and Christmas then I'll be calling for his head. Well said, one thing that does amaze me is how poorly drillled our defence seems, virtually all of our senior coaching staff were defenders and recent performances aside, we have bought some quality defensive players recently, I just find it so hard to believe that we have seen no improvement with our problems at the back. We've not been playing with a fixed back 4 though, have we? Due to injuries there's had to be a lot of chopping and changing. When you combine that with the fact that they didn't know one another a few months back, I think you can expect us to be dropping a few clangers. EDIT! If there's one thing you could say about Bolton, it's that they were well drilled. They probably weren't 14 games after he took over there though. Bolton used to go on a run of not winning before going on a run of wins. They've never been consistent. Seems we're going the same way. is that right ? That is what I have heard when he first took over but have no idea cos I havent looked it up. They still did pretty well with him there. Just not sure about him at all. do you believe in patterns like this ? We know that the 2nd half of the season isn't usually as good as the first for him < gulp > Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gram 0 Posted December 2, 2007 Share Posted December 2, 2007 True, but I dont really believe in those sort of things. I doubt he takes his foot off the pedal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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