Politics

[Craig 12319]

1 minute ago, PaddockLad said:

They're the same as the farmers. They're complaining about losing a part of their completely unearned wealth

 

 

Farming is slightly different for me in that it’s asset-rich, not cash-rich wealth. 

[PaddockLad 22422]

1 minute ago, Craig said:

Farming is slightly different for me in that it’s asset-rich, not cash-rich wealth. 

 

Domestic housing  and agricultural land prices have both gone up due to a free market though...

[Craig 12319]

So caveat it so that it’s only liable on the liquidation of asset - i.e. selling the land rather than a blanket tax that hits those intending to maintain the going concern.

[ewerk 39120]

10 hours ago, wykikitoon said:

Just seen this on a mates FB convo

 

The old age pension should not count towards the personal tax allowance. Why would you twist that?

 

He replied and then they said

 

my old age pension is paid for by my National Insurance Contributions. I was promised it at 60, and now having to wait until 66 and 10 months. There is no way I should have to pay tax on that. I'm from a generation which lost out on many things which were mis sold like Endowments, didn't get the maternity benefits of nursery assistance parents get today etc etc so I shouldn't pay tax on my bloody pension !!!!!!!

 

He doesn't pay tax on it though. The 0% personal allowance is greater than the state pension. So his point is moot.

[Renton 27739]

1 hour ago, Toonpack said:

 

I have no issue with much of that, but that highlighted bit is laughable. If nowt else look at child mortality rates. 

 

Christ, if you generalised about ethnic minorities the way you generalise "boomers" you'd be perfect for Reform.

 

This whole "generations" thing is yet more divisive bollocks invented to get folks worked up and divided about something, just in case there's nothing else working to keep the angst bubbling. It's quite frankly pathetic.

 

It's basically slagging someone off because of the year they were born, an event over which they had no control. Those 1976-ers are well dodgy mind.

 

An not slagging off the entire cohort, ut was a specific response to the the misconceptions of this particular person. I sincerely hope that, being just behind him age wise, I never think like this.

 

TP, back in the day you could raise a family on just the father's wage, maybe supplemented by the mum being part time. You didn't even need childcare or maternity leave.  This just isn't the case now, you must know this surely. Housing costs are astronomical compared with what they used to be, and without a settled home, people aren't going to choose to have kids in general. As for child mortality rates? We're not talking about the victorian ages ffs.

 

I'm top quintile and am really struggling with the costs of children. One car, one holiday a year, hardly ever go out anymore. Both stressed at work despite giving up more highly paid jobs for this reason.  You're gonna say that's what it was like for your generation. But for the top 20% with both parents working? It just wasn't. I don't know why you don't recognise this.

 

And thats before we talk about the horrors social media has inflicted on our kids. I'll await for the bad parenting riposte but the fact is it's fucking relentless the shit these companies put them through. I recognise my parents had it easier (on one teachers salary) and I had a better childhood in most ways.  I also recognise that my pension, though much worse than my parents, will be much better than my kids.

[Renton 27739]

7 minutes ago, ewerk said:

 

He doesn't pay tax on it though. The 0% personal allowance is greater than the state pension. So his point is moot.

If that ever becomes reality because of the triple lock it shows the state pension is too high imo. 

[PaddockLad 22422]

28 minutes ago, Craig said:

So caveat it so that it’s only liable on the liquidation of asset - i.e. selling the land rather than a blanket tax that hits those intending to maintain the going concern.

 

Yeah, they want to sell relatively uneconomic agricultural land (their real enemy is Tesco, not the chancellor) for top dollar to tax dodgers like Clarkson who they have completely unironically appointed their spokesman

 

 

[Alex 42055]

10 hours ago, wykikitoon said:

Just seen this on a mates FB convo

 

The old age pension should not count towards the personal tax allowance. Why would you twist that?

 

He replied and then they said

 

my old age pension is paid for by my National Insurance Contributions. I was promised it at 60, and now having to wait until 66 and 10 months. There is no way I should have to pay tax on that. I'm from a generation which lost out on many things which were mis sold like Endowments, didn't get the maternity benefits of nursery assistance parents get today etc etc so I shouldn't pay tax on my bloody pension !!!!!!!

