NJS

The major problem is that when we see the crime alot of us react angrily and want revenge. The law should not be about revenge, it should prioritise prevention and then cure. I think too many Daily Mail readers would be more appalled at the thought of those young offenders benefitting from their crime than they would be concerned about the crime itself. 43673[/snapback] If the result of a crime is that a waste of space has their life sorted out to the point where they aren't a waste anymore, which lets face it kneejerk punishments short of death won't do, then to me the crime is lessened.

This may not sit easily with the "nail'em uppers" but I'm sure that studies of "unconventional" punishments like the classic mechanics courses for joyriders etc actually caused less re-offenders. Maybe the problem is the the Daily Mail solution has been used too much and the PC one not enough.

When Rob was talking about automatic washing machines were completely luxury items. Even in the 80s if you see the repeats of Bullseye you'll see audience "Oohs" at hostess trollies and food processors so I think he has a point. Having said that I can see where you're coming from as well - Thatcher taught people to want material goods above all else as you did mention.

Spurs were being too difficult and Chelsea were cheap and easy thanks to Bates being desperate to sell.

It will be interesting to see how Abramovitch reacts if and when they win the Champions league. Of course they now claim they are run as a "proper" business and can sustain their wages so in that context Mourinho becomes a bigger factor.

I just remember him - mostly my Dad and Brother mourning his loss. The saddest thing is that as far as I know it would be a simple op nowadays.

I know its the media who over simplify things with money spent but I expect fans to be a little more realistic. Its not me who doesn't think Bellamy was worth any more its other clubs. I know there was a factor of interested clubs knowing we were "desperate" but at the same time you'd think even at 4 or 5m there would be people willing to snap our hands off. Craig Bellamy is a good player but leaving aside everything else I think what we should look at is the fact that we did become that reliant him on the first place. Its like the Shearer situation I have referred to in this thread where theres a load of hype about "replacing Alan Shearer" - what we should be doing is moving away from a reliance on one man no matter who that is and more towards a bigger picture. I'd also add that I couldn't help noticing Bellamy's latest injury is his knees(s) - again.

I'm not defending Souness on the Shearer thing Renton, I'm just pointing out that this "event" is out of the ordinary when it comes to considering spending under any manager. I also disagree that the early Bobby days were any better than the last year - I consider them to be the same thing - a turnover period for a new manager. Net is the only thing that counts for me LM - the "wasted" £8m on Boumsong (not you but others say that) was for me just the Woodgate fee. You decry Souness for getting peanuts for Bellamy and Robert (their true worth?) but I notice you don't praise him for getting more than you thought Jenas was worth. I'm not an accountant but despite Sheperd's BS his bottom line will be the net figure which as HTT has pointed out isn't that great when a couple of years are taken into account even including the recent spree. Nearly all managers operate on an in/out basis - the money they get does depend on fees received and in this summers case wages saved so to simplify it as "money given to invest" is simplistic. Forgoto add for Renton on your point on Arsenal etc: Don't forget that we finished above Chelsea who are now "untouchable". Also teams like Bolton, Boro and Spurs are showing signs of being a lot better - I'm not belittling the 4/3/5 finishes but I do think we were well timed in having that team in those 3 years in relation to the other teams - thst what I was trying to get at.

Robson was left a lot of good players but we still endured 20 months of utter shite. (Given, Goma, Lee, Solano, Dyer, Shearer, Speed, Ferguson (when fit))

I find the "he's spent £50m" as fatuous as Shepherd's "£200m spent since we took over". Bobby spent a lot of money of that squad - he didn't fashion it out of thin air or the academy. He also didn't have to spend big to "replace" Shearer (counting Owen) which has happened to be during Souness' tenure. I also think the top 3/4/5 clubs are further ahead than they were 3 or 4 years ago. The squad still needs adding to - whether thats by Souness or A. N Other - its still only Bellamy whose exit I regret and I do believe we have a better team than 2 or 3 years ago but then again that team wasn't good enough anyway. As to the danger you mention first of all I think Shepherd isn't that stupid. At the worst he won't endanger his "pension fund" as someone put it by overspending. I would also say that the unjudged Luque aside there has been no "waste" as is implied in your post ("cleaning out").

