Politics

[Park Life 70]

It's not about students and uni's ffs!!

[Park Life 70]

We all drift to the right as we get older, so Clee is going to be sporting Jackboots and kicking the fuck out of the blacks when he is my age.

 

Not all of us.

[The Fish 9085]

It's not about students and uni's ffs!!

Of course it isn't you lunatic, but this particular side street on which me and Andrew have driven, is.

[Park Life 70]

Of course it isn't you lunatic, but this particular side street on which me and Andrew have driven, is.

 

You have to ask yourself why that is? Cause your perusal. purview and analysis is as casual as Carling man.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

I didn't say you celebrated them losing their jobs. Read the post again.

 

You imply it and personalise it which ends up in petty crap and no discussion.

 

Not for me.

[Park Life 70]

Education was politicised and franchised in the 80's it ceases to be a public service. It isn't anymore about investing in the future and all that guff. The current lot have no interest in changing that. Most private schools are charities to rub salt into the wounds.

[The Fish 9085]

You have to ask yourself why that is? Cause your perusal. purview and analysis is as casual as Carling man.

Onions baby.

 

I'm aware that there are reasons beneath the reasons beneath the reasons etc. however if I'm talking with someone who's argument is a surface argument, it's more enjoyable for me to discuss that argument.

 

They're not necessarily isolated from deeper themes and machinations, but can be discussed. It's like talking with someone in a pub who doesn't like football as much as me. I won't bother going into great depth because neither of us want that. When my Housemate first started to talk to me about Rangers football club I glossed over a little and now we can happily have a conversation about that topic without my needing The History Of: in the forefront of my mind. Similarly I curtail the amount of detail I go into about Newcastle.

 

Now Andrew and I are both savy enough to know that it's not simply tuition fees and student numbers, but his argument a, and my argument b, operate in the same framework to let us have a discussion about it.

 

and CT, I didn't think I'd have to write it out in crayon. In a thread where people were worried for their jobs if the tories got into power, you celebrated the tories getting into power. People called you on it then and I'm calling you on it now. That's why people "get nasty", your insensitivity and fanboy actions.

Edited July 25, 2012 by The Fish

[Park Life 70]

Onions baby.

 

I'm aware that there are reasons beneath the reasons beneath the reasons etc. however if I'm talking with someone who's argument is a surface argument, it's more enjoyable for me to discuss that argument.

 

They're not necessarily isolated from deeper themes and machinations, but can be discussed. It's like talking with someone in a pub who doesn't like football as much as me. I won't bother going into great depth because neither of us want that. When my Housemate first started to talk to me about Rangers football club I glossed over a little and now we can happily have a conversation about that topic without my needing The History Of: in the forefront of my mind. Similarly I curtail the amount of detail I go into about Newcastle.

 

Now Andrew and I are both savy enough to know that it's not simply tuition fees and student numbers, but his argument a, and my argument b, operate in the same framework to let us have a discussion about it.

 

and CT, I didn't think I'd have to write it out in crayon. In a thread where people were worried for their jobs if the tories got into power, you celebrated the tories getting into power. People called you on it then and I'm calling you on it now. That's why people "get nasty", you're insensitivity and fanboy actions.

 

Carry on.

[The Fish 9085]

Carry on.

Thanks, although I think I need help with wolfy... I don't speak the same language I fear

[Christmas Tree 3997]

Onions baby.

 

I'm aware that there are reasons beneath the reasons beneath the reasons etc. however if I'm talking with someone who's argument is a surface argument, it's more enjoyable for me to discuss that argument.

 

They're not necessarily isolated from deeper themes and machinations, but can be discussed. It's like talking with someone in a pub who doesn't like football as much as me. I won't bother going into great depth because neither of us want that. When my Housemate first started to talk to me about Rangers football club I glossed over a little and now we can happily have a conversation about that topic without my needing The History Of: in the forefront of my mind. Similarly I curtail the amount of detail I go into about Newcastle.

 

Now Andrew and I are both savy enough to know that it's not simply tuition fees and student numbers, but his argument a, and my argument b, operate in the same framework to let us have a discussion about it.

 

and CT, I didn't think I'd have to write it out in crayon. In a thread where people were worried for their jobs if the tories got into power, you celebrated the tories getting into power. People called you on it then and I'm calling you on it now. That's why people "get nasty", your insensitivity and fanboy actions.

