G.B. to address G.B.

[The Fish 9286]

Chez, be gentle... it's obviously his first time.

[Renton 18173]

Gordon Brown is an unelected fuckin useless scotish twat. how the fuck can he preach about the financial health of the nation?? he's the fuckin muppet who's been in control of the purse strings for the past 12(?) yrs and in that time tax's have virtually doubled whilst the national debt has gone through the roof. thats not financial wizardry, it's stupidity!! i'm not going to say the tories would be any better but they certainly would'nt be any worse!

 

Unelected? How come he's got a seat in parliament then?

 

Do you seriously blame him for the global financial crisis? Honestly, have you thought about it?

 

 

Wha?? how fuckin old are you Chez? 12?? unelected as in he has no public mandate to be prime minister. phoney blair was labours leader when they won the election. he then gave the premiership to the useless bong eye'd twat. fuckin hell, i havent seen such blatent shit like that since the USSR!!

 

and pray tell me where i blamed him for the global financial crisis?

 

and finally, yes. I have thought about it. obviously a lot more than you!

 

Class, you accuse Chez of being a kid and then go on to use kindergarten insults.

 

I'd like to know where your figures have come from that he's doubled taxes and also an answer to Chez's earlier question, what would have been the likely result of Cameron's proposed actions? Cheers in advance.

 

Btw, in this country you elect MPs who represent their constituency and respective political parties, and not the PM directly, surprised you didn't know that tbh.

[AgentAxeman 90]

Gordon Brown is an unelected fuckin useless scotish twat. how the fuck can he preach about the financial health of the nation?? he's the fuckin muppet who's been in control of the purse strings for the past 12(?) yrs and in that time tax's have virtually doubled whilst the national debt has gone through the roof. thats not financial wizardry, it's stupidity!! i'm not going to say the tories would be any better but they certainly would'nt be any worse!

 

Unelected? How come he's got a seat in parliament then?

 

Do you seriously blame him for the global financial crisis? Honestly, have you thought about it?

 

 

Wha?? how fuckin old are you Chez? 12?? unelected as in he has no public mandate to be prime minister. phoney blair was labours leader when they won the election. he then gave the premiership to the useless bong eye'd twat. fuckin hell, i havent seen such blatent shit like that since the USSR!!

 

and pray tell me where i blamed him for the global financial crisis?

 

and finally, yes. I have thought about it. obviously a lot more than you!

 

Class, you accuse Chez of being a kid and then go on to use kindergarten insults.

 

I'd like to know where your figures have come from that he's doubled taxes and also an answer to Chez's earlier question, what would have been the likely result of Cameron's proposed actions? Cheers in advance.

 

Btw, in this country you elect MPs who represent their constituency and respective political parties, and not the PM directly, surprised you didn't know that tbh.

 

 

 

1st - i never said he'd doubled taxes. i said they had virtually doubled and that the national debt had gone through the roof. please tell me where i am wrong with this assesment. as you have alluded to, it would be impossible to come up with accurate figures as many of the increases have come from 'indirect' taxes. however, even the most ardent Labour supporter could not deny that the tax burden has risen massively.

 

2nd - I'm sorry but i failed fortune telling at school so i couldnt possibly give you an accurate assesment of what would have happened under cameron. in fact, nobody could possibly predict that. i could give you a completley inaccurate guess tho if you would prefer??

 

3rd - yeah, i'm fully aware that people vote for the MP's who represent the 'local' constituency and not the PM directly. however, the fact remains that many people would not have voted for labour if G.B. had been in charge before the election. they simply fell for blairs spin.

 

4th - I like debating with you Renton

 

5th - as for the childish bit, damn right i was. cant stand phoney blair or gordon fuckin brown. i wouldnt believe either of them if they'd told me the sky was blue!! the worst thing that happened in the last 20yrs for me was when john smith died. however i will apologise to Chez! sorry bud!!

 

I think i've covered everything...

 

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Not going to say anything new and nothing of substance, so what's the point?

 

He's pointed out that the tories got the call about how to handle the economic disaster wrong; the only political party in the world to call it wrong i.e. to do nothing.

