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Waiting over for Roeder


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I'm not using hindsight to blame Souness. I despised him and thought he was a shit manager when he was at Rangers and I was working in Jockland. You can blame Shepherd if you like, but I didn't see you blaming him when we won in Rotterdam. And if Roeder does well, ie gets into europe/wins a cup/stablises the club during a time of financial accountability then I look forward to the comments you will make, which I'll be watching with interest.

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Ok, for that scenario I already say that in that case Shepherd will have been (grammar?) very lucky. Shepherd will deserve praise for being brave enough for just sticking to an easy option instead of coming up with a ingenious masterplan.

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I'm not trying to pointscore, or type good grammar on an internet message board, just stating what I hope will happen, and accepting the clubs decision for whatever reason. We all know its possible the club may have its hands tied financially, well most of us do apart from those who stupidly think we should carry on throwing money around like there is no tomorrow ie those who backed the changes instigated by Souness which have put us in this position.

 

If Robert and Bellamy were still at the club, and we had not needlessly bought the heartless Spanish twat, we would now be 2 players and 9m quid better off for starters.

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By far the most important investment in a club is the manager though - this should have been made the priority by a country mile. Roeder at least seems like a cheap option - not the position you should be making cost savings, I fear.

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Even with appointing Roeder I think it would have been possible to try installing a more progressive managment structure. I am for example very much for installing a director of football as assistance to the manager. A Arnesen type of man who supervises transfer dealings might be better able to minimize transfer flops as just leaving it to the manager who rather should concentrate on the actual playing staff. I also remember an article a couple of months ago describing how foreign signings feeling a bit forlorn at Newcastle and suffering from something like a cultural shock. I think keeping players happy would also contribute to minimizing the risk of more expensive foreign failures at Newcastle.

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Guest alex
So, employing Souness was a mistake which was easily avoidable then? At least that's how I saw it. Who's to blame though, I'll go for Shepherd. Don't see how us getting to the latter stages on the Champions League exonerates him of a mistake he made afterwards.

Re: Roeder, I've already said I hope he proves me wrong.

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You are completely unable to grasp the fact that everyone makes mistakes in football Alex.

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There are mistakes, then there are gargantuan fuck-ups. Only an idiot or an eternal optimist would have thought that Souness's tenure would have been anything other than the latter.

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Strange that such a brilliant board of directors thought fit to appoint him as well eh ?

 

Along with all of those people who backed his changes, therefore backing the board appointing him ... of only myself, Renton, HTL and only one or two others said would be disastrous.

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Who backed Souness then eh? All those people my arse. I never wanted him and I'd love to see you find one little bit of support for him from me. To be honest, I think the general mood was one of stunned, silent, apathy; as was obvious from the crowd at the matches. Plus, as has been pointed out many times, the only person who backed him who mattered was Shepherd.

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So, employing Souness was a mistake which was easily avoidable then? At least that's how I saw it. Who's to blame though, I'll go for Shepherd. Don't see how us getting to the latter stages on the Champions League exonerates him of a mistake he made afterwards.

Re: Roeder, I've already said I hope he proves me wrong.

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You are completely unable to grasp the fact that everyone makes mistakes in football Alex.

136716[/snapback]

There are mistakes, then there are gargantuan fuck-ups. Only an idiot or an eternal optimist would have thought that Souness's tenure would have been anything other than the latter.

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Strange that such a brilliant board of directors thought fit to appoint him as well eh ?

 

Along with all of those people who backed his changes, therefore backing the board appointing him ... of only myself, Renton, HTL and only one or two others said would be disastrous.

136731[/snapback]

 

What complete and utter bollox. Your avid 'spin' is largely having the opposite effect of your intentions. Try something different.

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So, employing Souness was a mistake which was easily avoidable then? At least that's how I saw it. Who's to blame though, I'll go for Shepherd. Don't see how us getting to the latter stages on the Champions League exonerates him of a mistake he made afterwards.

Re: Roeder, I've already said I hope he proves me wrong.

136700[/snapback]

 

You are completely unable to grasp the fact that everyone makes mistakes in football Alex.

