David Kelly

I fancy a draw. A lot will depend on Cook and Anderson for us. I don't think we have near the bowling depth of them so we need to out bat them.

So the player you've harped on about for years you see as a bench warmer?

Maybe he could take Krul & CT with him and then the wizard could dish out the lot?

Both left wingers too. How are we going to play them both anyway CT?

Ok so it's a fucking big bird.

I learned there was something scary called a cassowary. Then I googled it and found out it's a fucking bird!

I'm sure there's at least one of those people!

I think a lot of supporters saw Carver and Stone as just being here because they are Geordies and was supposed to get the fans onside. They had no pedigree other than Carvers own constant ramblings about working with Bobby Robson. Obviously McClaren has pedigree with being the former England manager as well as leading the kiddy fiddlers to their only trophy and a European final and winning the league with Twente. It's also worth noting that he was coach at Manure for their best ever season. Of course Ferguson takes most of the credit for that but McClaren has been noted a major factor at the time also. Simpson has managed a number of times in his own right and is obviously known to and rated by McClaren as he's brought him from Derby. Cathro is something of an unknown quantity and I think that's definitely part of his appeal. It actually looks like an appointment made based on consideration of what we want to do rather than just a mate of McClaren. He's also got an impressive record in his short career. In portgal he was part of a coaching team that took Rio Ave to their best ever league position and subsequently moved on to Valencia and helped them to an impresive 4th place (you might say that's where Valencia should be but I beleive they did it spending very little and playing very well). This is certainly why I'm positive about the appointments but I'm sure there's many others who are just happy for the change.

We've bought their transfer ban from them for £2.3m!

Obviously I disagree with you on the first point. Clearly they are very good players but imo their athleticism tips them them over the edge. Essien was also a very good example of this type of player. Re the reasons why football is different here, I'm not for one second suggesting that there's something in the evironment here that makes playing in a more continential fashion impossible. I totally agree with you on the reasons you state. Those reasons have lead us to where we are, and where we currently are is that Colback (an average player at best) is more suited to the game here an therefor more useful than Anita. Anita probably does have a case in that he's never been given a good run to prove himself but equally he's never shown enough when he's had the chance. Colback immediately showed his worth, Anita has been here three years and up until the last game of the season I wouldn't say he's ever had a good game and many times (particularly last season) he's been awful. The circumstances we were in and the other players he had to play with undoubtedly hampered him last season but he's just not done anywhere near enough and I don't think he ever will. But maybe McClaren having experience of managing in Holland and Germany might be able to get us playing in a better style (lets face it he can't have us playing much worse) and Anita can prove me wrong.

CT is stating as fact that our new coaches are definitely a big improvement on last season based upon, as AH points out, three articles on Cathro. He's also then stating as fact that these better coaches would easily have brought us at least 9 more points last season. Supposing that they are better it's logical to assume they would get more out of the players. It's not logical to assume that would easily traslate to 9 additional points with the same set of useless injured players we had. As always he's being ridiculously optimistic based on very little actual knowledge. That's the problem with what he's saying.

I was suggesting the reason those bigger players were world class was because of their physical attributes rather than their skill that's the only reason I mentioned them. There is of course a lot of much more physical players who aren't that good but they all have more success in this country. I'm not wanting to sound like I think it should be all about kick and run and I'm not denegrating the style of play in other leagues. But the way football is played here is different and needs different things.

Maybe. I stuck with him for a long time but last season for the most part he was hopeless. Would have helped him of course if he was playing with better players. He only ever really gets a game when we're struggling. That never helps any player.

It's the one thing me and JC agree on!

The players you're naming there are all among the best in the last 20 years (or longer in Gazza's case but he was never small so I don't see where he comes into this). They were/are exceptional which is exactly my point. Anita doesn't have the strength to hold bigger players off or the pace to allow himself not to need to. That's what I'm talkling about in terms of physicality.

All I can judge him on is a string of poor performances.

I take that as a massive victory

No but he has some strength. Anita is small, not strong and not particularly fast. He is a tidy passer of the ball but that's never going to be enough over here. We've seen time and time again small players who have ability fail because physically they can't match their skill. In just the last few months we've released Adam Campbell who has the same problem. I fear Adam Armstrong will end up the same. And the way football is going it's just going to be more and more the case. The likes of Toure and Pogba are such good athlete's they can boss other players out of a game easily. Putting up the likes of Anita against them is a complete missmatch. But even smaller players such as Hazard have got more of a physicality about them, they have to or they won't be able to get the opportunity to show their skills.

I'm not saying you have to massive to be quality in any position. But really small players have to be exceptional. Anita is anything but exceptional. I can't understand how a scout of Carr's renown couldn't see that.

I repeat, Anita & Abeid are shite. You are calling players from other teams journeymen but those two aren't close to that quality. I'd take Barry, Barkley, Besic and McCarthy over all of our midfielders fwiw. You take Barry and Barkley out of a three man midfeild of theirs and you can put out Besic, McCarthy & Osman/Gibson/Cleverly. That's a mid table midfield there with two players as backup. You take out Sissoko and Tiote from ours and you're left with Colback, Abeid & Anita with no back up at all. That there is a relegation battle if ever I saw one. You might mock Swansea, West Brom and Stoke's midfield but we've seen them regurlarly murder ours. It's time to stop believing the hype of our players because it simply doesn't translate to performances on the pitch. Partially that's due to our awful coaches but it's also due to players not being good enough (Abeid, Anita, Raylor, Jonas) and believing their own hype/not being interested in being here (Sissoko/Tiote). I'd take honest players who put everything in like Nolan, Noble, N'Zonzi etc. Hell even useless shite like Glen Whelan and Jonjo Shelvey outplay our lot. Our midfield is poor unless Sissoko and Tiote can regularly play at their best. More likely neither of them will even be playing for us next season and if they are they will put in the same disinterested displays as they did last season unless we sign much better quality to play with them.

I agree Cattermole is wank but he's better in the premier league than Anita and Abeid. Anita is clearly far too small and weak to succeed here. Yes he might be able to do better if we played a bit football but he didn't look any better playing wit Cabaye than he did last season. I've litterally no idea what you've seen in Abeid to make you think he's good enough. As for teams outside the top 6, one name leaps to mind, Everton. McCarthy, Barry, Besic, Barkley, Osman, Gibson and Cleverly. That midfield absolutely pisses on ours. As does Southampton, Swansea, West Ham and Stoke.

Nope I'm not biting.

No I believe we are better off now. But to say we would have been comfortably mid table is ridiculous given the squad we had.

We'll likely play three central midfielders (everyone is playing that way these days) and I repeat that only three of them are premiership quality (and I have doubts about two of them given their inconsistency and lack of interest). Anita has had 1 good game in three years and clearly far too slow, weak and small to play in this league. Abeid couldn't get a game ahead of Raylor and Jonas last season (admittedly Carver was picking that team and he's a moron). To continue your argument from another thread, Cattermole is far better than Abeid or Anita. And he's pony. I don't think it would be unrealistic to expect more quality than we have because I don't really think we have any. Sissoko clearly has quality but has very little interest in showing it for us. Tiote's standards have dropped a lot in the last couple of years and I'm no longer convinced about him at all. Colback is our best midfielder by virtue of being consistantly ok. Benhind them we're shite. Of course we are weak and probably weaker up front, on the wing and in central defence and personally I would target those areas as a greater priority, but that doesn't mean we should be remotely confident about central midfield.

That's poor even by your standard CT.