It’s quite a ridiculous stance imo to think you’ve paid your bit and shouldn’t be taxed on income whilst still getting the benefits of the welfare system, the nhs, etc 

[Gemmill 62968]

I think we're getting it wrong here. I think this lad is Wykiki's age (he's saying he won't get his state pension til 67). And I assume he's just getting mixed up about which part of his pension he'll be paying NI on.

 

Either way, he's wrong though. 

[wykikitoon 28475]

15 minutes ago, ewerk said:

 

He doesn't pay tax on it though. The 0% personal allowance is greater than the state pension. So his point is moot.

 

I had to stop myself sticking my nose in and commentating on it  

Fucking daft cunts.

[Alex 42055]

10 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

 

Yeah, they want to sell relatively uneconomic agricultural land (their real enemy is Tesco, not the chancellor) for top dollar to tax dodgers like Clarkson who they have completely unironically appointed their spokesman

 

 

I see there was another farmer’s protest in Whitehall (against the budget but pre-planned of course). I doubt many farmers who are the bones of their arse (which I imagine makes up a fair proportion of them) have the time or money to drive tractors round central London 

[Gemmill 62968]

Reform are paying the legal costs of any of the farmers arrested as well. No doubt Farage was there in his farmer cosplay gear again. 

[Toonpack 15507]

12 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

TP, back in the day you could raise a family on just the father's wage, maybe supplemented by the mum being part time.

 

Because you had to, there was no option, get married, have kids it was like "the unwritten law" or expectation of society and it was not easy. 

 

You're finding it hard, well here's a shock so did I, and my peers, BUT you get through it, We never once thought "oooh this is hard", no-one did, we just on with it as best we could, it's only looking back you realise how actually shit and hard it was, but I've never blamed anyone for it. 

[wykikitoon 28475]

9 minutes ago, Alex said:

I see there was another farmer’s protest in Whitehall (against the budget but pre-planned of course). I doubt many farmers who are the bones of their arse (which I imagine makes up a fair proportion of them) have the time or money to drive tractors round central London 

Aye, we're all told they work 72 hour days, never have a holiday work for pennies. 

Yet have the time to fuck off to London, pay congestion charge and beep their horns.

[Gemmill 62968]

9 minutes ago, Toonpack said:

 

Because you had to, there was no option, get married, have kids it was like "the unwritten law" or expectation of society and it was not easy. 

 

You're finding it hard, well here's a shock so did I, and my peers, BUT you get through it, We never once thought "oooh this is hard", no-one did, we just on with it as best we could, it's only looking back you realise how actually shit and hard it was, but I've never blamed anyone for it. 

 

Fucking hell man, no. Not cos you had to. Because it was objectively easier because your money went further in those days. 

 

I was raised in a house where my dad worked on oil rigs and my mam didn't have to work, and we were very comfortable. Nice 3 bed semi. BMW, Golf GTI. Holidays every year, trips to disneyworld. 

 

It's just genuinely weird to not admit to the fact that, on average, people had it better then. Especially people coming up and trying to raise a family. 

 

You've got a genuine blind spot about this. 

Edited November 27 by Gemmill

[Renton 27739]

5 minutes ago, Toonpack said:

 

Because you had to, there was no option, get married, have kids it was like "the unwritten law" or expectation of society and it was not easy. 

 

You're finding it hard, well here's a shock so did I, and my peers, BUT you get through it, We never once thought "oooh this is hard", no-one did, we just on with it as best we could, it's only looking back you realise how actually shit and hard it was, but I've never blamed anyone for it. 

 

You COULDN'T do that today, is the point. Back then, you could afford a mortgage, kids, depending on your circumstances holidays etc. With the mother not working she could raise the kids, no need for childcare, plenty of time for home cooking, house work etc. It's just not an option any more.

And Im not fucking blaming you either. People are fundamentally the same, clearly. I'm picking you up on your refusal to accept the economic realities of today and it's role in childcare today.

[Gemmill 62968]

You're not being "blamed" for having had the benefit btw. But you are being questioned for not being prepared to see/admit to it. 

