David Kelly 1117 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 To be fair, that's a low bar you've set. Very true. Given was a superb keeper but dealing with crosses was anything but a strength. I think people are being a bit harsh on Darlow at the minute. He's certainly dropped two clangers against QPR and Norwich (and arguably against Bristol) but he's played well all season and everyone seemed very confident in him until the last couple of weeks. The Norwich one in particular was just one of those things that could happen to anyone at any time, and I'd argue that none of the mistakes that he's made have been down to lack of ability on his part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haydnator 45 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Reading really weren't very good on Saturday vs them. Neither were Burton, their home game before them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howay 12452 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I think people are being a bit harsh on Darlow at the minute. He's certainly dropped two clangers against QPR and Norwich (and arguably against Bristol) but he's played well all season and everyone seemed very confident in him until the last couple of weeks. The Norwich one in particular was just one of those things that could happen to anyone at any time, and I'd argue that none of the mistakes that he's made have been down to lack of ability on his part. I agree. The Norwich one was a terrible reading of the flight of the ball, if it happened to a striker there'd be audible frustration from the crowd but it wouldn't go much further as there's no real cost to it, unfortunately for keepers a slip up generally means a conceded goal. Bad error but not indicative of him on the balance of his performances. The error in the Bristol game was coming out too far, it was a misjudgment on his part but the thing that's shite for him is it would never have been a problem if Dummett hadn't made the ridiculous decision to over-extend himself to try and get a head on the ball. I think he deserves some of the blame as if he'd been placed better it wouldn't have been an issue but that would be him fixing Dummetts bad decision, so I still think Dummett deserves the bigger share for that. People latch on to goalie errors, I saw on some Facebook blog a bloke saying Sels deserves a go over Darlow again. Apparently we were overly harsh on Sels (meaning the general fan base not the idiots abusing him on Twitter here btw) errors and are forgiving of Darlow's, I think that is utter bollocks, Sels hasn't shown anything to me that he's up to the standard of playing in this league whereas Darlow has put in a number of really good performances. A lot of Sels errors weren't simple lapses in judgement, they were things he's going to do time and time again because he was trained to punch everything, the issue being he frequently punched the ball right into the path of oncoming attackers. Darlow's errors have been misjudgments and he hadn't really shown them prior to this little shake in confidence. As you said earlier I'd be far more likely to change the defence up a bit before I thought about dropping Darlow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haydnator 45 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 You're forgetting the clanger vs Rotherham where any decent team would've scored from. But I think he's won as many points for us as much as he has lost. Think some are being harsh but some criticism is warranted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1117 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I agree. The Norwich one was a terrible reading of the flight of the ball, if it happened to a striker there'd be audible frustration from the crowd but it wouldn't go much further as there's no real cost to it, unfortunately for keepers a slip up generally means a conceded goal. Bad error but not indicative of him on the balance of his performances. The error in the Bristol game was coming out too far, it was a misjudgment on his part but the thing that's shite for him is it would never have been a problem if Dummett hadn't made the ridiculous decision to over-extend himself to try and get a head on the ball. I think he deserves some of the blame as if he'd been placed better it wouldn't have been an issue but that would be him fixing Dummetts bad decision, so I still think Dummett deserves the bigger share for that. People latch on to goalie errors, I saw on some Facebook blog a bloke saying Sels deserves a go over Darlow again. Apparently we were overly harsh on Sels (meaning the general fan base not the idiots abusing him on Twitter here btw) errors and are forgiving of Darlow's, I think that is utter bollocks, Sels hasn't shown anything to me that he's up to the standard of playing in this league whereas Darlow has put in a number of really good performances. A lot of Sels errors weren't simple lapses in judgement, they were things he's going to do time and time again because he was trained to punch everything, the issue being he frequently punched the ball right into the path of oncoming attackers. Darlow's errors have been misjudgments and he hadn't really shown them prior to this little shake in confidence. As you said earlier I'd be far more likely to change the defence up a bit before I thought about dropping Darlow. Aye no one had any confidence in Sels because everything he did seemed technically wrong. I wouldn't mind him punching but more often than not he flapped. He just kept doing the same things wrong. Even the saves he made all seemed a struggle. Then Darlow came in and was doing pretty much everything right (making good saves, looking composed, coming out for balls into the box and taking pressure off the defence). If he keeps making errors then his position needs to be reconsidered. As it is, he's probably made less errors than anyone else in the team this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerbarton 