Back to the future

[dbsweeney 0]

If you want to harness the power of the 12th man at SJP, you cant go into a season where realistically under the constraints of even a budget of 30m you can look to hopefully hit mid-table but have the fans expecting Europe. In fact the best way to harness the support and promote positivity throughout the club is to have expectations set around survival so that when mid-table results get produced, you capitalise on the extra positivity generated. In fact, you may even do better than you hoped at best.

 

This, for me, is not about saying 'we are going to be a yo-yo club, get used to it', its about achieving what Trevor Francis said after the Forest match, getting the fans expectations right. You can argue the toss about whether they are right to do this but this is what they are doing and for the reasons i have outlined.

 

 

What I've been trying to say .. but not as well.

[Happy Face 29]

Re: the poll. I'd rather rely on more qualitative data where i read 1000's of posts on here and NO expressing grave concerns about the season, reading the humility in the voices of every fan pre-Cardiff expecting defeat and the delight in the win, the attitudes of the core posters on here about the future of the club and the predictions of many that things were going toget worse before they got better. A poll means fuck all, its not been professionally phrased or researched beforehand so it has no validity as a source of opinion. As someone who specialises in research, i'd rather trust what i know from reading these forums. Your poll could have just been capturing people's hopes, not their expectations.

 

Secondly, why would Chris Hughton use press conferences and post-match interviews to send messages to players? Howay man, wake up.

 

Course there was negativity. It probably got worse as the summer went on and was at its worst after the Orient game. You specified "at the start of the season" so I'll give you that....but people did expect to be champions. Stevie says in that thread he'd have been embarrassed to finish second this season.

 

Most managers send messages to the players in interviews like.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

It’s about time people got real and realised that aside from being Newcastle United, we are just another promoted club that should go through the same motions every promoted club does in order to ensure survival.

 

Aim for 7th and you're more likely to survive than aiming for 17th.

 

I see your point Happy, honestly I do. But are you expecting Ashley to go ahead and spend 50 mill pounds next window?

 

You write what you think we should do. You too, Christmas.

 

I'm not saying aim for 17th, never did, but we have to be realistic. I'd like a knight on shining arabic horse horse to make us the next Man City ... but I don't see it happening anytime soon.

 

Why can't we aim to do what Birmingham's done this season or Stoke (to some extent). We've built a solid, tight-knit base. If Ashley spends a realistic amount of 20-25 mil to bring in some extra players, that'll help.

 

But going in, selling players and getting rid of CH (how many times have I read ... He's not a Prem. manager) and splashing the cash is most likely going to rock the unity that's developed over the last nine months. Also, if we do splash the cash, who do we end up spending it on? Why won't they be likely to be the next Owen , Viduka etc.

 

Finally, heaven forbid we splash the cash but still get relegated ... what happens then? Ashley won't bail us out again, the team talk after Layton Orient won't build unity again ... and we'd be floundering in the CCC in heavy debt and royally fucked.

 

Ashley is gojing to spend SOME money because he doesn't won't to see us dip in worth again by being relegated ... but this gung-ho talk of 'do it, and do it now' isn't going to work, nor is it going to happen.

 

Be realistic, that's all I'm saying.

 

As much as I care about NUFC ... we ARE just another promoted club. If we aren't ... tell me what we are.

 

Anyway, Christmas Tree and Happy Face, I'm happy to have the discussion with you. Peasepud, I don't understand what you're on about ...

 

George has it right:

Similarly, nobody at Newcastle is talking about the title or qualifying for Europe. St James’ this season has been utterly lacking in triumphalism and bluster, because there is a deep-seated understanding that theirs is a club in the early stages of recovery

 

 

I already did I agreed with you and Oztoonfan. It wasnt a sarcastic post.

[Happy Face 29]

 

Are you Mick Dennis? I'd love to meet the Newcastle fans saying we should sack Hughton.

 

So I've dreamt of the discussion talking of bringing Mark Hughes or that Hughton is a good coach but isn't tactically adept? It's been written on this board for months.

 

Talk of "ensuring survival" should ensure a fine for anyone at the club though.

 

Again, I never said just aim for 17th ... I'm just saying be realistic.

 

Let's build on what has been created over these last nine months.

 

What do you, taking into account the present facts, owner and situation, suggest we do?

 

At least engage in the argument instead of being a 'witty' wanker.

