Ferguson: No where in the world has support like Newcastle United

[Guest alex]

Opinion's subjective? Cheers, I never knew that

[Fop 1]

Opinion's subjective? Cheers, I never knew that

 

THE greatest isn't, but one of the greatest is. Fergy is clearly the latter just as much as he clearly isn't the former.

[Renton 18084]

Classic case of arguing for the sake of it.

Yes, this clearly is.

Ferguson is one of the greatest managers in English football ever, period.

True.

He is arguably the greatest manager in English football now.

True, but with the above caveats and reservations.

 

Robson can't compare imo.

You can't compare, because Robson won stuff with a tiny club that he built himself, Robson managed internationally, Robson managed and was repeatedly sucessful abroad.

 

You just can't compare in a different way to the one you're implying.

 

 

Btw, didn't ManU come 2nd the first season Ferguson was in charge? Given that promising start and his amazing sucess at Aberdeen, I'm not surprised he was given a little patience.

11th with only 1 away win. 11th the next season too. 13th the next season (they won the FA Cup though which probably saved his job "Three years of excuses and it's still crap. Ta ra Fergie"). 6th the next season, then 2nd.

 

He spent a fair old wack of money too.

 

According to wiki ManU came 2nd in his second season there (and his first full season). Like I said, that is a promising start and what about his record at Aberdeen? It makes great sense to be more patient with managers with a proven track record than it does to those with a shit one or nothing on their CV. That's why other managers aren't given so long.

 

But Alex hit the nail on the head just before. You're making a ridculous, unprovable supposition that other people would match Ferguson's success given the same circumstances. If that's not arguing for the sake of it I don't know what is. Why not just give credit where it is due and acknowledge that his managerial record is simply unsurpassed in the modern game?

 

Are you saying that a good manager given 4 seasons and a lot of money at Man U wouldn't build a decent team and be successful?

 

But then that's not really the point, the point is he's never been away from Man U (Scotland doesn't count ).

 

If he'd done the things I'd said then yes he'd probably be the greatest British manager of all time, but he hasn't and so he isn't. Simple as that.

 

So he has to to manage at international level to be considered the greatest? That's utter bollocks imo, akin to saying George Best wasn't great because he never played in the world cup finals.

[Renton 18084]

But like I said someone like Robson has to be held up at least with him, because although he may have won less trophies in an absolute sense he's done it in a much harder and more varied manner.

 

Robson never even won the English league, the European championship, or anything with England, did he? Using objective meaures (the only sensible way of doing things) he has achieved a lot less that Ferguson. Still a good manager though, no doubt.

 

Who would you rather have had at Newcastle at the peak of their skills? The answer should tell you something.

[Fop 1]

I know you're just arguing for the sake of argument (you've nearly argued yourself in a circle already ), but it's fun so:

 

 

 

 

So he has to to manage at international level to be considered the greatest? That's utter bollocks imo, akin to saying George Best wasn't great because he never played in the world cup finals.

I think he'd have had to have managed are more than one effective sleeping giant where he was given a vast amount of support and money, yes.

 

Look at what Robson did with Ipswich, Fergy has won more trophies with Man U, but did he realise a greater achievement with them? Probably not.

 

It's a bit like Rossi changing bike teams, he could have stayed an won everything with ease (as he had by far the best bike and was an exceptional ride), but he didn't and became a much greater rider for doing so.

 

But like I said someone like Robson has to be held up at least with him, because although he may have won less trophies in an absolute sense he's done it in a much harder and more varied manner.

 

Robson never even won the English league, the European championship, or anything with England, did he? Using objective meaures (the only sensible way of doing things) he has achieved a lot less that Ferguson. Still a good manager though, no doubt.

International management is a different ball game, that's why Fergy has avoided it so rigorously IMO. But the point isn't that Robson didn't win anything, but that he did it and did it rather well.

 

Or do you think NUFC is a complete failure because of our long empty trophy cabinet.

 

 

Who would you rather have had at Newcastle at the peak of their skills? The answer should tell you something.

Now? Robson without a doubt, he's much more proven in our situation. At our peak? Maybe Robson still, as by your criteria Keegan could have been THE greatest manager ever if things had been a little different.

[Renton 18084]

I know you're just arguing for the sake of argument (you've nearly argued yourself in a circle already ), but it's fun so:

 

 

 

 

So he has to to manage at international level to be considered the greatest? That's utter bollocks imo, akin to saying George Best wasn't great because he never played in the world cup finals.