24 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Did he actually shout for it? Haven't seen the replays. Like Haydnator says, he's been prone to rushing off his line way too often. Rotherham, QPR, Norwich, Bristol City. I do rate him, and have been pleasantly surprised this season, but it seems like a recurring problem. When a keeper is short on confidence, keeping him in the team is actually detrimental to his own development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1117 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 You're forgetting the clanger vs Rotherham where any decent team would've scored from. But I think he's won as many points for us as much as he has lost. Think some are being harsh but some criticism is warranted. I am, what was it? Criticism is part and parcel of any sport but all of a sudden people forget the standards he's set this season before his recent blip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerbarton 24 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I am, what was it? Criticism is part and parcel of any sport but all of a sudden people forget the standards he's set this season before his recent blip. [tweet] [/tweet] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1117 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Did he actually shout for it? Haven't seen the replays. Like Haydnator says, he's been prone to rushing off his line way too often. Rotherham, QPR, Norwich, Bristol City. I do rate him, and have been pleasantly surprised this season, but it seems like a recurring problem. When a keeper is short on confidence, keeping him in the team is actually detrimental to his own development. Aye seeing the replay he certainly shouted for it. I do think he's rushing off his line a bit much at the moment but I think it's got a lot to do with Lascelles being half asleep in front of him and him trying to cover it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howay 12452 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 You're forgetting the clanger vs Rotherham where any decent team would've scored from. But I think he's won as many points for us as much as he has lost. Think some are being harsh but some criticism is warranted. I don't think it's fair to include that one as he pulled off a pretty incredible save after it while in the process of being completely wiped out by Clark. So while it was an error he also saved the situation, not only by putting his hand in the way stopping the player rushing onto the ball from running off with it but then saving the follow up shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haydnator 45 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I am, what was it? Criticism is part and parcel of any sport but all of a sudden people forget the standards he's set this season before his recent blip. Highlights from the game. https://twitter.com/NUFCs/status/822867184938520576 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1117 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 [tweet] [/tweet] I'd forgotten that was Rotherham but had remembered the incident and overlooked it on the back of his amazing recovery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haydnator 45 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I don't think it's fair to include that one as he pulled off a pretty incredible save after it while in the process of being completely wiped out by Clark. So while it was an error he also saved the situation, not only by putting his hand in the way stopping the player rushing onto the ball from running off with it but then saving the follow up shot.It was a fantastic recovery he deserved credit from, but I still feel that a better team, say a Derby, a Brighton or a Huddersfield would've punished us for that and that's what is disconcerting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1117 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Highlights from the game. https://twitter.com/NUFCs/status/822867184938520576 I admit I still have no idea what happened with him letting go of the ball in the first place (at the time I assumed he thought he was going out of the box and let go but the replay doesn't back that up), his handling is usually very good. The save that followed it is one of the most amazing I've ever seen though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howay 12452 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 It was a fantastic recovery he deserved credit from, but I still feel that a better team, say a Derby, a Brighton or a Huddersfield would've punished us for that and that's what is disconcerting. That's a big assumption though and it's fairly harsh to criticize him on such. Like a better goalkeeper may have stopped some of Gayle's less well struck efforts, which would have meant we may not have won certain games but I wouldn't look back and say "aye he scored but it was poorly struck, a better goalkeeper would have saved that and it would have punished us he really should do better". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haydnator 45 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 That's a big assumption though and it's fairly harsh to criticize him on such. Like a better goalkeeper may have stopped some of Gayle's less well struck efforts, which would have meant we may not have won certain games but I wouldn't look back and say "aye he scored but it was poorly struck, a better goalkeeper would have saved that and it would have punished us he really should do better".Fair enough tbh. I don't want to criticize him too much because from the Swansea home game last season onwards he has been outstanding up until QPR where he has dropped a couple of clangers since, and has probably won just as much if not more points than he's cost us this season. But on Saturday I'm not sure what happened, if he shouted for it to be cleared or if it was his ball then it's Dummett who had the nightmare but he