 

Make your mind up Dave. A few posts ago you are saying partisans politics is good. Now you are saying me celebrating the party I voted for winning is bad!

 

This is what happens when you personalise.

 

Much better sticking to debating the meat and bones.

[Park Life 70]

You've personally lost people their jobs CT. Live with it!!

[Renton 17924]

Aye it's true that there's some like that on both sides, but that's worse with labour. The types you get at Uni who moan everything the Tories do regardless of how small it is just bores me. As someone who believes in tuition fee increases they've not done anything that directly annoys me (in alright jack ) but if they did I'd slag em off. It's not that I'd never vote labour (or conservatives for that matter) its just that as it stands I believe we have the right men in. The absolute worst thing about labour however is how they claim to be 'the good guys', they spend years portraying the Tories as horrible bastards, and they do little to differentiate themselves when it comes down to it. When it comes to personalities there is very little between them, when it comes to policies it's opinion, I respect someone for voting labour as long as its not a case of 'labour/conservatives say this so it must be right.'

 

Paragraphs are shit

 

Why doesn't the fee increase affect you? Am I right in thinking because your the right side of the cut off point so your attitude to your juniors is basically screw you? If so that is an incredibly cuntish attitude to have, it honestly is.

[wolfy 12]

All political parties sing from the same hymn sheet, they just do it slightly differently but the end product is always the same.....something comes crashing down in some shape or form.

 

That's just my opinion though.

[Park Life 70]

Why doesn't the fee increase affect you? Am I right in thinking because your the right side of the cut off point so your attitude to your juniors is basically screw you? If so that is an incredibly cuntish attitude to have, it honestly is.

 

Don't think this brother is with the zeitgeist as in New Labour is old Tory.

[Park Life 70]

All political parties sing from the same hymn sheet, they just do it slightly differently but the end product is always the same.....something comes crashing down in some shape or form.

 

That's just my opinion though.

 

Lackeys of the bankers and the others who have 13trillion stashed in Switzerland. Arm the people and show dark knight on rotation.

[Renton 17924]

I'm centrist . Tuition fees were too cheap to the point where unis tried getting more foreign students for the money, meaning locals get fucked over as there's less places for them. Also University is becoming too common (as in more people going not more lower class people, which is a good thing) an activity to the point where every small town has its own university with thousands of students, making degrees worthless. A hike means not only are universities getting more money from locals (meaning more money spent on the education) less people will think 'fuck it I'll just go to university then' if they don't know what to do. Less people collecting debts over a media degree from manchester metropolitan can only be a good thing (I only go to an average Uni as it is, although it is good at history. I also realise im doing a degree with no real world use but hey I enjoy history so I may as well do what I enjoy.) Sorry for the digression it's just I've had to listen to the tuition fees bullshit for so long as if it's relevant to the rest of the nation. Also labour were going to raise them anyway so that one is always null and void.

 

Foreign students aren't keeping locals out ffs. The standards for getting into University are so low nowadays compared to previous decades that if you can't make the grade you really shouldn't be there. You're also contradicting yourself in the same post. You complain 'locals' aren't getting in because of foreign competition, but then go on to say there are too many people doing degrees anyway. You then go on to imply that higher fees will be a useful deterrent for people who 'don't know what to do', but admit you're doing your own degree in history because 'you enjoy it' rather than any future career plans you might have.

 

Were you pissed when you posted this?

[Renton 17924]

Anyway, the economic situation we find ourselves in now was exactly predicted two years ago by myself, Chez, Sponge Bob (where is he?), HF and others. CT, Phil, and Agent Axeman have been proven wrong. The posts are all there in black and white if anyone wants to have a look.

 

It's of no consequence that a few posters on an internet messageboard have been shown to be right or wrong of course. What I do find really frightening though is Osbourne's continued insistence he is right and there is no need for a plan B. He predicted that the economy would have expanded by 5% by this stage; infact it has actually contracted since the election. Think about that, it's disastrous. Our economy is currently contracting faster than Spain's. The bond markets which Osbourne has been so desperate to appease are getting twitchy about our credit rating. We really are on the edge of a vortex, but the oarsman is either blind to it or really doesn't give a shit.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

You've personally lost people their jobs CT. Live with it!!