 

I thought the consensus in the Huges thread was "hughes is the sort of guy we should be looking at if hughton isn't up to it."

 

You're right though. There are some idiots suggesting he should go before a ball is kicked. A minority I'd say.

 

Spend £20m on one or two players. Aim for the top half. Simples.

[ChezGiven 0]

I disagree. I believe people believed a club like NUFC should hope to be champions given its size and stature in the game, thats what i reckon was behind Stevie's statement. Maybe he can comment himself about this.

 

I dont believe that many 'expected' it at all. We can agree to disagree on this, as the point i am making is about a fundamental understanding of the emotions of the fans 9 months ago. I dont think anyone thought it was definitely going to happen i.e. an expectation.

 

Most managers send messages to players in training iyam. Media is used to communicate to fans, which is what the club are doing when Hughton discusses next season.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

It’s about time people got real and realised that aside from being Newcastle United, we are just another promoted club that should go through the same motions every promoted club does in order to ensure survival.

 

Reach for the stars and you can make it to the moon.

 

We aim above the mark to hit the mark.

 

You can’t rest unless you set goals that make you stretch.

 

Aim at heaven and you get earth thrown in. Aim at earth and you get neither.

 

Not failure, but low aim, is crime.

 

It’s a funny thing about life: if you refuse to accept anything but the very best, you will often get it.

 

We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars.

 

etc.

 

Aim for 7th and you're more likely to survive than aiming for 17th.

 

Its taken me 12 years to get to where i wanted to be in my life, i've worked hard to do it and am finally about where i thought my ambition could take me. Took me till i was 36 to acheieve what i wanted. If i had expected to be here before i was 30 i would have been wrong and disappointed. I expected to get there eventually but i expected it to come from hard work, experience and importantly patience.

 

We werent unlucky last season and relegated by chance, we were shit, the club had fallen apart, it was broken. To put it back together again and return it to where it was in 2005/6, a full 4 seaons ago takes more than being promoted out of a shit league with players of dubious premier league quality.

 

I know what the club are trying to do with all their current communication, they are trying to manage expectations. The crowd at SJP this season has been right behind the team. Why? Because expectation levels were low at the start of the season, so our performances generated happiness. But when we came 5th, the fans were a disappointed. Why? Because the exectations of the 3rd the season before and the 4th in 01/02 had created high expectations. The happiness of a crowd and the positivity in a club is intrinsically connected to its expectations.

 

If you want to harness the power of the 12th man at SJP, you cant go into a season where realistically under the constraints of even a budget of 30m you can look to hopefully hit mid-table but have the fans expecting Europe. In fact the best way to harness the support and promote positivity throughout the club is to have expectations set around survival so that when mid-table results get produced, you capitalise on the extra positivity generated. In fact, you may even do better than you hoped at best.

 

This, for me, is not about saying 'we are going to be a yo-yo club, get used to it', its about achieving what Trevor Francis said after the Forest match, getting the fans expectations right. You can argue the toss about whether they are right to do this but this is what they are doing and for the reasons i have outlined.

 

 

Great Post

[Christmas Tree 3997]

Re: the poll. I'd rather rely on more qualitative data where i read 1000's of posts on here and NO expressing grave concerns about the season, reading the humility in the voices of every fan pre-Cardiff expecting defeat and the delight in the win, the attitudes of the core posters on here about the future of the club and the predictions of many that things were going toget worse before they got better. A poll means fuck all, its not been professionally phrased or researched beforehand so it has no validity as a source of opinion. As someone who specialises in research, i'd rather trust what i know from reading these forums. Your poll could have just been capturing people's hopes, not their expectations.

 

Secondly, why would Chris Hughton use press conferences and post-match interviews to send messages to players? Howay man, wake up.

 

Course there was negativity. It probably got worse as the summer went on and was at its worst after the Orient game. You specified "at the start of the season" so I'll give you that....but people did expect to be champions. Stevie says in that thread he'd have been embarrassed to finish second this season.

 

Most managers send messages to the players in interviews like.

 

The minority did, the majority thought play offs at best, according to the poll.

[Happy Face 29]

I disagree. I believe people believed a club like NUFC should hope to be champions given its size and stature in the game, thats what i reckon was behind Stevie's statement. Maybe he can comment himself about this.

 

I dont believe that many 'expected' it at all. We can agree to disagree on this, as the point i am making is about a fundamental understanding of the emotions of the fans 9 months ago. I dont think anyone thought it was definitely going to happen i.e. an expectation.