didn't have to go off his line in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howay 12452 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Fair enough tbh. I don't want to criticize him too much because from the Swansea home game last season onwards he has been outstanding up until QPR where he has dropped a couple of clangers since, and has probably won just as much if not more points than he's cost us this season. But on Saturday I'm not sure what happened, if he shouted for it to be cleared or if it was his ball then it's Dummett who had the nightmare but he didn't have to go off his line in the first place. Aye I've only seen one replay of the error at the weekend. I think he has been getting really nervous about the backline in recent weeks which has led to him coming off his line very quickly and into areas he should very rarely be in. I'm still going to put a lot of the blame on Dummett shout or not as he shouldn't be reaching like that for the ball, if he'd just let it go it was going to go out of play. I agree with DK that if Darlow carries on making errors his position needs to be reconsidered but I'm seeing a lot of people getting on the lads back for a small amount of mistakes when we have people in the side that have made clangers in nearly every game they play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1117 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Recovering from and making up for mistakes is an important thing for any player (particularly a keeper) so do it without actually conceding a goal is something I would say deserves credit rather than criticism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anorthernsoul 1221 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I admit I still have no idea what happened with him letting go of the ball in the first place (at the time I assumed he thought he was going out of the box and let go but the replay doesn't back that up), his handling is usually very good. The save that followed it is one of the most amazing I've ever seen though. You've clearly got a poster of him above your bed :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haydnator 45 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Aye I've only seen one replay of the error at the weekend. I think he has been getting really nervous about the backline in recent weeks which has led to him coming off his line very quickly and into areas he should very rarely be in. I'm still going to put a lot of the blame on Dummett shout or not as he shouldn't be reaching like that for the ball, if he'd just let it go it was going to go out of play. I agree with DK that if Darlow carries on making errors his position needs to be reconsidered but I'm seeing a lot of people getting on the lads back for a small amount of mistakes when we have people in the side that have made clangers in nearly every game they play. People need to be as positive towards the team as possible, me and everyone else included. SJP is as negative as it is anyway and it needs to improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howay 12452 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 People need to be as positive towards the team as possible, me and everyone else included. SJP is as negative as it is anyway and it needs to improve. Agreed, I was really disappointed to hear booing at the half. I think a more experienced side could shrug it off and get on with the task but we've got a young group and there's clearly some mental fragility among them confidence wise. The old "I've paid my money so can have my say" argument while valid doesn't really help anything, we all want the side up and they're managing that so far but the weaker home form compared to the away form says something about the support at the moment. I think a lot of people attending are expecting us to win every match 3-0 and when they see us struggling quickly get frustrated, like you and others have said this type of short term thinking is prevalent all over in football now. I can moan like a dickhead on here about Colback but if I was at the match I wouldn't be getting on his back as honestly it doesn't help anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Haydnator 45 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 Agreed, I was really disappointed to hear booing at the half. I think a more experienced side could shrug it off and get on with the task but we've got a young group and there's clearly some mental fragility among them confidence wise. The old "I've paid my money so can have my say" argument while valid doesn't really help anything, we all want the side up and they're managing that so far but the weaker home form compared to the away form says something about the support at the moment. I think a lot of people attending are expecting us to win every match 3-0 and when they see us struggling quickly get frustrated, like you and others have said this type of short term thinking is prevalent all over in football now. I can moan like a dickhead on here about Colback but if I was at the match I wouldn't be getting on his back as honestly it doesn't help anything. Absolutely spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Kelly 1117 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 You've clearly got a poster of him above your bed :lol: Not at all but I can't remember another save anything like it. If it had been made by a Liverpool or Man Utd keeper Sky would have been wanking them silly over it for months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adios 717 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I've a poster of him above my bed, but it's not for his goalkeeping prowess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom 13846 Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 ... have I been made redundant and not told? shut up fish 0-2 Shola, Gavilan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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