 

[CleeToonFan 1]

 

 

Why doesn't the fee increase affect you? Am I right in thinking because your the right side of the cut off point so your attitude to your juniors is basically screw you? If so that is an incredibly cuntish attitude to have, it honestly is.

I never said it doesn't. You're right in that it doesn't and I wish it did because that way the government would pay two years for me . No I genuinely believe that the increases were necessary, regardless of effect on me

[Renton 17924]

I never said it doesn't. You're right in that it doesn't and I wish it did because that way the government would pay two years for me . No I genuinely believe that the increases were necessary, regardless of effect on me

 

Sorry, I don't follow. You managed to contradict yourself in your last post. Well well done, because now you've managed to contradict yourself in the first ten words of this one.

[CleeToonFan 1]

 

 

Foreign students aren't keeping locals out ffs. The standards for getting into University are so low nowadays compared to previous decades that if you can't make the grade you really shouldn't be there. You're also contradicting yourself in the same post. You complain 'locals' aren't getting in because of foreign competition, but then go on to say there are too many people doing degrees anyway. You then go on to imply that higher fees will be a useful deterrent for people who 'don't know what to do', but admit you're doing your own degree in history because 'you enjoy it' rather than any future career plans you might have.

 

Were you pissed when you posted this?

I've always wanted to do a degree, and I'm happy I did, I didn't think 'cant be arsed may as well do a degree', fair enough I won't get a good job but I've never really cared as academics has always been the way to get into anything history based. There are too many places... But a mate of mine goes to a red brick and says its mostly foreign in his lectures, because the standards for the good unis are less for foreign than locals ( he does english and some foreign students in therissue electronic translators at times... In English lit). At the superb 'Grimsby University Centre' they get a lot of Chinese people too, but thats the sort of place where anyone can turn up, so the effect is lessened (120 Ucas points for some courses...) so it's a mixture of locals priced out and too many.

[CleeToonFan 1]

 

 

Sorry, I don't follow. You managed to contradict yourself in your last post. Well well done, because now you've managed to contradict yourself in the first ten words of this one.

I never said it didn't but it's coincidental that it did....

[Park Life 70]

Anyway, the economic situation we find ourselves in now was exactly predicted two years ago by myself, Chez, Sponge Bob (where is he?), HF and others. CT, Phil, and Agent Axeman have been proven wrong. The posts are all there in black and white if anyone wants to have a look.

 

It's of no consequence that a few posters on an internet messageboard have been shown to be right or wrong of course. What I do find really frightening though is Osbourne's continued insistence he is right and there is no need for a plan B. He predicted that the economy would have expanded by 5% by this stage; infact it has actually contracted since the election. Think about that, it's disastrous. Our economy is currently contracting faster than Spain's. The bond markets which Osbourne has been so desperate to appease are getting twitchy about our credit rating. We really are on the edge of a vortex, but the oarsman is either blind to it or really doesn't give a shit.

 

Markets as we know are crap at leading an economy out of a crisis. Austerity was never going to work. Sluggish economies have to be guided and intervention was in dire need a year ago. Mind you it's a real uphill struggle when the mantra of your party is basically post-industrial and hinges on artifical wealth creation (not real products).

[Christmas Tree 3997]

AUSTERITY? TRUTH IS THAT CUTS HAVEN'T BEEN TOUGH ENOUGH

 

SUMMER sunshine may have finally arrived but on the economic front, Britain is still gripped by wintry gloom.

Coming on top of the continuing crisis in the eurozone and the relentless squeeze on living standards this week’s

figures on output could have hardly been more grim.

 

In the second quarter of 2012 the economy shrank by 0.7 per cent, a far bigger contraction than any experts predicted.

 

With almost every sector in serious trouble we are now in the middle of the longest double-dip recession since the

Second World War.

 

It has become obvious that the coalition’s policies are not working. Feeble excuses about the impact of the poor weather and the Diamond Jubilee convince no one.

 

 

The credibility of Chancellor George Osborne is rapidly evaporating.

 

Since he took power in May 2010 the economy has shrunk by 0.3 per cent, a graphic indicator of the extent of his failure.

 

Even key figures in his own party are muttering about his poor performance and privately urging David Cameron to move him in a Cabinet reshuffle.

 

As the Government sinks deeper into the mire of economic crisis, Labour’s politicians can barely contain their

glee.