 

Most managers send messages to players in training iyam. Media is used to communicate to fans, which is what the club are doing when Hughton discusses next season.

 

There you have. The difference is hopes versus expectations.

 

Don't you think survival should be the minimum expectation and top half the hope?

 

Like I said, "we want to emulate Stoke/Birmingham". I'd be aghast if we performed little better than West Ham have this year and I'd give Ashley a shitload for it if it happened.

 

If he's lowered your expectation to the level you'd be happy with that kind of season then relegation's worked out well for him.

[ChezGiven 0]

I dont expect us to beat Sunderland away, nor any team at their level or better unless we spend at least 20m, even then it depends on a lot of different things.

 

I expect us to pick up points away from home against the worst sides since we could only manage a draw at WBA this season who most will have as going down.

 

How many do i expect to win at home out of 19 games? Maybe 7 or 8? 6 or 7 draws? Again depends. Whats that then in points? 42 ish.

 

Its going to be tough however you look at it.

[peasepud 59]

Excellent totally realistic posts from dbsweeny and oztoonfan.

 

Argument well and truly won against the doomongers.

 

Quite brilliant.

 

you make me smile on a dreary day

 

So do you, you lambast everyone who has an opinion on what they think may happen in the coming seasons and then you write as if you are privy to the inner workings of the Sports Direct Empire

 

I dont lambast anyone for having an opinion, what I have a problem with is people ignoring the facts that have come out of the club and somehow magically believing that Ashley has suddenly seen the light and will spend what is needed to ensure we at least do what we would all expect and thats to get as high up the league as possible.

 

The facts are that the club has set a low wage structure and constraints on purchases. Players under 26 costing less than a million was one quote while the wages has been clearly said a number of times to be under £15k p/w. More worrying though was the statement of "with a resale value", yes it makes sense to not spend £10m on a player who in two years wont recoup that but to turn us into a selling club is not football.

 

Add in the mix that we have shite players here currently who are on double that and you've got a problem.

 

Which self respecting 25 year old who wants to win things is going to come to a club who clearly show no ambition, a club whos stated aim is to survive? Which Premiership quality players are going to move to a club and play regular first team football while Alan Smith warms the bench on 30k? For that matter, do you think that the likes of Routledge, Guthrie, Lovenkrands etc are happy to put in their shifts while that goes on?

 

Do you think we have any chance of holding onto those players when they can move to the likes of Stoke, Birmingham, Makems etc and earn more than they do here, stand a chance of playing in Europe and play alongside some better quality experienced players, players who can help their career flourish? I dont think so.

 

You seem to think that there are only two options here, spend bugger all and do nothing or spend a fortune on "trophy players". None of us (or at least not me) think that we are in any position to go out and buy Ronaldo, Rooney or anyone else costing anything like £15m nor am I saying we do that. What you need to do though is get a sensible balance of experience, quality and youth to allow you to do more than survive. Doing that requires spending 4,5,6m on a player and paying them what they would get down the road.

 

As HF is saying, aim for 17th and the slightest problem you're goosed. Aim for 10th and you've got 7 places you can fall and still be safe.

 

All we ever talk about with NUFC these days is profit margins and balance sheets, all thats ever discussed with those is cutting back on player wages and purchase costs. There are two ways to make a healthier balance sheet. One is to raise the income the other is to reduce the costs. Both work but one is more successful than the other. Which do you think we're going for here?

 

What happened to the days of increasing the revenue? raising the bar by promoting better football and potential success then using that to attract further investment? Nothing ever appears to be done at this club for that, getting a better balance sheet is all one sided and thats the Sports Direct way. Employ staff on minimum wage, pile it high, sell it cheap. So the products crap? so what? these people will buy it because its cheaper than the shop down the road.

 

It works for a shop selling cheap tat, we're not that, we're a football club and a football clubs only priority should be to be as successful as they can. Cups, Europe, the League, it all generates income, it all gets people buying the shirts and attending the games. It gets you sponsorship deals of £15m not 6, it fills your corporate areas where companies pay tens of thousands to have a box.

 

Do you think these companies with offices in the North East have any affinity with the club? No. They purchase a box because its a good way to entertain potentail clients, they get a good day out, good atmosphere and some exciting football, give the client a day to remember and you've got a chance of that multi million pound contract. If they cant get that here then they'll buy a box 8 miles down the road where they'll see a club who are pushing towards the top ten and looking like they'll try for something.

