NJS 4010 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 It sounds stupid but we actually are. Do you think Shepherd would of been able to pay off our debts? He didn't have to - the mortgage on the stand was being paid for by STs and only had to be paid up on a sale. Of course that begs the question as to where the ST money goes now with no mortgage but that's by the by.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loonyTOON 10 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 We didnt get relegated JUST because of MA. We got relegated because we had money grabbing pricks on the pay roll. The reaction against Villa last season from some players said it all. Theres such a better harmony amongst the players at the moment. As for Ashley, want him out obviously but I do give him credit for some of the things he's done. He has made us one of the most financially stable clubs in English football. No debt..... doesnt he deserve credit for that? Can I change your name to Comical Dekka? It sounds stupid but we actually are. Do you think Shepherd would of been able to pay off our debts? Ashley had to pay off a large part of the debt (57m - from the stadium rebuild) because the financial agreement Shepard had in place was non-transferable. So under Shepard the debt was not an imediate issue. The debt was not an immediate issue? I'd much rather we are how we are now, than keeping debt that should be paid off. Hopefully someone comes and buys the club in the summer and we can start afresh so to speak. No debt = more money to spend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Kenneth Noisewater 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 We didnt get relegated JUST because of MA. We got relegated because we had money grabbing pricks on the pay roll. The reaction against Villa last season from some players said it all. Theres such a better harmony amongst the players at the moment. As for Ashley, want him out obviously but I do give him credit for some of the things he's done. He has made us one of the most financially stable clubs in English football. No debt..... doesnt he deserve credit for that? Can I change your name to Comical Dekka? It sounds stupid but we actually are. Do you think Shepherd would of been able to pay off our debts? Ashley had to pay off a large part of the debt (57m - from the stadium rebuild) because the financial agreement Shepard had in place was non-transferable. So under Shepard the debt was not an imediate issue. The debt was not an immediate issue? I'd much rather we are how we are now, than keeping debt that should be paid off. Hopefully someone comes and buys the club in the summer and we can start afresh so to speak. No debt = more money to spend Do you not think ashley might want all these loans back when he sells? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26811 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 We didnt get relegated JUST because of MA. We got relegated because we had money grabbing pricks on the pay roll. The reaction against Villa last season from some players said it all. Theres such a better harmony amongst the players at the moment. As for Ashley, want him out obviously but I do give him credit for some of the things he's done. He has made us one of the most financially stable clubs in English football. No debt..... doesnt he deserve credit for that? Can I change your name to Comical Dekka? It sounds stupid but we actually are. Do you think Shepherd would of been able to pay off our debts? Ashley had to pay off a large part of the debt (57m - from the stadium rebuild) because the financial agreement Shepard had in place was non-transferable. So under Shepard the debt was not an imediate issue. The debt was not an immediate issue? I'd much rather we are how we are now, than keeping debt that should be paid off. Hopefully someone comes and buys the club in the summer and we can start afresh so to speak. No debt = more money to spend So losing £500k pw makes us one of the most financially stable clubs in English football? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 How does the owner paying off c. £110m worth of debt (some of it he didn't have to) mean there is more money knocking around for signings btw? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJS 4010 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 How does the owner paying off c. £110m worth of debt (some of it he didn't have to) mean there is more money knocking around for signings btw? I presume he means if anyone had 200m to invest then if the price is 100m with no strings attached, that would leave 100m for players. I'm not sure its that simple though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 How does the owner paying off c. £110m worth of debt (some of it he didn't have to) mean there is more money knocking around for signings btw? I presume he means if anyone had 200m to invest then if the price is 100m with no strings attached, that would leave 100m for players. I'm not sure its that simple though. I don't he think he did mean that tbh. Anymore than than I think the price is £100m all in. Perhaps Loony Tunes could clarify his position and answer my question though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4005 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 can we lock this thread before leazesmag sees it and it descends into another 30+ page marathon on fat fred v fat mike... ? :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4005 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 We didnt get relegated JUST because of MA. We got relegated because we had money grabbing pricks on the pay roll. The reaction against Villa last season from some