 

 

“If these figures don’t make the Chancellor wake up and change course I don’t know what will,” declares Ed Balls,

with his usual wild-eyed, tribalist fervour.

 

THE idea that Labour is the party to pull Britain out of this mess is laughable for it was the last Labour government that was largely responsible for wrecking our economy through its addiction to reckless public spending, a bloated welfare system, mass immigration and enfeebled City regulation.

 

Labour has no answer to our economic difficulties. Bleating about the Tories “cutting too far, too fast”, they have

demanded higher expenditure financed by yet more borrowing.

 

But this would be a recipe for economic meltdown.

 

Excessive borrowing and spending are part of Britain’s problem, not the solution. Last week it was announced that

the Government was forced to borrow £14.4billion in June, a colossal sum.

 

The interest payments alone on our massive debts come to £51billion a year, five times what the state spends

on the police.

 

Every single pound raised in this country by corporation tax is swallowed up by the equivalent of the Government’s interest bill.

 

The entire thrust of Labour’s attack on the coalition’s economic policy is utterly deceitful.

 

So-called “austerity” is not to blame for Britain’s economic woes because in reality there have been few significant cuts, apart from in the armed forces.

 

Contrary to fashionable Leftwing propaganda about the vicious Tory programme, public spending is actually on the rise.

 

During the lifetime of the present coalition state expenditure is due to increase from £696billion to £744billion.

 

For all the synthetic hysteria about the cuts the state continues to consume more than half of all our economic output.

 

Britain is in economic decline because our debts are too large, our spending too high, our taxes too heavy. As the experience of all socialist regimes demonstrates big government invariably causes economic paralysis by destroying

enterprise and imposing huge burdens on those in work.

 

That is what happened under Labour and the weak coalition is following the same line. The tragedy of Osborne and

Cameron is that while talking big about austerity they dismally failed to embrace such a tough approach.

 

We have ended up with the worst of all worlds: the Government is ferociously condemned by its opponents for cuts that do not really exist while the spiral of debt and decline accelerates.

 

The coalition should have been far more robust from the start. Given the mood of the country in May 2010 ministers

could have come forward with a national emergency programme involving genuine cuts across the board but especially in welfare, foreign aid, bureaucracy and contributions to the basket case of the EU.

 

As spending fell significantly taxes could have been reduced for businesses and households, putting money back into the economy.

 

Abolishing the foreign development programme, for instance, would have provided £11billion for tax cuts.

 

It is outrageous that someone earning just £20,000-a-year has to pay a third of their income in tax, as well as forking

out VAT and other duties on almost everything they consume.

 

WITH real political will such a programme could have been implemented. That was proved in Canada in the mid-Nineties, when the centrist Liberal government faced the challenge of a deep recession and mammoth debts caused by soaring state expenditure.

 

Instead of going down the usual road of tax rises and more borrowing the finance minister Paul Martin went in the opposite direction.

 

Federal spending was slashed by 10 per cent and corporate taxes were halved.

 

The result was a new era of Canadian prosperity, characterised by falling unemployment, balanced budgets and

solid growth.

 

Amazingly tax revenues actually increased as the economy flourished.

 

Two decades later Canada remains out of recession.

 

We could enjoy the same here if we had a government with real political determination.

 

But ministers lack the guts to take on the big public sector vested interests, the unions and Labour’s vast clientele of subsidised bureaucrats and welfare claimants.

 

This week’s figures show the public is paying the price for this cowardice.

 

[The Fish 9085]

Make your mind up Dave. A few posts ago you are saying partisans politics is good. Now you are saying me celebrating the party I voted for winning is bad!

 

This is what happens when you personalise.

 

Much better sticking to debating the meat and bones.

are you genuinely that dense?

 

You're blind to the huge, massive, vast difference between having political beliefs and rubbing them in the face of those suffering because of them?

 

I'd have exactly the same issue if the roles were reversed and in a thread where people were worried that Labour's return to power was going to cost their small business to the point they lost it to creditors, someone was celebrating their return I'd call them on it too.

 

The reason I'm being personal is because you acted like a cock to people who were worried about real life problems and you blindly support your man "Dave" regardless of dissenting expert opinion. Again, you're the Liverpool fan of party politics. offended by everything, ashamed of nothing.