136716[/snapback]

There are mistakes, then there are gargantuan fuck-ups. Only an idiot or an eternal optimist would have thought that Souness's tenure would have been anything other than the latter.

136724[/snapback]

 

Strange that such a brilliant board of directors thought fit to appoint him as well eh ?

 

Along with all of those people who backed his changes, therefore backing the board appointing him ... of only myself, Renton, HTL and only one or two others said would be disastrous.

136731[/snapback]

Who backed Souness then eh? All those people my arse. I never wanted him and I'd love to see you find one little bit of support for him from me. To be honest, I think the general mood was one of stunned, silent, apathy; as was obvious from the crowd at the matches. Plus, as has been pointed out many times, the only person who backed him who mattered was Shepherd.

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From my memory few, if any, people were happy with the appointment. Even Gemmill only supported him by successfully talking himself into the notion that we needed a "no nonsense" manager, and then foolishly sticking to his guns when it was obviously not working. And iirc, HTL gave Souness a fair old chance before turning on him too. But as you say, the relevance of this in somehow exonerating Shepherd of blame is lost on me. It was an idiotic appointment, and what type of person makes an idiotic appointment? An idiot, surely.

 

This time round I don't think any of us are as worried with the appointment, but for some us there is still a strong sense of disappointment.

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So, employing Souness was a mistake which was easily avoidable then? At least that's how I saw it. Who's to blame though, I'll go for Shepherd. Don't see how us getting to the latter stages on the Champions League exonerates him of a mistake he made afterwards.

Re: Roeder, I've already said I hope he proves me wrong.

136700[/snapback]

 

You are completely unable to grasp the fact that everyone makes mistakes in football Alex.

136716[/snapback]

There are mistakes, then there are gargantuan fuck-ups. Only an idiot or an eternal optimist would have thought that Souness's tenure would have been anything other than the latter.

136724[/snapback]

 

Strange that such a brilliant board of directors thought fit to appoint him as well eh ?

 

Along with all of those people who backed his changes, therefore backing the board appointing him ... of only myself, Renton, HTL and only one or two others said would be disastrous.

136731[/snapback]

Who backed Souness then eh? All those people my arse. I never wanted him and I'd love to see you find one little bit of support for him from me. To be honest, I think the general mood was one of stunned, silent, apathy; as was obvious from the crowd at the matches. Plus, as has been pointed out many times, the only person who backed him who mattered was Shepherd.

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From my memory few, if any, people were happy with the appointment. Even Gemmill only supported him by successfully talking himself into the notion that we needed a "no nonsense" manager, and then foolishly sticking to his guns when it was obviously not working. And iirc, HTL gave Souness a fair old chance before turning on him too. But as you say, the relevance of this in somehow exonerating Shepherd of blame is lost on me. It was an idiotic appointment, and what type of person makes an idiotic appointment? An idiot, surely.

 

This time round I don't think any of us are as worried with the appointment, but for some us there is still a strong sense of disappointment.

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You'd be good at Rap i reckon...

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My mate works for an online bettnig company down London, he sets the odds based on his informed sporting knowledge and doctorate in maths/stats. So way back when Souness got sacked he was asked to do the odds for who'd be the next toon boss. His company knowing he was an avid fan thought this would be sound practice.

 

My mate put Roeder at 70/1 and back him to the tune of 100 quid. Paid out today. I'm currently trying to sort myself a long weekend so's i can hot foot it down to London to help him blow his winnings in some soho stripclubs! :D

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I'm not uncomfortable with the choice. I don't give too much about what happened at his previous jobs because I can't see how this is of any relevance for what might happen at Newcastle. As far as I can see Roeder definitely has some coaching skills and knows how to address obvious problems. So Newcastle might the perfect job if he has learnt from previous failures. That is in contrast to the tosser before who because of his lack in character and managing skills had written disaster all over him.

