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Jimbo

15 years ago today

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Today 1707 England and Scotland joined

 

6 years ago today Dubya Bush declared mission accomplished.

 

 

 

Also Hitler killed himself yesterday 64 years ago

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Today 1707 England and Scotland joined

 

6 years ago today Dubya Bush declared mission accomplished.

 

 

 

Also Hitler killed himself yesterday 64 years ago

 

all a mere footnote in history in comparison to the passing of a god.

 

;)

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Beat me to it Jimbo, just posted it in the F1 thread.

 

Can't believe it's 15 years - remember it like it was yesterday. ;)

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Well done Jimbo.

 

I was going to mention it today. Senna is my absolute idol, I still get choked up just thinking about that day, I remember it so well. Even now I still cant believe he's gone, its incredible how someone you don't know makes such an impression on you.

I read yesterday somewhere that a film is in the offing, with Senna's family's consent. Not sure how I feel about that one really ;)

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Well done Jimbo.

 

I was going to mention it today. Senna is my absolute idol, I still get choked up just thinking about that day, I remember it so well. Even now I still cant believe he's gone, its incredible how someone you don't know makes such an impression on you.

I read yesterday somewhere that a film is in the offing, with Senna's family's consent. Not sure how I feel about that one really ;)

 

That film was first talked about years ago - think they were on about Antonio Banderas playing Senna...

 

BBC did a tribute programme on him back in 1995 and they've linked it onto their website HERE

 

Well worth a look :)

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Guest alex

Used to love Senna. I used to be wanting it to rain at every Grand Prix because he could wipe the floor with everyone in the wet.

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Well done Jimbo.

 

I was going to mention it today. Senna is my absolute idol, I still get choked up just thinking about that day, I remember it so well. Even now I still cant believe he's gone, its incredible how someone you don't know makes such an impression on you.

I read yesterday somewhere that a film is in the offing, with Senna's family's consent. Not sure how I feel about that one really ;)

 

That film was first talked about years ago - think they were on about Antonio Banderas playing Senna...

 

BBC did a tribute programme on him back in 1995 and they've linked it onto their website HERE

 

Well worth a look :)

 

Thanks Craig, I'll take a look.

This is what i read yesterday...

 

http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/04/29...ts-green-light/

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Guest alex

Probably like a lot of people on here I remember seeing it live and just thinking he'd walk away from it. I know Roland Ratzenburger had been killed in practice the same weekend (iirc) but you saw lots of crashes that looked a lot worse.

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Well done Jimbo.

 

I was going to mention it today. Senna is my absolute idol, I still get choked up just thinking about that day, I remember it so well. Even now I still cant believe he's gone, its incredible how someone you don't know makes such an impression on you.

I read yesterday somewhere that a film is in the offing, with Senna's family's consent. Not sure how I feel about that one really ;)

 

That film was first talked about years ago - think they were on about Antonio Banderas playing Senna...

 

BBC did a tribute programme on him back in 1995 and they've linked it onto their website HERE

 

Well worth a look :)

 

Thanks Craig, I'll take a look.

This is what i read yesterday...

 

http://wheels.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/04/29...ts-green-light/

 

Keep tabs on it here....

 

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1424432/

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Probably like a lot of people on here I remember seeing it live and just thinking he'd walk away from it. I know Roland Ratzenburger had been killed in practice the same weekend (iirc) but you saw lots of crashes that looked a lot worse.

 

Aye, pretty much how I saw it. It's weird though, I had a sense of foreboding (probably because of the death of Ratzenberger the day before). We were due to go out somewhere, forget where now but I said I had to watch the GP for some reason.

 

The accident itself was a glancing blow and had it not been for the freakish way the wheel was pushed between the wall and his head, he would have walked away from it.

 

Saying all that, I thought he was dead from the minute the marshalls looked at and backed off. In other incidents at that time (and since really), they're almost in the face of the driver. One bloke crouched down, looked at him, backed off and told the flag marshall to wave a red instead of a yellow.

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I was only six or seven at the time and i'd just got into F1 but even I remember this and the magnitude of it. Senna was a name you instantly knew, even if you watched GP's or not. Very sad day ;)

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Seems like longer than 15 years ago to me in all honesty, the Schumacher dynasty seemed to go on forever for one. How many fatalities have there been since Senna, any at all? It's amazing what people survive from nowadays.

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Seems like longer than 15 years ago to me in all honesty, the Schumacher dynasty seemed to go on forever for one. How many fatalities have there been since Senna, any at all? It's amazing what people survive from nowadays.

 

None at all in F1 but his legacy has been the improved safety since his death. HANS, high cockpit sides & wheel tethers have all been introduced since 1994.

 

That said, at the time of his death the sport had gone 8 years since a fatality and 12 years since one at a race meeting.

 

No doubt it will happen again at some point in the future, but none will ever have as high an impact as Ayrton's. Most people compare the loss of Jim Clark but, although one of the most talented drivers of all time, Clark was killed in an F2 race which had very media coverage.

 

I remember reading that, until the second plane hit the WTC, Senna's death was the most 'publically witnessed' of all time.

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Today 1707 England and Scotland joined

 

6 years ago today Dubya Bush declared mission accomplished.

 

 

 

Also Hitler killed himself yesterday 64 years ago

 

all a mere footnote in history in comparison to the passing of a god.