I think he'd have had to have managed are more than one effective sleeping giant where he was given a vast amount of support and money, yes.

 

Look at what Robson did with Ipswich, Fergy has won more trophies with Man U, but did he realise a greater achievement with them? Probably not.

 

It's a bit like Rossi changing bike teams, he could have stayed an won everything with ease (as he had by far the best bike and was an exceptional ride), but he didn't and became a much greater rider for doing so.

 

But like I said someone like Robson has to be held up at least with him, because although he may have won less trophies in an absolute sense he's done it in a much harder and more varied manner.

 

Robson never even won the English league, the European championship, or anything with England, did he? Using objective meaures (the only sensible way of doing things) he has achieved a lot less that Ferguson. Still a good manager though, no doubt.

International management is a different ball game, that's why Fergy has avoided it so rigorously IMO. But the point isn't that Robson didn't win anything, but that he did it and did it rather well.

 

Or do you think NUFC is a complete failure because of our long empty trophy cabinet.

 

 

Who would you rather have had at Newcastle at the peak of their skills? The answer should tell you something.

Now? Robson without a doubt, he's much more proven in our situation. At our peak? Maybe Robson still, as by your criteria Keegan could have been THE greatest manager ever if things had been a little different.

 

Eh? Don't you mean by your criteria? Your the one who is introducing ifs and buts to the argument, I'm going on the available facts. Perhaps rather than arguing who is/was the best manager we can both agree that Ferguson has been the most successful manager in the English league (the best league in the world). I'm sure even you will not disagree with that, sorted.

[Fop 1]

I know you're just arguing for the sake of argument (you've nearly argued yourself in a circle already ), but it's fun so:

 

 

 

 

So he has to to manage at international level to be considered the greatest? That's utter bollocks imo, akin to saying George Best wasn't great because he never played in the world cup finals.

I think he'd have had to have managed are more than one effective sleeping giant where he was given a vast amount of support and money, yes.

 

Look at what Robson did with Ipswich, Fergy has won more trophies with Man U, but did he realise a greater achievement with them? Probably not.

 

It's a bit like Rossi changing bike teams, he could have stayed an won everything with ease (as he had by far the best bike and was an exceptional ride), but he didn't and became a much greater rider for doing so.

 

But like I said someone like Robson has to be held up at least with him, because although he may have won less trophies in an absolute sense he's done it in a much harder and more varied manner.

 

Robson never even won the English league, the European championship, or anything with England, did he? Using objective meaures (the only sensible way of doing things) he has achieved a lot less that Ferguson. Still a good manager though, no doubt.

International management is a different ball game, that's why Fergy has avoided it so rigorously IMO. But the point isn't that Robson didn't win anything, but that he did it and did it rather well.

 

Or do you think NUFC is a complete failure because of our long empty trophy cabinet.

 

 

Who would you rather have had at Newcastle at the peak of their skills? The answer should tell you something.

Now? Robson without a doubt, he's much more proven in our situation. At our peak? Maybe Robson still, as by your criteria Keegan could have been THE greatest manager ever if things had been a little different.

 

Eh? Don't you mean by your criteria? Your the one who is introducing ifs and buts to the argument, I'm going on the available facts.

Nope, by yours.

Perhaps rather than arguing who is/was the best manager we can both agree that Ferguson has been the most successful manager in the English league (the best league in the world). I'm sure even you will not disagree with that, sorted.

Most successful in the Premier League certainly, that still doesn't make him THE greatest though.

[Guest alex]

Funny because Fop doesn't rate Sven iirc yet he does rate Robson

[Douggy B 0]

I know you're just arguing for the sake of argument (you've nearly argued yourself in a circle already ), but it's fun so:

 

 

 

 

So he has to to manage at international level to be considered the greatest? That's utter bollocks imo, akin to saying George Best wasn't great because he never played in the world cup finals.

I think he'd have had to have managed are more than one effective sleeping giant where he was given a vast amount of support and money, yes.

 

Look at what Robson did with Ipswich, Fergy has won more trophies with Man U, but did he realise a greater achievement with them? Probably not.

 

It's a bit like Rossi changing bike teams, he could have stayed an won everything with ease (as he had by far the best bike and was an exceptional ride), but he didn't and became a much greater rider for doing so.

 

But like I said someone like Robson has to be held up at least with him, because although he may have won less trophies in an absolute sense he's done it in a much harder and more varied manner.