 

(New)Labour are really down in the dumps, but I suggested to mrs hips last night that it might be worth a £20 punt on them winning the next election.

 

 

Is he suggesting every country that gave trillions to the banks got it spot on?

 

He's told us that not ONE saver in UK lost a single penny of their savings.

And at the small price of £25k of debt for every man, woman and child in the country. GREAT.

[Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0]

Mandelson's speech was cringeworthy too, couldnt believe the reaction it got, the self-indulgent prick looked so pleased with himself.

What a slimy shit that cunt is. He makes my skin creep.

[NJS 4021]

It was absolutely clear in 2005 that the election was fought on the basis of Blair handing over to Brown - I can't understand how anybody could have not known that (stupidity aside).

 

Taxes have risen since 97 but they went to pay for policies that were re-elected on twice - you can't say they weren't pretty honest about things - especially in 2001/2005.

 

I'm deeply disappointed with a lot of things they've done and a lot they haven't but I still see Brown as a victim of outside shit (that he admittedly didn't address). As I've said before, minor complaints aside, things weren't too bad for the UK in the summer of 2007.

[AgentAxeman 90]

It was absolutely clear in 2005 that the election was fought on the basis of Blair handing over to Brown - I can't understand how anybody could have not known that (stupidity aside).

 

Taxes have risen since 97 but they went to pay for policies that were re-elected on twice - you can't say they weren't pretty honest about things - especially in 2001/2005.

 

I'm deeply disappointed with a lot of things they've done and a lot they haven't but I still see Brown as a victim of outside shit (that he admittedly didn't address). As I've said before, minor complaints aside, things weren't too bad for the UK in the summer of 2007.

 

 

no it wasnt. at no point did Blair say "oh, btw, i'm gonna be handing the reigns over to Gordon after the election". in fact most of the spin was saying that Tony might shaft Brown (ooer missus!!) and stay on as leader. whilst i admit it was 'rumoured' to be a done deal it was never clarified.

 

yeah, 2007 was a great year. shame about whats happened since tho!!

[PaddockLad 14964]

Not going to say anything new and nothing of substance, so what's the point?

 

He's pointed out that the tories got the call about how to handle the economic disaster wrong; the only political party in the world to call it wrong i.e. to do nothing.

 

(New)Labour are really down in the dumps, but I suggested to mrs hips last night that it might be worth a £20 punt on them winning the next election.

 

 

Is he suggesting every country that gave trillions to the banks got it spot on?

 

He's told us that not ONE saver in UK lost a single penny of their savings.

And at the small price of £25k of debt for every man, woman and child in the country. GREAT.

 

And how would you have felt this time last year when you rolled up to a random cashpoint and found you couldnt get near your wages as the global finanacial system had run out of money? Brown and Darling grasped the nettle and saved the world from the fuck wittery of the way the major banks had been doing things since de regulation started under the tories the best part of 30 years ago. Good on them I say.

 

A lot of us sleepwalked into this, and a lot of us are partly to blame as we saw our houses nicely quadruple in price etc. Some warned we were in for a reckoning, but we largely ignored them and chose to look on in glee in the estate agents windows and get ourselves into huge debt by borrowing against the artificially huge amount our houses were worth. Selling mortgages to those that banks thirty years ago wouldnt have touched with a bargepole, self certification of mortgage applications etc, a lot of us swallowed the whole lot as being normal and having no side effects, and a lot of us naiively thought it could go on forever,or just chose not to think about it too much. And if anyone can show me how any government on earth could have introduced stricter regulation for the markets once Maggie and Reagan had set the ball rolling then I'd be interested in hearing what they have to say. No government could have reigned in those who played fast and loose with our/their cash, it would've been so completely against the free market principles that the system was built upon that the banks would've staged a military fuckin coup if any major government had seriously tried to get them to act with a bit of restraint.

 

It's true, taxes will go up to pay for this dogs dinner. It's also true at the end of world war 2 that as a nation we owed more.....how many booms and busts have we seen since then?...t'is the way of capitalism, and thats the only game in town I'm afraid.

 

And sadly it will mean the end of Brown, who for all his huge faults is just about as good a PM that we can hope for/are going to be able to get as we enter the second decade of the 21st century.