 

;)

 

That overtaking on the outside in the rain. Will never forget that.

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First lap of the European GP at Donington, phenomenal.

 

People harp on about that one and I too think it's the best opening lap of a GP I've ever seen. 1993 was the height of the electronics era (last year before 'true traction control & active suspension were outlawed) and the Williams was in a class of its own. Ferrari were going through the shittiest of all shit periods, Benetton were a noddy team who, in Schumacher, had a brilliant (if raw) driver who could get more out of the car that it really merited and then there was McLaren...

 

They'd lost the Honda v12 at the end of 1992, Ron fucked up getting it replaced (was trying to negotiate a deal for a Renault supply IIRC) and they were left with the Ford HB block which was inferior to the Zetec that the Benetton team was running. On top of that, Senna left it to the very last minute to commit himself to 1993 - the team provisionally named Andretti & Hakkinen as its drivers.

 

First time out in South Africa - Williams wiped the floor with them. Then in Brazil, it rained - Prost predictably couldn't keep it on the road and Senna won. Then came Donnington and it was even wetter than Sao Paulo. If it was wet, the power disadvantage seemingly disappeared and they were more comparable on driver ability.

 

Schumacher got the jump on him from the start but Senna was back past him before the exit of the first corner on account of his experience IMO. Then I think he needed to get past Wendlinger and Hill who were both relatively inexperienced. Once past them it was Prost to pass for the lead and if any man can look shit in the rain it was him. I remember thinking when Hill was over-taken that Senna would have the lead before the start line.

 

Was it impressive? Undoubtedly so. How could it have been bettered? Only possible if they cars he'd passed had been driven by very experienced drivers who excelled in the wet (Alonso, Hamilton, etc).

 

Well worth a watch :icon_lol:

 

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Senna v Prost v Mansell v Pique. Those were the days. Remember seeing Senna's death and being a bit 'stunned' for a few days. I can't remember who was held accountable following the inquest into his death. I watched a documentary a while ago that I think 'intimated' that his death was caused by a faulty steering rod (dodgy weld job). He was the master.

Anyone remember Martin Donnelly's crash in Spain I think? I think he was driving for Lotus. There he is, middle of the track with his caar seat strapped to his body, nothing else. Car had disintegrated around him. I think he recovered.....can't recall.

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Senna v Prost v Mansell v Pique. Those were the days. Remember seeing Senna's death and being a bit 'stunned' for a few days. I can't remember who was held accountable following the inquest into his death. I watched a documentary a while ago that I think 'intimated' that his death was caused by a faulty steering rod (dodgy weld job). He was the master.

Anyone remember Martin Donnelly's crash in Spain I think? I think he was driving for Lotus. There he is, middle of the track with his caar seat strapped to his body, nothing else. Car had disintegrated around him. I think he recovered.....can't recall.

 

Aye Martin Donnelly's was horrific and yes, he did fully recover although never drove an F1 car again in anger (did do a test for Jordan as a one-off though IIRC).

 

Saved by his fuel tank and his seat/harness. The fuel tank expanded in the crashand propelled him out of the wreckage but still strapped tightly to his seat.

 

1647.jpg

 

jerez1990martindonnelly.jpg

 

Everyone's got their own opinions of what happened to Senna. My own is that the combination of low tyre pressures, a very twitchy car and nasty bumps on the circuit caused the accident. The tyre pressures were low due to having run 6 laps behind the safety car (a Vauxhall Cavalier in those days!) but then this was try of everyone.

 

The twitchy car was something that had been reported by both Ayrton and Damon since it's launch (rumoured to be related to the electonic aids being removed) and Senna had a habit of running setups that had the back end of the car quite low to the ground.

 

People ask why the bumpy circuit didn't affect other drivers. We for that you have to pay attention to the on-board footage from both Senna's and Schumacher's cars on that lap. Schumacher (and everyone else for that matter) took a completely different line around Tamburello than Senna thus avoiding the massive bumps. What's really freaky is that in pre-season testing at Imola (early March I think), Senna walked to Tamburello with Pierluigi Martini and the clerk of the course to discuss the bumps resulting in the track being re-surfaced. Tragically no-one thought it'd be a good idea to put a line of tyres against the concrete retaining wall on the outside of the curve.

 

For those who claim that the steering snapped prior to the accident or that Senna blacked out, they're talking complete rubbish. Williams had the telemetry which proved that Senna was applying steering torque right up until the collision - something that wouldn't have been possible had the column snapped or if he'd been unconcious.

 

The only plausible mechanical fault with Senna's car was power steering. It was a new feature on the Williams in 1994 and they'd had teething issues where it had failed. Anyone who drives a car with power steering will tell you that when the ignition is off, the steering while is nigh on impossible to move as the pump is not operational and you're moving power-steering fluid through the eye of the needle with your bare hands. If this had failure right in the apex of Tamburello, it could easily have caused the accident. There are some who worked within Williams who stated that Patrick Head screamed "power steering!" when Senna hit the wall. Patrick would have had access to the telemetry to confirm if this had been the case but this was on the second 'black box' in the Williams and the data on that was corrupt.

 

As I've said before, he'd have got out of the car and walked away if the wheel had gone in any other direction on impact. Tragic :icon_lol:

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In a few hours it'll be 17 years. Still feels like 5 mins ago and doesn't get easier with time.

 

RIP Ayrton & Roland.

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