 

That is why our football club is flawed.

[David Kelly 1117]

I dont expect us to beat Sunderland away, nor any team at their level or better unless we spend at least 20m, even then it depends on a lot of different things.

 

I expect us to pick up points away from home against the worst sides since we could only manage a draw at WBA this season who most will have as going down.

 

How many do i expect to win at home out of 19 games? Maybe 7 or 8? 6 or 7 draws? Again depends. Whats that then in points? 42 ish.

 

Its going to be tough however you look at it.

I expect a club of our size to beleive it can do better than clubs like Stoke, Birmingham, Fulham, Blackburn etc. I don't think it will all come straight away and I don't think we can expect a top half finish next season. But I don't expect us to aim for mediocraty!

 

With regards to your earlier point about lower expectations getting the fans behind the team, I think it will do the exact opposite. For my money there was a hell of a lot of apathy at the begining of this season which only lifted because we won games straight away and went straight up to the top of the league. That happened because this league is so poor and we had superior players.

We won't get those sort of results against premiership teams (especially if we have based our recruitment on trying to finish just above the relegation places). Our fans don't think of us the same way as Burnley fans think of their club so a relegation battle won't get anyone behind the team!

[ewerk 26514]

One of the problems with the restrictive transfer budget is our ability to attract a decent manager.

 

I'm not suggesting that CH should be out in the summer but if he doesn't succeed next season and come December we're looking for a new manager then who is going to touch us without the guarantee of a decent transfer kitty?

 

 

Oh aye...

 

[Guest alex]

Agree with Chez to an extent although more important than 'managing the expectations' of fans is having the club moving in the right direction. If that appears to be happening then the fans will get behind the team. So, although you can send out noises that suggest the club won't have a lot to spend etc., it won't appease the supporters unless they are given the impression the club is progressing at a reasonable pace. Basically what I am saying is that although you could argue just staying up is making progress, it doesn't necessarily stand to reason the supporters will be happy with this next season. Ashley needs to show ambition in order to show he isn't going to make the same errors that cost us so dearly last season. Either that or we get very lucky with a few bargain buys etc.

[ChezGiven 0]

I dont expect us to beat Sunderland away, nor any team at their level or better unless we spend at least 20m, even then it depends on a lot of different things.

 

I expect us to pick up points away from home against the worst sides since we could only manage a draw at WBA this season who most will have as going down.

 

How many do i expect to win at home out of 19 games? Maybe 7 or 8? 6 or 7 draws? Again depends. Whats that then in points? 42 ish.

 

Its going to be tough however you look at it.

I expect a club of our size to beleive it can do better than clubs like Stoke, Birmingham, Fulham, Blackburn etc. I don't think it will all come straight away and I don't think we can expect a top half finish next season. But I don't expect us to aim for mediocraty!

 

With regards to your earlier point about lower expectations getting the fans behind the team, I think it will do the exact opposite. For my money there was a hell of a lot of apathy at the begining of this season which only lifted because we won games straight away and went straight up to the top of the league. That happened because this league is so poor and we had superior players.

We won't get those sort of results against premiership teams (especially if we have based our recruitment on trying to finish just above the relegation places). Our fans don't think of us the same way as Burnley fans think of their club so a relegation battle won't get anyone behind the team!

 

No, my point was not that lower expectations will get fans behind the team. It was that next season will be enjoyable and probably more successful if we approach it with realistic ambitions. In simplistic terms, if we expect Europe, then 17th will be a failure, if we expect relegation then 17th will be a success. I'm not saying that what we should expect 17th, just illustrating the role they clearly play in determining the enjoyment of the season.

 

Realistically, we have about 20m to play with over the summer, lets see what happens, who comes in, who goes out, who the manager is etc, then look at the teams around the bottom half and set the expectations from there.

 

The issue here for me is that perhaps fans expect us to invest more money than we actually have. Since the squad is not that great and 20m is what we have to spend, what do you expect these players and Hughton to be able to acheive? If a realistic assessment of the relative abilities of our squad members vis a vis the squads of competing clubs shows a number of gaps and the investment is restricted to a feasible 20m, are you sensible in the head to expect Europe?

[Christmas Tree 3997]

The bottom line is there is far too much hysteria....