I thought it was funny to see the people who defended her claiming a right to "privacy" when they live vicariously through celebs and would die without the oxygen of invasions of said privacy. IMO the differnce between them is that Moss is "talented" in her field and has then messed it up. Doherty's only talent and claim to fame is his addictions in my view.

So it's okay for Kate Moss to take drugs but not Doherty? Nice to see while people are ripping into the media and fashion people for having double standards you're keeping up the trend. 41430[/snapback] Anybody who burgals his best mates flat is a shit in my book - nowt to do with drugs.

I think .com summed him up in saying he was a true fan - just like Stan Seymour, but he was also completely out of his depth and his time which led to people disliking him (me included at the time). I don't think his death warrants a celebration by any stretch.

I usually say I'm willing to "support" an English team in Europe as long as it isn't one I particularly hate. That means in living memory Norwich and Ipswich. I do however subscribe to the "keep shit teams like Bolton and Boro in there to fuck up their season" theory.

As has been mentioned the hypocrisy of the journos who exposed her takes some beating. I keep wondering if the Mail can be charged with inciting hatred on a daily basis. If H&M cancelled all contracts with all designers and models on coke they'd have nothing to sell. Also loved the Chief Inspector going to interview her. How much an hour? Did you take Coke - No - thanks and goodbye. Did you take Coke - Yes - Have you got any on you now - No - thanks and goodbye. Doherty is still human faeces like.

Get used to the "under the terrorism act" - the police have been waiting for this kind of general atmosphere for years to increase their powers.

Style over content fails again - love it. (Zen and Archos Gmini owner)

They have this "We gurantee to beat your renewal" promise - I got an online quote which was £150 more than mine but I was then supposed to phone them - I didn't bother as it would probably be by £1 or something like that and anyway why try and charge me £150 more than what they can?

Use Confused.com - it does loads at once - I'm with Elephant (who are owned by Admiral) and those two were the cheapest for me by £100

As long as Bobby gets all the blame for Dyer and Bellamy's previous Hamstrings then by all means blame Souness.

I hope Sunderland, Blackburn, Portsmouth I think Sunderland, Wigan, Fulham

Sound of the suburbs.

Real first name: Neil Nickname: None Age: 41 Occupation: Software Developer Location: Chelmsford (S. Shields originally) Language(s) spoken? Sanddancer, schoolboy french and spanish Avatat - why? Fantastic Band Previous avatars? Used to have Julie Benz (Darla in Angel and Buffy) Tell us when you first joined the boards? xmas last but one Board highlights? general sharing of pleasure when we win Board lowlights? Too much anti-Souness for me. What would you be doing if you weren't doing your current job? - God knows Pets? - Don't see the point though I've sort of adopted next door's cat in that it greets me. I play a bit like.... Paul Goddard Football heroes? Beardsley, Varadi, Cole, Anderson, Wharton, Sir Les Football villains? Steve Foster, Kenny Burns, Carlton Palmer Best advice given? Family and friends above all else Ideal partner? Abbey off ER Ideal dinner date? Germaine Greer would be interesting Ideal meal? Mam's rabbit pie Can you cook? Not really - microwave man Current wheels? VW VR6 Biggest influence? Dad TV programmes? Babylon 5, Angel, Buffy, Simpsons Burger and chips or fish and chips? Fish Chinese or indian? What do you order? Indian - Jalfrezi/ chinese - duck (prefer the former) Favourite tunes? Mayonaise by Pumpkins, Fields of Fire by Big Country Abi Titmuss or Jodi Marsh? - Don't know what they look like George Clooney or Bradley Pitt? - acting wise Clooney. Favourite film? Dogma or Blade Runner If I won a million pounds.... I'd visit every country on the planet Age first drunk alcohol? First drink? 15/16 - McKewans Best Scotch. Ever suspended/expelled from school? No - swot Favourite insult? the C word with relish (also favourite compliment) Not a lot of people know that......I hate christmas Most you've ever spent on an item of clothes? Armani winter coat in Rome - £350 How many pairs of shoes do you own? 5 or 6 including trainers I'm obsessed with.....Arguing In 5 years time, I hope to be....back in contracting making loads

I agree. I also thought the one out wide where Savage asked for the second yellow was a dive. But when he played for us a big plus was that he is an annoying little twat so it would be too much to condemn him now.

Bad crack - maybe there should be come kind of medical clearance certificate? - then again pretty fit people still have heart attacks.