 

fuckin depressing isn't it?

[ewerk 26955]

no it wasnt. at no point did Blair say "oh, btw, i'm gonna be handing the reigns over to Gordon after the election". in fact most of the spin was saying that Tony might shaft Brown (ooer missus!!) and stay on as leader. whilst i admit it was 'rumoured' to be a done deal it was never clarified.

 

Oh ffs, even the Tories were using the line 'Vote Blair, get Brown'. Anyone who didn't realise what was going to happen was obviously too thick to deserve the right to vote.

[AgentAxeman 90]

no it wasnt. at no point did Blair say "oh, btw, i'm gonna be handing the reigns over to Gordon after the election". in fact most of the spin was saying that Tony might shaft Brown (ooer missus!!) and stay on as leader. whilst i admit it was 'rumoured' to be a done deal it was never clarified.

 

Oh ffs, even the Tories were using the line 'Vote Blair, get Brown'. Anyone who didn't realise what was going to happen was obviously too thick to deserve the right to vote.

 

 

yeah, and Labour were denying it! who do ya believe??

 

oh, and to clarify, i believed that we'd end up with Brown.

Edited September 29, 2009 by AvatarAxeman

[Meenzer 14166]

A lot of us sleepwalked into this, and a lot of us are partly to blame as we saw our houses nicely quadruple in price etc. Some warned we were in for a reckoning, but we largely ignored them and chose to look on in glee in the estate agents windows and get ourselves into huge debt by borrowing against the artificially huge amount our houses were worth. Selling mortgages to those that banks thirty years ago wouldnt have touched with a bargepole, self certification of mortgage applications etc, a lot of us swallowed the whole lot as being normal and having no side effects, and a lot of us naiively thought it could go on forever,or just chose not to think about it too much. And if anyone can show me how any government on earth could have introduced stricter regulation for the markets once Maggie and Reagan had set the ball rolling then I'd be interested in hearing what they have to say. No government could have reigned in those who played fast and loose with our/their cash, it would've been so completely against the free market principles that the system was built upon that the banks would've staged a military fuckin coup if any major government had seriously tried to get them to act with a bit of restraint.

The problem is that there was never any opportunity for those who knew it was wrong all along to make a difference. The ability to say "I told you so" is a pretty small reward when the future of your country has been fucked up by other people.

[Meenzer 14166]

Wha?? how fuckin old are you Chez? 12?? unelected as in he has no public mandate to be prime minister. phoney blair was labours leader when they won the election. he then gave the premiership to the useless bong eye'd twat. fuckin hell, i havent seen such blatent shit like that since the USSR!!

Or, erm, since John Major. How old are you?

[ewerk 26955]

Brown loses Sun newspaper backing

 

 

Gordon Brown's hopes of reviving Labour's fortunes have suffered a setback after the Sun newspaper backed the Tories to win the next election.

 

After 12 years "Labour has lost its way and now it has lost us too", it said.

 

The prime minister responded saying it was "the British people that decide the election, it's the British people's views that I am interested in".

 

The BBC's political editor Nick Robinson said the Sun had "timed its big political switch... for maximum impact both in terms of gaining attention for the paper and taking the gloss off Mr Brown's big day".

 

George Pascoe-Watson, the Sun's political editor, said that in 2005 the paper had "warned Labour that it had one last chance... to try and prove it was the right party for the country.

 

"We've now decided after four more years, particularly after the prime minister's... underwhelming performance in his conference speech, that it was time now to take a verdict and announce that verdict to the nation," he told the BBC.

 

"The prime minister failed to convince us he was the right man for the country.

 

''We feel it's time for a new leader''.

 

Mr Pascoe-Watson said the paper believed that Tory leader David Cameron had "the vision, the energy, the drive, the ideas to take the country forward".

 

He added: "We believe he will cut away a lot of the red tape which is strangling British business.

 

"We think he is a fresh administration, he's got good people around him, and we will be holding him to account.

 

"We'll be an honest friend but we'll also be a critical friend, like we were with Labour for many years - 12 years is longer than we ever supported a Conservative administration in the past."