 

On the one side, you have a group of fans who see last year as a blip rather than the inevitability that had been coming for many seasons. They EXPECT, although they may only hint at it, that we SHOULD be challenging for Europe next season. They do not want to hear how football has changed, even though all around, clubs are struggling or are up for sale. Even ones with recent "success" such as Liverpool.

 

On the other side is a group of fans who have accepted we were heading for the drop and are just delighted to now be REBUILDING. They are not expecting a great deal from next season other than to strengthen the squad and try and stabalise ourselves around mid table. They then see the rebuilding continuing year on year so that this time we build on solid foundations.

 

With regard to players age and wage structures. Can someone link to where anyone from the club has said this is the case and will not be veered from?

 

It seems to be taken as fact yet I cant quite recall it being fact.

 

The sooner everyone comes to terms with the fact that the spend spend days are gone the better. The only route back to the top is by graduaL improvement.

[ewerk 26514]

On the one side, you have a group of fans who see last year as a blip rather than the inevitability that had been coming for many seasons. They EXPECT, although they may only hint at it, that we SHOULD be challenging for Europe next season. They do not want to hear how football has changed, even though all around, clubs are struggling or are up for sale. Even ones with recent "success" such as Liverpool.

 

Who are these fans?

[Guest alex]

Voices in his head tbh.

[ChezGiven 0]

I should add that i watched West Ham v Sunderland twice last weekend. Not once did i think we had the power, pace or strength on the ball of either team. We'd be raped by either of them if we played them away this weekend.

 

20m is what we have to get to THAT level.

[Happy Face 29]

Incredible CT can praise the Caulkin article then repeat the same cliche's he derides about Newcastle fans insisting on European qualification and nothing less.

[dbsweeney 0]

I already did I agreed with you and Oztoonfan. It wasnt a sarcastic post.

 

Sorry

[LeazesMag 0]

Refreshing to start seeing more people agree with what I've said for years........

[LeazesMag 0]

I don't think there's apathy. I think there's realism.

 

Aim to not go down again ... but that doesn't mean if the club will acheves safety we'll put the breaks on getting any more wins.

 

EVERY team starts every game at least hoping for a win. Whether you get them or not a a different matter. But saying that because we are aiming for safety (whch we should be) means that's all we'll achieve is ridiculous.

 

If your talking about Ashley's spending etc. he's not gonna spend big until he's sure that his investment is safe and we aren't going down again.

 

He most certainly doesn't want us to go down again, so he'll spend a least a little over the break.

 

Come next winter, if we're in a position where safety looks likely (or even if we're around 17/18), he'll spend to buy replacements for positions where we have shortfalls and injuries. He wants to see us go over the line, just like he did this winter. At least on this account, he's shown a (recent) positive past history.

 

But for him to go all-out with spending sees us repeating all of the mistakes of the past and not taking any of the few benefits we've received from being promoted.

 

FFS, give it time people!!

 

laughable tbh, you've dreamt that havent you?

 

Ashley has no intention of spending "big" in fact he has no intentions of spending "medium" or even "sensible".

 

Their model is clear, buy it cheap, pay it peanuts and then when the product shows any kind of profit sell it on only in this case the product isnt shirts or shoes but players. Getting into Europe is not even on the radar because its not part of the plan. Yes, if somehow we make it then he'll be laughing all the way to the bank but its irrelevant to him other than being another income stream.

 

The "mistakes" of the past are just that, mistakes, slip ups. The model was right, the plan (even if LM says there wasnt one ) worked however it fell down by some purchases not living up to their already proven ability.

 

We are no longer a football club, we're a diversification of Sports Direct, another arm of the company, another income for Ashley.

 

 

Nailed

 

ps........by "plan" I was disputing those who insisted a "plan" was a sure fire way of getting success on the pitch. I know that Ashleys "plan" is in effect lowering expectations, spending less money and making a small profit, and he has succeeded in doing this to a degree ie the people who are accepting these lower standards. But I have said what his "plan" was for ages now it was obvious as fuck to me quite early after he took over the club.

 

It's ambition that counts. We are not Bolton or Wigan.

[dbsweeney 0]

ps........by "plan" I was disputing those who insisted a "plan" was a sure fire way of getting success on the pitch. I know that Ashleys "plan" is in effect lowering expectations, spending less money and making a small profit, and he has succeeded in doing this to a degree ie the people who are accepting these lower standards. But I have said what his "plan" was for ages now it was obvious as fuck to me quite early after he took over the club.