players said it all. Theres such a better harmony amongst the players at the moment. As for Ashley, want him out obviously but I do give him credit for some of the things he's done. He has made us one of the most financially stable clubs in English football. No debt..... doesnt he deserve credit for that? He certainly does and yes the players got us relegated. Even upping one of their piss poor performances would have kept us up. However in the fullness of time we may be viewed as lucky to have gone down. (as long as we get back up) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4005 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 We didnt get relegated JUST because of MA. We got relegated because we had money grabbing pricks on the pay roll. The reaction against Villa last season from some players said it all. Theres such a better harmony amongst the players at the moment. As for Ashley, want him out obviously but I do give him credit for some of the things he's done. He has made us one of the most financially stable clubs in English football. No debt..... doesnt he deserve credit for that? Can I change your name to Comical Dekka? It sounds stupid but we actually are. Do you think Shepherd would of been able to pay off our debts? Ashley had to pay off a large part of the debt (57m - from the stadium rebuild) because the financial agreement Shepard had in place was non-transferable. So under Shepard the debt was not an imediate issue. The debt was not an immediate issue? I'd much rather we are how we are now, than keeping debt that should be paid off. Hopefully someone comes and buys the club in the summer and we can start afresh so to speak. No debt = more money to spend I hope Ashley stays. As we come out of recession his empire will probably rocket again leaving him with wads of lolly to splash around. Hopefully he will stay the course and turn us into a top half prem team. I have a feeling he will want to prove a point to a lot of people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest alex Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 I can see how all your businesses have gone bust (assuming that wasn't another cock and bull story). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 4005 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 I can see how all your businesses have gone bust (assuming that wasn't another cock and bull story). ??? I did work for Durham Pine for 3 months on a consultancy basis and eventually they did go bust, however I really dont think my 3 months sunk them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JawD 31 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 can we lock this thread before leazesmag sees it and it descends into another 30+ page marathon on fat fred v fat mike... ? :) Clear we need a skinny Owner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUFC_Mag 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Unfortunately Ashley is indeed expecting his money back. Although he has injected a £100 million 'gift loan' into the club, the clubs debts are only effectively cleared because he is lending his own money to a company he owns. However, if a change of ownership takes place, this debt is transferable to whoever takes over. Its all in writing from the 2008 financial books: "There is a change of control clause in the £100million loan agreement, meaning the full amount becomes repayable on demand should a change occur.' "A loan of £100m from Mr J W Ashley is unsecured. The loan agreement is that interest can be charged at a rate of LIBOR + 0.5%" This last quote means that the interest rate Ashley can charge may rest 0.5% above the base rate. It is these two factors that are the biggest stumbling block in a potential takeover. However, if we are loosing 500k a week, we can probaby take some positives from this as we should be in a secure profit (when/if) we are promoted back to the Prem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26811 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Unfortunately Ashley is indeed expecting his money back. Although he has injected a £100 million 'gift loan' into the club, the clubs debts are only effectively cleared because he is lending his own money to a company he owns. However, if a change of ownership takes place, this debt is transferable to whoever takes over. Its all in writing from the 2008 financial books: "There is a change of control clause in the £100million loan agreement, meaning the full amount becomes repayable on demand should a change occur.' "A loan of £100m from Mr J W Ashley is unsecured. The loan agreement is that interest can be charged at a rate of LIBOR + 0.5%" This last quote means that the interest rate Ashley can charge may rest 0.5% above the base rate. It is these two factors that are the biggest stumbling block in a potential takeover. However, if we are loosing 500k a week, we can probaby take some positives from this as we should be in a secure profit (when/if) we are promoted back to the Prem. Any buyer would take the loan amount into account when deciding the purchase price. The bit about the interest rate means that Ashley could effectively charge the club interest on the loans he has made to the club, it doesn't affect future owners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUFC_Mag 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Unfortunately Ashley is indeed expecting his money back. Although he has injected a £100 million 'gift loan' into the club, the clubs debts are only effectively cleared because he is lending his own money to a company he owns. However, if a change of ownership takes place, this debt is transferable to whoever takes over. Its all in writing from