 

Robson never even won the English league, the European championship, or anything with England, did he? Using objective meaures (the only sensible way of doing things) he has achieved a lot less that Ferguson. Still a good manager though, no doubt.

International management is a different ball game, that's why Fergy has avoided it so rigorously IMO. But the point isn't that Robson didn't win anything, but that he did it and did it rather well.

 

Or do you think NUFC is a complete failure because of our long empty trophy cabinet.

 

 

Who would you rather have had at Newcastle at the peak of their skills? The answer should tell you something.

Now? Robson without a doubt, he's much more proven in our situation. At our peak? Maybe Robson still, as by your criteria Keegan could have been THE greatest manager ever if things had been a little different.

 

Eh? Don't you mean by your criteria? Your the one who is introducing ifs and buts to the argument, I'm going on the available facts.

Nope, by yours.

Perhaps rather than arguing who is/was the best manager we can both agree that Ferguson has been the most successful manager in the English league (the best league in the world). I'm sure even you will not disagree with that, sorted.

Most successful in the Premier League certainly, that still doesn't make him THE greatest though.

 

Have you even made a suggestion for who is and dont say Bobby Robson for g-d's sake.

[Park Life 71]

How old is 'The Special One'?

[Douggy B 0]

How old is 'The Special One'?

 

46

[Park Life 71]

How old is 'The Special One'?

 

46

 

Perhaps over the next 20 years he has the chance to be the best club manager of all time...? Non?

[Guest alex]

How old is 'The Special One'?

 

46

 

Perhaps over the next 20 years he has the chance to be the best club manager of all time...? Non?

If his head doesn't explode.

[Renton 18084]

How old is 'The Special One'?

 

46

 

Perhaps over the next 20 years he has the chance to be the best club manager of all time...? Non?

 

Perhaps. Jesus wept tbh.

[Guest Stevie]

I agree with all of you, just cant believe Stevie was stupid enough to get sucked in TBH.

 

He's all over anything that maquerades as a compliment tbf. Never thinks to question it as it must be true. Obviously.

 

If you disagree or hold a dissenting view however then you're automatically a 'wank'.

 

Regular as clockwork.

 

 

I have seen some boring posters but you are the most boring poste........

Fuck off you southern wank.

[tinofbeans 89]

this whole thing is crazy. ferguson is the most successful manager i've seen in my lifetime, his hunger to win is unquestionable.... i also believe that mourinho will not neccesarily eclipse him, but will be one of the greats. he's a similar character except his ego needs keeping in check!

[manc-mag 1]

How much of a waste of his time would it have been sacrificing domestic management trying to win World Cups with Scotland ffs?

 

No offence btw, Ritchie (I wish he fucking had for the record).

[Fop 1]

Funny because Fop doesn't rate Sven iirc yet he does rate Robson

Fop just thinks he's lucky (well up till Man City anyway), and doesn't overrate him.

[Tom 13915]

He wasn't bad at Man City to be honest.

[Renton 18084]

Funny because Fop doesn't rate Sven iirc yet he does rate Robson

Fop just thinks he's lucky (well up till Man City anyway), and doesn't overrate him.

 

Has the illness started again Fop? Don't be afraid to ask for help.

[Fop 1]

How old is 'The Special One'?

 

46

 

Perhaps over the next 20 years he has the chance to be the best club manager of all time...? Non?

 

 

No, that will be Peter Kwabena in 2306.

[Fop 1]

Funny because Fop doesn't rate Sven iirc yet he does rate Robson

Fop just thinks he's lucky (well up till Man City anyway), and doesn't overrate him.

 

Has the illness started again Fop? Don't be afraid to ask for help.

"The illness" never seems to leave this place.

 

 

 

He wasn't bad at Man City to be honest.

He did quite well although was a little spendy (which again is very Sven), but he was really unlucky to get sacked for what he achieved and really, really unlucky to get sacked not long before they got took over.

[Tom 13915]

I would have him here in a heartbeat these days.

 

He wouldn't come like

[Guest alex]

Funny because Fop doesn't rate Sven iirc yet he does rate Robson

Fop just thinks he's lucky (well up till Man City anyway), and doesn't overrate him.

I brought it up because of the similarities to Robson's CV. Eriksson probably achieved more though.

[Fop 1]

I would have him here in a heartbeat these days.

 

He wouldn't come like

 

Aye, Sven, Fergy...... even 'Arry, none would come, of course, and even if they did I doubt would do that much constrained the the double whammy of a £0 transfer budget and Denny and Derra's picks.