 

I think you might be giving Ashley too much credit to think of such a scheme. I think he's just looked around at the current economic climate (and particularly what it's like in the Premiership in terms of levels of debt) and decided that the gradual option is the way to go. He may also be hoping (wishing, maybe) that the talk of financial restraints being placed on clubs comes true so that there is a more equal playing field.

 

And you're right, a lot of it has to do with his money. It has to do with reducing the loss the club has made over the last few years and making us at least somewhat financially sound so he doesn't have to sink too much of his own cash into it. But I still don't believe he's looking to just use us as a cash cow as I can't think of a worse way to make money than by owning an English football team. It just doesn't happen, or if it does it's extremely difficult and rare.

 

This argument is just going to go around in circles ... and I've yet to hear a convincing case of how he'll make money (considering what he's already spent) and that he's ready to suck us dry.

 

You seem to be stating that making the club financially sound is bad thing. Why?

 

It's the only way to keep a club existing in the long run unless:

* you have a benfefactor willing to simply bankroll a club and doesn't mind making a loss (Man City, Chelsea)

* you built up strength more than a decade ago due to a mixture of clever management and recruitment, maintaining a top four position and the money that comes with it, before the disparity between the Big 4 and the rest really took a strangle hold (and yet, Liverpool and Man U have still a enormous debt).

 

We don't have either.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

Excellent totally realistic posts from dbsweeny and oztoonfan.

 

Argument well and truly won against the doomongers.

 

Quite brilliant.

 

you make me smile on a dreary day

 

So do you, you lambast everyone who has an opinion on what they think may happen in the coming seasons and then you write as if you are privy to the inner workings of the Sports Direct Empire

 

I dont lambast anyone for having an opinion, what I have a problem with is people ignoring the facts that have come out of the club and somehow magically believing that Ashley has suddenly seen the light and will spend what is needed to ensure we at least do what we would all expect and thats to get as high up the league as possible.

 

The facts are that the club has set a low wage structure and constraints on purchases. Players under 26 costing less than a million was one quote while the wages has been clearly said a number of times to be under £15k p/w. More worrying though was the statement of "with a resale value", yes it makes sense to not spend £10m on a player who in two years wont recoup that but to turn us into a selling club is not football.

 

Add in the mix that we have shite players here currently who are on double that and you've got a problem.

 

Which self respecting 25 year old who wants to win things is going to come to a club who clearly show no ambition, a club whos stated aim is to survive? Which Premiership quality players are going to move to a club and play regular first team football while Alan Smith warms the bench on 30k? For that matter, do you think that the likes of Routledge, Guthrie, Lovenkrands etc are happy to put in their shifts while that goes on?

 

Do you think we have any chance of holding onto those players when they can move to the likes of Stoke, Birmingham, Makems etc and earn more than they do here, stand a chance of playing in Europe and play alongside some better quality experienced players, players who can help their career flourish? I dont think so.

 

You seem to think that there are only two options here, spend bugger all and do nothing or spend a fortune on "trophy players". None of us (or at least not me) think that we are in any position to go out and buy Ronaldo, Rooney or anyone else costing anything like £15m nor am I saying we do that. What you need to do though is get a sensible balance of experience, quality and youth to allow you to do more than survive. Doing that requires spending 4,5,6m on a player and paying them what they would get down the road.

 

As HF is saying, aim for 17th and the slightest problem you're goosed. Aim for 10th and you've got 7 places you can fall and still be safe.

 

All we ever talk about with NUFC these days is profit margins and balance sheets, all thats ever discussed with those is cutting back on player wages and purchase costs. There are two ways to make a healthier balance sheet. One is to raise the income the other is to reduce the costs. Both work but one is more successful than the other. Which do you think we're going for here?

 

What happened to the days of increasing the revenue? raising the bar by promoting better football and potential success then using that to attract further investment? Nothing ever appears to be done at this club for that, getting a better balance sheet is all one sided and thats the Sports Direct way. Employ staff on minimum wage, pile it high, sell it cheap. So the products crap? so what? these people will buy it because its cheaper than the shop down the road.