 

According to the BBC's chief political correspondent James Landale, at the Labour conference in Brighton, allies of the prime minister said: "It may be the newspapers that get David Cameron out of bed in the morning - for Gordon Brown, it's the issues that matter to the British people."

 

Energy and Climate Change Secretary Ed Miliband admitted to BBC Two's Newsnight that he had "seen better headlines".

 

He said: "I want as many people to support us as possible and it would be better if the Sun was supporting us but... I think the Sun's made the wrong judgement."

 

'Difficult months'

 

MP Eric Joyce, who recently resigned as a defence ministerial aide in protest at the government's strategy in Afghanistan, said: "It is not something we can ignore but it does not mean the end is nigh.

 

"I am very sad about it. However I do not think the game is up."

 

The Sun came out in support of Tony Blair six weeks before Labour's landslide victory in 1997 and had remained a supporter of the party until now.

 

Conservative Party Chairman Eric Pickles said the paper's support was "obviously very good news".

 

He added: "But I do think it's important for the party to understand that we've now got an opportunity to persuade not just the Sun editorial people but also Sun readers that the Conservative Party can be trusted with government.

 

"And we've got a difficult few months ahead of us, I think we've now got a possibility to make our case in a way that perhaps we didn't have before".

 

In a speech lasting just under an hour in Brighton on Tuesday, Mr Brown strived to boost the morale of party members fearing a heavy general election defeat.

 

The Labour leader urged activists to "reach inside ourselves for the strength of our convictions" and "fight" for victory, calling on them to "dream big dreams and watch our country soar".

 

Mr Brown announced a string of new policies, including:

 

• Ten hours of free childcare a week for 250,000 two-year-olds from families "on modest or middle incomes" - paid for by scrapping tax relief for better-off families

 

• A plan to house 16 and 17-year-old single parents in state-run shared houses rather than council flats

 

• A £1bn "innovation fund" to boost industry

 

• A new National Care Service to "provide security for pensioners for generations to come"

 

• A commitment, enshrined in law, to allocate 0.7% of GDP to international aid

 

The PM also announced that minimum wage, child tax credits and child benefit would continue to go up every year and confirmed that ID cards would not be made compulsory in the next Parliament.

 

Damage threat

 

But Mr Pascoe-Watson expressed disappointment at the "30 seconds that [he] spent on Afghanistan - a campaign which we have been running very very hard.

 

"And of course the Sun has always said that Gordon Brown promised us a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty, he's failed to deliver that promise and that's a huge issue for the Sun."

 

The newspaper was a big supporter of Margaret Thatcher's Britain of the 1980s, backing the controversial poll tax and mounting attacks on Tory MPs who plotted against the then-prime minister.

 

After she was ousted in 1990, the Sun stood by new Prime Minister John Major, and on polling day in 1992, the paper ran a front page showing Labour leader Neil Kinnock's head in a light bulb.

 

The headline read: "If Kinnock wins today, will the last person to leave Britain please turn out the lights."

 

Many pundits had predicted a Labour victory but the Tories retained power, prompting the Sun to famously declare: "It's The Sun Wot Won It."

 

It had not, Nick Robinson says, adding that the paper "tends to follow its readers' views rather than set them".

 

But Labour must now hope that the paper does not choose to regularly attack Mr Brown himself, which, "rather than a single day's endorsement of the Tories... would do real damage", he says.

 

In 1992, the Sun sold more than 3.5 million copies a day. It is still the UK's top-selling newspaper, with average daily sales of 3.13 million in August, according to the Audit Bureau of Circulation.

[ewerk 26955]

I'm just watching him being interviewed on Sky News, what an utter moron that interviewer is.

[AgentAxeman 90]

Wha?? how fuckin old are you Chez? 12?? unelected as in he has no public mandate to be prime minister. phoney blair was labours leader when they won the election. he then gave the premiership to the useless bong eye'd twat. fuckin hell, i havent seen such blatent shit like that since the USSR!!

Or, erm, since John Major. How old are you?

 

 

interesting point, i know he was thatchers boy at one point but her support for him was withdrawn before the leadership contest. but at least there was a leadership contest. he didnt just recieve it like a certain labour prime minister i could mention! sheesh!!

