Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Asia first, Europe won't be up for a wee while yet. Australia just got drawn with China and Iraq. Wonder if they still reckon it's easier to qualify this way than via Oceania? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol 0 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 North Korea v South Korea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Author Share Posted November 25, 2007 England get Ukraine, Kazakhstan, Belarus and Andorra (and a top seed still to come). Tricky journeys... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol 0 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 England in group 6. Belarus, Andorra, Ukraine, Kazakhstan so far.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol 0 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Group 4 Russia, Finland, WALES, Azerbaijan, Liechtenstein, Germany. ENGLAND v CROATIA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Author Share Posted November 25, 2007 Croatia again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shearergol 0 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Croatia again. Can't see us qualifying from that group looking at the group of players we're likely to have in the team by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Author Share Posted November 25, 2007 Group 1 Portugal, Sweden, Denmark, Hungary, Albania, Malta Group 2 Greece, Israel, Switzerland, Moldova, Latvia, Luxembourg Group 3 Czech Republic, Poland, NORTHERN IRELAND, Slovakia, Slovenia, San Marino Group 4 Germany, Russia, Finland, WALES, Azerbaijan, Liechtenstein Group 5 Spain, Turkey, Belgium, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Armenia, Estonia Group 6 Croatia, ENGLAND, Ukraine, Belarus, Kazakhstan, Andorra Group 7 France, Romania, Serbia, Lithuania, Austria, Faroe Islands Group 8 Italy, Bulgaria, Republic of Ireland, Cyprus, Georgia, Montenegro Group 9 Holland, SCOTLAND, Norway, FYR Macedonia, Iceland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Author Share Posted November 25, 2007 Croatia again. Can't see us qualifying from that group looking at the group of players we're likely to have in the team by then. I'm just loving the thought of the England fans looking for a fight on the mean streets of Minsk and Almaty, to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fop 1 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Croatia again. Can't see us qualifying from that group looking at the group of players we're likely to have in the team by then. I know everything is a bit doom and gloom, but if we can't appoint a coach capable of getting England though that group and/or don't have the players I think maybe England should give up international football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Author Share Posted November 25, 2007 Croatia again. Can't see us qualifying from that group looking at the group of players we're likely to have in the team by then. I know everything is a bit doom and gloom, but if we can't appoint a coach capable of getting England though that group and/or don't have the players I think maybe England should give up international football. That's what we say every year after we bomb at Eurovision, then we end up sending another bit of tacky Europop that gets a grand total of 19 points because we convince ourselves that "it's what Eurovision's all about". The FA and the BBC should join forces to become one big miasma of cluelessness. Might at least cut costs a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zathras 234 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 England have every chance to qualify; even if they have to go through the playoffs (again.) Happy to see the Scots having a decent shot, and the Irish aren't too far long-shots if they get their act together too. Group 5 in Asia should be interesting, even if people are gaga for group 1. Iran, Kuwait and the UAE should be fun. Mexico got hosed in CONCACAF, but the US got a relatively simple draw and Costa Rica has a cakewalk to the final round. In Africa, the group with Nigeria and South Africa should be interesting to watch, just to see how those two shake out. Group two will be good to see if Zimbabwe can upset Guinea and advance. I'm also rooting for Liberia, but they're unlikely to overtake Algeria and are gonna get smoked by Senegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bizza 105 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Can't see us having a problem getting out of that group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 19857 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Can't see us having a problem getting out of that group. that's what i thought about our euro 2008 group. depends on whether we appoint another sub standard english manager i suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggio 0 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Quite an easy group tbf. Is it the top team qualifies and the runners up go into a play off? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Author Share Posted November 25, 2007 Quite an easy group tbf. Is it the top team qualifies and the runners up go into a play off? Kind of... there are 9 groups, so 8 of the 9 second-placed teams go into the play-offs, while the worst is immediately eliminated. Typical FIFA - never a simple solution when you can have a complicated one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zathras 234 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Quite an easy group tbf. Is it the top team qualifies and the runners up go into a play off? Kind of... there are 9 groups, so 8 of the 9 second-placed teams go into the play-offs, while the worst is immediately eliminated. Typical FIFA - never a simple solution when you can have a complicated one. You want complicated, you should look at the CONCACAF system. That said, I think it would benefit Europe to adopt portions of that system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Author Share Posted November 25, 2007 Quite an easy group tbf. Is it the top team qualifies and the runners up go into a play off? Kind of... there are 9 groups, so 8 of the 9 second-placed teams go into the play-offs, while the worst is immediately eliminated. Typical FIFA - never a simple solution when you can have a complicated one. You want complicated, you should look at the CONCACAF system. That said, I think it would benefit Europe to adopt portions of that system. I dunno, I know you've got the "get rid of the dross" aspect there, but the European system is precisely what the European countries have grown up being used to. What other benefits do you see in what CONCACAF have to deal with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishMag 0 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Not overly hopeful after our draw. We got close to the best possible draw from the 2nd seeds (Bulgaria) but getting Cyprus and Montenegro as the bottom seeds may have ended hopes before they started. Especially if 8/11 favourite Terry Venables gets the Ireland job! