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6 minutes ago, Gemmill said:
 

Looking forward to this period of reflection. 

 

 


How long is this period of reflection going to last? Sounds to be like Corbyn wants to choose his own successor.

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3 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

So how are you proposing we get the left on board with austerity lite? Maybe we leave that particular policy on the bonfire. I wonder if all of this could have been avoided if Labour just opposed austerity properly... maybe Corbyn would never have been elected. As I've said before, I was going Cooper up until I read his manifesto and the party broadly voted to punish poor people in some timely vote on austerity around the same time.

 

But anyway, if the centrists want to take the party back, it's gonna have to be seriously convincing stuff. Winning elections should be front and centre but it can't be everything.

FFS. It isn’t a choice between austerity and communism. You can have a centre left party which opposes austerity, doesn’t want to nationalise your granny, implements a fair taxation system which growing the economy and doesn’t want to give away free broadband to your dog.

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2 minutes ago, ewerk said:

FFS. It isn’t a choice between austerity and communism. You can have a centre left party which opposes austerity, doesn’t want to nationalise your granny, implements a fair taxation system which growing the economy and doesn’t want to give away free broadband to your dog.

 

I didn't say it was, hence suggesting we leave austerity out. All i meant to imply was that the offering needs to be strong. More left than centre.

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12 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

Winning elections should be front and centre but it can't be everything.

 

I had a double take on this. Yes, it absolutely is everything. Being a principled opposition isn't helping anyone.

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3 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

I had a double take on this. Yes, it absolutely is everything. Being a principled opposition isn't helping anyone.

 

Johnson just won an election, that's not going to help us. Just winning isn't everything. Policies matter.

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Also, again, I'm kind of trying to suggest how we get the broad church back.

 

I'm now about 30 hours without sleep so maybe I'm totally incoherent at this point. 

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6 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

Johnson just won an election, that's not going to help us. Just winning isn't everything. Policies matter.

 

This is a circular argument. No point having policies you can't implement. Blair and co got this, I'm not sure you do. 

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8 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

Johnson just won an election, that's not going to help us. Just winning isn't everything. Policies matter.

Johnson just won an election on sound bites and a paper thin manifesto. The gap in the polls was pretty much the same at the end as at the beginning. Policies matter to a relatively small number of the electorate 

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1 hour ago, Monkeys Fist said:

@Tom, hats off to you mate, you did everything in your power. 
 

Cheers for the kind words lads. It's a rough day today.

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15 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said:

i think what johnson has demonstrated is you win elections in 2019 by fighting dirty and making promises you can't keep. 

Yup, it’s a worrying blueprint for the future.

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31 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

Also, again, I'm kind of trying to suggest how we get the broad church back.

 

I'm now about 30 hours without sleep so maybe I'm totally incoherent at this point. 

 

 

Let’s be clear. This was a catastrophe for Labour. Putting lipstick on it isn’t going to change their fortunes. The party needs a complete reset.

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14 minutes ago, ewerk said:

 

 

Let’s be clear. This was a catastrophe for Labour. Putting lipstick on it isn’t going to change their fortunes. The party needs a complete reset.

 

I'm not trying to put lipstick on anything, I think they're fucked. Permanently. I've said it repeatedly.

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40 minutes ago, Alex said:

Johnson just won an election on sound bites and a paper thin manifesto. The gap in the polls was pretty much the same at the end as at the beginning. Policies matter to a relatively small number of the electorate 

 

But they do matter to the left wing that any centrist taking over Labour needs to keep on side. This whole point came from an attempt to suggest that if the centrists do somehow manage to take control again, they need to keep the left on board. Somehow.

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2 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

But they do matter to the left wing that any centrist taking over Labour needs to keep on side. This whole point came from an attempt to suggest that if the centrists do somehow manage to take control again, they need to keep the left on board. Somehow.

Fair enough. 👍🏻

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26 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

But they do matter to the left wing that any centrist taking over Labour needs to keep on side. This whole point came from an attempt to suggest that if the centrists do somehow manage to take control again, they need to keep the left on board. Somehow.

Where are they going to go? They aren’t likely to vote for anyone else. What is important it to keep them motivated so they’re out knocking on doors like Tom. It’s much easier to get the lefties out.

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47 minutes ago, ewerk said:

 

 

Let’s be clear. This was a catastrophe for Labour. Putting lipstick on it isn’t going to change their fortunes. The party needs a complete reset.

 

As it was this was the worst result in living memory wasn't it? Since 1935. Worse than 82 under Foot. I mean, that takes some doing. 

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Part of me hopes that several of the Labour voters who went for the Tories this time have a nagging sense of "what have we done". I doubt the intention was a victory this convincing.

 

They'll know what Johnson is about, too.

 

I still think that anyone objecting to Corbyn has no need to go Tory. So many of them went straight across the aisle here it's just bizarre if the issue was just him.

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5 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

Part of me hopes that several of the Labour voters who went for the Tories this time have a nagging sense of "what have we done". I doubt the intention was a victory this convincing.

 

They'll know what Johnson is about, too.

 

I still think that anyone objecting to Corbyn has no need to go Tory. So many of them went straight across the aisle here it's just bizarre if the issue was just him.

 

I think you underestimate how much people hate him and what they would do to keep him amd his acolytes out of power. I must admit, I don't get the reason for the extent of the hatred either. 

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2 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

I think you underestimate how much people hate him and what they would do to keep him amd his acolytes out of power. I must admit, I don't get the reason for the extent of the hatred either. 

Especially when you consider the absolute fucking clownshoe they voted for instead. 
 

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Mind, to look at it another way, Labour "only" polled 11% less than the tories, 13.9 million vs. 10.3 million votes, difference 3.6 million. It's a lot, but out of a voting population of 46 million maybe less than you'd think. 

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59 minutes ago, Ayatollah Hermione said:

Someone that hasn’t had a picture with Gerry Adams would do. The amount of people that saw that and hit the roof was genuinely staggering.

It was indeed staggering. Almost as staggering as shouting 'No surrender to IRA!' at Ingurland games and being so determined to not surrender to them that they inevitably said fuck Northern Ireland when the complexities of Brexit and the good Friday agreement came up. Almost as if they didn't have a clue/give a fuck about the IRA/keeping Ulster British after all?

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