[AgentAxeman 90]

I'm just watching him being interviewed on Sky News, what an utter moron that interviewer is.

 

why?? cos she's asking difficult questions?

[ewerk 26955]

I'm just watching him being interviewed on Sky News, what an utter moron that interviewer is.

 

why?? cos she's asking difficult questions?

 

She?

[AgentAxeman 90]

I'm just watching him being interviewed on Sky News, what an utter moron that interviewer is.

 

why?? cos she's asking difficult questions?

 

She?

 

 

sorry, my bad. i was watching the Beeb interviewer. thats why i was puzzled by your original statement.

 

[Happy Face 29]

"We believe he [Cameron] will cut away a lot of the red tape which is strangling British business."

 

All hail deregulation.

 

[ewerk 26955]

I'm just watching him being interviewed on Sky News, what an utter moron that interviewer is.

 

why?? cos she's asking difficult questions?

 

She?

 

 

sorry, my bad. i was watching the Beeb interviewer. thats why i was puzzled by your original statement.

 

 

It was Adam Boulton, basically he was asking questions and not giving him a chance to give his answer without interrupting and spent far too long pushing a TV debate (obviously in Sky's interest).

[Rob W 0]

Lots of BS about what he will do but no explanation of how it will be paid for..........

[AgentAxeman 90]

I'm just watching him being interviewed on Sky News, what an utter moron that interviewer is.

 

why?? cos she's asking difficult questions?

 

She?

 

 

sorry, my bad. i was watching the Beeb interviewer. thats why i was puzzled by your original statement.

 

 

It was Adam Boulton, basically he was asking questions and not giving him a chance to give his answer without interrupting and spent far too long pushing a TV debate (obviously in Sky's interest).

 

must admit that whilst i'm not Browns biggest fan, i cant stand pushy interviewers. whats the point in asking questions if you wont let the poor bastard get the answers out. sounds like a cunt!!

[Renton 18173]

Brown loses Sun newspaper backing

 

 

Gordon Brown's hopes of reviving Labour's fortunes have suffered a setback after the Sun newspaper backed the Tories to win the next election.

 

After 12 years "Labour has lost its way and now it has lost us too", it said.

 

The prime minister responded saying it was "the British people that decide the election, it's the British people's views that I am interested in".

 

The BBC's political editor Nick Robinson said the Sun had "timed its big political switch... for maximum impact both in terms of gaining attention for the paper and taking the gloss off Mr Brown's big day".

 

George Pascoe-Watson, the Sun's political editor, said that in 2005 the paper had "warned Labour that it had one last chance... to try and prove it was the right party for the country.

 

"We've now decided after four more years, particularly after the prime minister's... underwhelming performance in his conference speech, that it was time now to take a verdict and announce that verdict to the nation," he told the BBC.

 

"The prime minister failed to convince us he was the right man for the country.

 

''We feel it's time for a new leader''.

 

Mr Pascoe-Watson said the paper believed that Tory leader David Cameron had "the vision, the energy, the drive, the ideas to take the country forward".

 

He added: "We believe he will cut away a lot of the red tape which is strangling British business.

 

"We think he is a fresh administration, he's got good people around him, and we will be holding him to account.

 

"We'll be an honest friend but we'll also be a critical friend, like we were with Labour for many years - 12 years is longer than we ever supported a Conservative administration in the past."

 

According to the BBC's chief political correspondent James Landale, at the Labour conference in Brighton, allies of the prime minister said: "It may be the newspapers that get David Cameron out of bed in the morning - for Gordon Brown, it's the issues that matter to the British people."

 

Energy and Climate Change Secretary Ed Miliband admitted to BBC Two's Newsnight that he had "seen better headlines".

 

He said: "I want as many people to support us as possible and it would be better if the Sun was supporting us but... I think the Sun's made the wrong judgement."

 

'Difficult months'

 

MP Eric Joyce, who recently resigned as a defence ministerial aide in protest at the government's strategy in Afghanistan, said: "It is not something we can ignore but it does not mean the end is nigh.