 

The problem I have his with the appointment his because it his so uninspiring. It doesn't look progressive at all. I hoped a new man (like Hiddink or that kind) would have brough in a new type of more professional football culture with new coaching methods, better match preparations etc. I really hoped Newcastle were taking their time to come up with a though out long term plan how to close the gap to other teams who look well ahead in this department. We ended up with a decent bloke as manager backed up by local chaps as his staff. You don't need more than two brain cells to come up with this idea...

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What you say makes sense, however the concept of "long term stability" is inconsitent. It seems that some people want long term stability, but because it may be a Newcastle connection one it doesn't count. The new staff and coaching dept all have Newcastle connections, and Roeder is a progressive thinker. Do you want it or not ? We have had plenty of Liverpool connections in the past 14 years, and only Keegan did well with the first team.

 

My position is as it always has been by the way, the whole concept of a "5 year plan" is a complete load of bollocks. If the manager wins games he stays and if he loses he goes, its as simple as that.

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Don't understand me wrong, I don't have any problem with the idea of prefering to employ local people. I just think that other criterias should come before. I also partly agree with you that it depends on the success if a manager will stay or not.

What I am about his the general set up of a club that gives stability to a club. I also do agree that Roeder seems to be a forward thinking man. I just think that he might have been in fact in a better position as a director of the academy. This was a department not very well run in recent years if you compare it to other big clubs. Just look at other clubs like PSV or Ajax who just live from breeding talents. And that's where I think long term planning comes into it. And that is why good coaching is so important. Newcastle can't throw money after players like Chelsea can, so they have to try to get the best out of cheaper players or youngsters. That's why I am a bit sceptical about employing someone totally unproven like Lee Clark in an important role. He may be one, but I'd rather like to see him working his way up gradually instead of just been giving the job as soon as he retires. And the same applies for Alan Shearer.

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and we had not needlessly bought the heartless Spanish twat

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Who bought him again? :D

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eerrr....Souness ?

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Fat Fred & Son

 

IDST

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Who CHOSE him then ?

 

Staggering someone thinks the chairman is the team manager. Clueless.

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and we had not needlessly bought the heartless Spanish twat

136713[/snapback]

 

Who bought him again? :D

136718[/snapback]

 

eerrr....Souness ?

136728[/snapback]

 

Fat Fred & Son

 

IDST

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Who CHOSE him then ?

 

Staggering someone thinks the chairman is the team manager. Clueless.

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Yep, I'm totally fucking clueless. I just keep digesting the shit the club peddle. Mmmmmm....

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and we had not needlessly bought the heartless Spanish twat

136713[/snapback]

 

Who bought him again? :D

136718[/snapback]

 

eerrr....Souness ?

136728[/snapback]

 

Fat Fred & Son

 

IDST

136742[/snapback]

 

Who CHOSE him then ?

 

Staggering someone thinks the chairman is the team manager. Clueless.

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Yep, I'm totally fucking clueless. I just keep digesting the shit the club peddle. Mmmmmm....

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genuine question, although I accept clueless may be harsh :D

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By the way I reckon we'll finish 5th or 6th next season with Roeder in charge.  That's my colours nailed to Renton's mid-table forehead.

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nah, Souness has gone you can come out now :D

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My biggest worry is Freddie seeing Roeder as first team coach in the continental stylee with himself as the Overlord controlling transfers. Admittedly I have no evidence at all for this, but he does seem fond of the dramatic gesture like the Geordie Galactico Owen.

 

I tend to try and keep hoping for the best when it comes to Newcastle, so I am encouraged by the lack of want away talk from the players, that Shay has signed a new contract, and the obvious improvement in atmosphere around the club.

 

Roeder seems very intelligent and knowlegable about the game, and hopefully will prove to be good technically, something we have never really had enough of.

 

He seems fairly media friendly, but hasnt really faced too much crap yet- that probably wont be long coming. Its hard to have much preconceived idea of how its likely to go, which should keep it interesting if nothing else.

 

I think its a shame Shearer wont be more involved, not a popular view on here I know, but they seem a natural partnership to me, and if Shearer is to stay involved much easier this way than looming over any future incoming manager.

 

Anyway, Newcastle are such a bloody infuriating enigma would anybody actually be that surprised if this seemingly unlikely appointment proved a success.

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