the 2008 financial books: "There is a change of control clause in the £100million loan agreement, meaning the full amount becomes repayable on demand should a change occur.' "A loan of £100m from Mr J W Ashley is unsecured. The loan agreement is that interest can be charged at a rate of LIBOR + 0.5%" This last quote means that the interest rate Ashley can charge may rest 0.5% above the base rate. It is these two factors that are the biggest stumbling block in a potential takeover. However, if we are loosing 500k a week, we can probaby take some positives from this as we should be in a secure profit (when/if) we are promoted back to the Prem. Any buyer would take the loan amount into account when deciding the purchase price. The bit about the interest rate means that Ashley could effectively charge the club interest on the loans he has made to the club, it doesn't affect future owners. Naturally any buyer would take the loan amount into account, but it makes a takeover more expensive/less attractive and so remains a stumbling block. If Ashley can charge the club interest on the loans he has made, above that of the base rate, it then makes this debt even more costly. I don't understand how you can argue this has no effect upon future owners? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewerk 26811 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 Naturally any buyer would take the loan amount into account, but it makes a takeover more expensive/less attractive and so remains a stumbling block. If Ashley can charge the club interest on the loans he has made, above that of the base rate, it then makes this debt even more costly. I don't understand how you can argue this has no effect upon future owners? So Ashley shouldn't have loaned any money to the club? As I said, the bit about the interest rate has no effect on future owners, it's about what he can charge the club now. Plus the LIBOR is not the base rate (as most of us know it). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUFC_Mag 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 (edited) Naturally any buyer would take the loan amount into account, but it makes a takeover more expensive/less attractive and so remains a stumbling block. If Ashley can charge the club interest on the loans he has made, above that of the base rate, it then makes this debt even more costly. I don't understand how you can argue this has no effect upon future owners? So Ashley shouldn't have loaned any money to the club? As I said, the bit about the interest rate has no effect on future owners, it's about what he can charge the club now. Plus the LIBOR is not the base rate (as most of us know it). Your not following my argument, I'm not saying Ashley shouldnt have loaned money to the club, it was obviously a requirement, however, he will wish to recoup this investment and therefore it remains a hurdle for potential buyers; he is not simply going to write of 100million. Also, your simply incorrect in regards to the future owners, they inherit the debt and conseqeuntly the interest rate attached to this. Although Ashley can charge the interest rate now, the books show: "no interest has been charged in the year to 30 June 2008." We will find out in the 09 books whether this has changed although I doubt it. If a buyout takes place then the circumstances change significantly. It is costly for Ashley to loan £100 million, as this could of been invested elsewhere to attain higher profits, therefore the additional 0.5% is compensating him for this. It all makes financial sense yet remains a burden on any new owners; the 100million and attached interest remain an issue. On a sidenote, the LIBOR is one of the most common benchmark interest rate indexes Edited February 25, 2010 by NUFC_Mag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 I find it hard to beleive that any new owner would agree to the loans remaining- this would effectively leave the club in Ashley's economic control, even if he had sold the equity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NUFC_Mag 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 I find it hard to beleive that any new owner would agree to the loans remaining- this would effectively leave the club in Ashley's economic control, even if he had sold the equity. So prospective buyers are going to expect Ashley to write off 100million? unfortunately that is the true cost of Newcastle United, Shepherds overspending followed by relegation doesn't come cheap. When/if we are bought out we will have large debts to MA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMoog 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 I think anything coming from the Ashley camp can firmly be rounded up in one word = Shite Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Park Life 71 Posted February 25, 2010 Author Share Posted February 25, 2010 I think anything coming from the Ashley camp can firmly be rounded up in one word = Shite I'm just gonna go with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bibble 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 I think anything coming from the Ashley camp can firmly be rounded up in one word = Shite +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nyff 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 And almost as if it was planned...: Hughton Thanks Ashley for Cash (Sorry if already been posted in some form) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bibble 0 Posted February 25, 2010 Share Posted February 25, 2010 And almost as if it was planned...: Hughton Thanks Ashley for Cash Pass the sick bag... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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