 

"I am very sad about it. However I do not think the game is up."

 

The Sun came out in support of Tony Blair six weeks before Labour's landslide victory in 1997 and had remained a supporter of the party until now.

 

Conservative Party Chairman Eric Pickles said the paper's support was "obviously very good news".

 

He added: "But I do think it's important for the party to understand that we've now got an opportunity to persuade not just the Sun editorial people but also Sun readers that the Conservative Party can be trusted with government.

 

"And we've got a difficult few months ahead of us, I think we've now got a possibility to make our case in a way that perhaps we didn't have before".

 

In a speech lasting just under an hour in Brighton on Tuesday, Mr Brown strived to boost the morale of party members fearing a heavy general election defeat.

 

The Labour leader urged activists to "reach inside ourselves for the strength of our convictions" and "fight" for victory, calling on them to "dream big dreams and watch our country soar".

 

Mr Brown announced a string of new policies, including:

 

• Ten hours of free childcare a week for 250,000 two-year-olds from families "on modest or middle incomes" - paid for by scrapping tax relief for better-off families

 

• A plan to house 16 and 17-year-old single parents in state-run shared houses rather than council flats

 

• A £1bn "innovation fund" to boost industry

 

• A new National Care Service to "provide security for pensioners for generations to come"

 

• A commitment, enshrined in law, to allocate 0.7% of GDP to international aid

 

The PM also announced that minimum wage, child tax credits and child benefit would continue to go up every year and confirmed that ID cards would not be made compulsory in the next Parliament.

 

Damage threat

 

But Mr Pascoe-Watson expressed disappointment at the "30 seconds that [he] spent on Afghanistan - a campaign which we have been running very very hard.

 

"And of course the Sun has always said that Gordon Brown promised us a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty, he's failed to deliver that promise and that's a huge issue for the Sun."

 

The newspaper was a big supporter of Margaret Thatcher's Britain of the 1980s, backing the controversial poll tax and mounting attacks on Tory MPs who plotted against the then-prime minister.

 

After she was ousted in 1990, the Sun stood by new Prime Minister John Major, and on polling day in 1992, the paper ran a front page showing Labour leader Neil Kinnock's head in a light bulb.

 

The headline read: "If Kinnock wins today, will the last person to leave Britain please turn out the lights."

 

Many pundits had predicted a Labour victory but the Tories retained power, prompting the Sun to famously declare: "It's The Sun Wot Won It."

 

It had not, Nick Robinson says, adding that the paper "tends to follow its readers' views rather than set them".

 

But Labour must now hope that the paper does not choose to regularly attack Mr Brown himself, which, "rather than a single day's endorsement of the Tories... would do real damage", he says.

 

In 1992, the Sun sold more than 3.5 million copies a day. It is still the UK's top-selling newspaper, with average daily sales of 3.13 million in August, according to the Audit Bureau of Circulation.

 

It'd be interesting to know whether the Sun is the Kingmaker or just has a tendency to back winners. A bit of both I imagine.

 

But what a joke of a paper making a mockery of our democratic process. Why should a supposedly independent newspaper 'back' any political party, shouldn't they at least try and pretend to have an unbiased editorial policy? Apparently not, can't wait for their smug self-congratulary headlines next May proclaiming 'it was the Sun wot wunnit'. The fact that a foreigner is behind this is an irony that will be lost on anyone brainless enough to read that rag.

 

*Sigh*

[ewerk 26955]

It'd be interesting to know whether the Sun is the Kingmaker or just has a tendency to back winners. A bit of both I imagine.

 

But what a joke of a paper making a mockery of our democratic process. Why should a supposedly independent newspaper 'back' any political party, shouldn't they at least try and pretend to have an unbiased editorial policy? Apparently not, can't wait for their smug self-congratulary headlines next May proclaiming 'it was the Sun wot wunnit'. The fact that a foreigner is behind this is an irony that will be lost on anyone brainless enough to read that rag.

 

*Sigh*

 

Backing the expected winner wouldn't be of any benefit to Murdoch, now would it?

[Guest alex]

An Australian living in America who is sceptical about Europe telling Britain how to vote