 

It works for a shop selling cheap tat, we're not that, we're a football club and a football clubs only priority should be to be as successful as they can. Cups, Europe, the League, it all generates income, it all gets people buying the shirts and attending the games. It gets you sponsorship deals of £15m not 6, it fills your corporate areas where companies pay tens of thousands to have a box.

 

Do you think these companies with offices in the North East have any affinity with the club? No. They purchase a box because its a good way to entertain potentail clients, they get a good day out, good atmosphere and some exciting football, give the client a day to remember and you've got a chance of that multi million pound contract. If they cant get that here then they'll buy a box 8 miles down the road where they'll see a club who are pushing towards the top ten and looking like they'll try for something.

 

That is why our football club is flawed.

 

"We are going up" range, Now out!

 

http://www.medocmall.co.uk/cgi-bin/live/ec...;sub_dept_id=10

 

[LeazesMag 0]

Excellent totally realistic posts from dbsweeny and oztoonfan.

 

Argument well and truly won against the doomongers.

 

Quite brilliant.

 

you make me smile on a dreary day

 

So do you, you lambast everyone who has an opinion on what they think may happen in the coming seasons and then you write as if you are privy to the inner workings of the Sports Direct Empire

 

I dont lambast anyone for having an opinion, what I have a problem with is people ignoring the facts that have come out of the club and somehow magically believing that Ashley has suddenly seen the light and will spend what is needed to ensure we at least do what we would all expect and thats to get as high up the league as possible.

 

The facts are that the club has set a low wage structure and constraints on purchases. Players under 26 costing less than a million was one quote while the wages has been clearly said a number of times to be under £15k p/w. More worrying though was the statement of "with a resale value", yes it makes sense to not spend £10m on a player who in two years wont recoup that but to turn us into a selling club is not football.

 

Add in the mix that we have shite players here currently who are on double that and you've got a problem.

 

Which self respecting 25 year old who wants to win things is going to come to a club who clearly show no ambition, a club whos stated aim is to survive? Which Premiership quality players are going to move to a club and play regular first team football while Alan Smith warms the bench on 30k? For that matter, do you think that the likes of Routledge, Guthrie, Lovenkrands etc are happy to put in their shifts while that goes on?

 

Do you think we have any chance of holding onto those players when they can move to the likes of Stoke, Birmingham, Makems etc and earn more than they do here, stand a chance of playing in Europe and play alongside some better quality experienced players, players who can help their career flourish? I dont think so.

 

You seem to think that there are only two options here, spend bugger all and do nothing or spend a fortune on "trophy players". None of us (or at least not me) think that we are in any position to go out and buy Ronaldo, Rooney or anyone else costing anything like £15m nor am I saying we do that. What you need to do though is get a sensible balance of experience, quality and youth to allow you to do more than survive. Doing that requires spending 4,5,6m on a player and paying them what they would get down the road.

 

As HF is saying, aim for 17th and the slightest problem you're goosed. Aim for 10th and you've got 7 places you can fall and still be safe.

 

All we ever talk about with NUFC these days is profit margins and balance sheets, all thats ever discussed with those is cutting back on player wages and purchase costs. There are two ways to make a healthier balance sheet. One is to raise the income the other is to reduce the costs. Both work but one is more successful than the other. Which do you think we're going for here?

 

What happened to the days of increasing the revenue? raising the bar by promoting better football and potential success then using that to attract further investment? Nothing ever appears to be done at this club for that, getting a better balance sheet is all one sided and thats the Sports Direct way. Employ staff on minimum wage, pile it high, sell it cheap. So the products crap? so what? these people will buy it because its cheaper than the shop down the road.

 

It works for a shop selling cheap tat, we're not that, we're a football club and a football clubs only priority should be to be as successful as they can. Cups, Europe, the League, it all generates income, it all gets people buying the shirts and attending the games. It gets you sponsorship deals of £15m not 6, it fills your corporate areas where companies pay tens of thousands to have a box.

 

Do you think these companies with offices in the North East have any affinity with the club? No. They purchase a box because its a good way to entertain potentail clients, they get a good day out, good atmosphere and some exciting football, give the client a day to remember and you've got a chance of that multi million pound contract. If they cant get that here then they'll buy a box 8 miles down the road where they'll see a club who are pushing towards the top ten and looking like they'll try for something.

 

That is why our football club is flawed.

 

"We are going up" range, Now out!

 

http://www.medocmall.co.uk/cgi-bin/live/ec...;sub_dept_id=10

 

 

 

The Glory of it