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Author Share Posted November 25, 2007 Aye, I realise Montenegro had to be seeded in the bottom pot due to their lack of a competitive record, but they did beat Hungary in a friendly so they might be a bit tricky. Still, cheap beer, friendly locals and a spectacular coastline will make it a better away day than England's trips to Belarus and Kazakhstan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishMag 0 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 Aye, Bulgaria and Montenegro would be quite the double header Another trip to Cyprus too, happy days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zathras 234 Posted November 25, 2007 Share Posted November 25, 2007 (edited) Quite an easy group tbf. Is it the top team qualifies and the runners up go into a play off? Kind of... there are 9 groups, so 8 of the 9 second-placed teams go into the play-offs, while the worst is immediately eliminated. Typical FIFA - never a simple solution when you can have a complicated one. You want complicated, you should look at the CONCACAF system. That said, I think it would benefit Europe to adopt portions of that system. I dunno, I know you've got the "get rid of the dross" aspect there, but the European system is precisely what the European countries have grown up being used to. What other benefits do you see in what CONCACAF have to deal with? To me it seems really prohibitive on teams like Lichtenstein and San Marino to have to play five away games, when you could have a home and away series against each other so the loser plays only one away match and the winners go on to the group. It reduces the size of the groups, so presumably the winners end up playing the same number of games (approximately.) I remember from 2002 qualifying (?) the Lichtenstein team captain missed a crucial qualifier because he had to harvest his crops; his priorities were on his livelihood, not his country's football team (and rightly so.) By reducing the burden on those teams and players, I think it benefits those F.A.s because they don't have to spend as much on travel etc, and can then reinvest that money in development, perhaps improving their overall teams in the long-run. If you have seeded knock-outs between the bottom two seeded pots, you have 17 teams, reduced to 9. Instead of 53 teams in 8 groups, you have 45 teams. Then you can do 11 groups of 4 (one of five) and then a further group stage for the top several 2nd place teams (or other method to get the final two qualifiers) If you have a group of four teams, you can have those matches take place pretty quickly and then leave the remaining 8 top 2nd place teams in the group play two more four-team group phases to get the last two qualifiers. Even those teams stuck in the second group phase end up playing only two more games in this system than they would in the current system, and that's not including the playoffs. I think having more groups creates a higher probability of the 'better' teams qualifying. Alternatively, nine groups of five makes for four spots remaining for the nine second-place teams, so you can keep your play-offs or have further group games. If you want to keep the 8 groups, you've maintained the same basic system with fewer matches to tax the smaller countries. Maybe I'm overestimating the strains on the smaller countries, but it just strikes me as a system that gets the best teams into the World Cup without compromising the fair chance of the smaller nations. You don't actually need to have preliminary rounds to make the groups smaller, but I think that the benefits listed at the top to the smaller nations is worthwhile in itself. Edited November 25, 2007 by Zathras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 14095 Posted November 25, 2007 Author Share Posted November 25, 2007 (edited) My only counter-argument (though I think it's a strong one) is that, in smaller countries in particular, you need to dangle the carrot of "you might get to play against England or France or Italy" in order to make people leave their crops/cows/lucrative banking jobs and agree to kick a football around the pitch a bit in the first place when failure is almost guaranteed. In other words, there has to be a reason to aspire or you'll never get any kind of aspiration. OK, a Liechtenstein is never going to be a world power on the footballing stage, but there's always an element of slippage in this game (viz. the previously decent Estonians now being ranked in the bottom pool), and even making it into the second-last group of countries is seen as something of a badge of honour for the smaller nations in Europe. Maybe it's a fundamental difference between the European (or even British) and American mindsets, but the latter seems to have a lot less time for the romance of the potential giant-killer. EDIT: And, addressing your initial points, a lot of the 'smaller' countries are pretty rich anyway. The last thing a tax haven like Andorra or Liechtenstein has to worry about is a few quid spent on flights and accommodation. Edited November 25, 2007 by Meenzer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckyluke 1 Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 I predic tedious Borat related headlines from the Sun when we play Khazakstan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trophyshy 6434 Posted November 26, 2007 Share Posted November 26, 2007 I predic tedious Borat related headlines from the Sun when we play Khazakstan. Your wasting your talent there, you want to be helping find Madeleine with insight lke that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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