[Toonpack 15507]

39 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

 

Fucking hell man, no. Not cos you had to. Because it was objectively easier because your money went further in those days. 

 

I was raised in a house where my dad worked on oil rigs and my mam didn't have to work, and we were very comfortable. Nice 3 bed semi. BMW, Golf GTI. Holidays every year, trips to disneyworld. 

 

It's just genuinely weird to not admit to the fact that, on average, people had it better then. Especially people coming up and trying to raise a family. 

 

You've got a genuine blind spot about this. 

 

If you had kids you went to one wage and there was no option, it wasn't a choice, and yes we survived but it was not easy. You'd think it was idyllic the way you're going on.

 

Yes wages were higher in relative terms and stuff was cheaper and yes money went further largely because there was fuck all to spend it on and it was ONLY spent on necessities. Things only started to ease up a bit when the kids were in school.

 

If there's anything to blame it's the suppression of wages and ballooned corporate profits WAY before some group of people who happened to be born/raised at a certain time.

 

Not everyone (in fact few) had the benefit of providing kids with a silver spoon upbringing like yours.

[Gemmill 62968]

1 minute ago, Toonpack said:

 

If you had kids you went to one wage and there was no option, it wasn't a choice, and yes we survived but it was not easy. You'd think it was idyllic the way you're going on.

 

Yes wages were higher in relative terms and stuff was cheaper and yes money went further largely because there was fuck all to spend it on and it was ONLY spent on necessities. Things only started to ease up a bit when the kids were in school.

 

If there's anything to blame it's the suppression of wages and ballooned corporate profits WAY before some group of people who happened to be born/raised at a certain time.

 

Not everyone (in fact few) had the benefit of providing kids with a silver spoon upbringing like yours.

 

 

In with the digs, what an absolute prick. 

 

At least I've finally managed to get you to admit you had it better than the youth of today though, so congratulations on that front. 

 

And for the 100TH TIME, no one is blaming you. 

[Toonpack 15507]

1 hour ago, Renton said:

 

You COULDN'T do that today, is the point. Back then, you could afford a mortgage, kids, depending on your circumstances holidays etc. With the mother not working she could raise the kids, no need for childcare, plenty of time for home cooking, house work etc. It's just not an option any more.

And Im not fucking blaming you either. People are fundamentally the same, clearly. I'm picking you up on your refusal to accept the economic realities of today and it's role in childcare today.

 

I'll be having brunch with my mate later and will be surrounded by the mums and toddlers again I'll be sure to sympathise with them about how tough it is for them.

[Renton 27739]

Just now, Toonpack said:

 

I'll be having brunch with my mate later and will be surrounded by the mums and toddlers again I'll be sure to sympathise with them about how tough it is for them.

 

Fucking hell man, you're beyond help.

[Gemmill 62968]

Boomers who brunch. 

Edited November 27 by Gemmill

[Alex 42055]

1 hour ago, Toonpack said:

 

Because you had to, there was no option, get married, have kids it was like "the unwritten law" or expectation of society and it was not easy. 

 

You're finding it hard, well here's a shock so did I, and my peers, BUT you get through it, We never once thought "oooh this is hard", no-one did, we just on with it as best we could, it's only looking back you realise how actually shit and hard it was, but I've never blamed anyone for it. 

I guess the biggest problem for the younger generations are the difficulties with social mobility. It seems fairly hopeless to me in this country unless you have family or whatever to give you a financial leg up. I don’t know how you get in the housing ladder otherwise. There’s then a lack of security which makes it difficult to plan for the future and plan a family or whatever because you’re either stuck living with relatives or at the whims of the rental market. The cost of living has exacerbated all of this along with stagnation of wages. I know other people struggled by in past but I think the idea of being able to work hard, save up and buy a house was accessible to more people then. I’m canny old myself now tbh so I remember the 80s and even the 70s a little bit so I know everything wasn’t rosy for everyone back then and appreciate where you’re coming from 

[Toonpack 15507]

2 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

 

 

In with the digs, what an absolute prick. 

 

At least I've finally managed to get you to admit you had it better than the youth of today though, so congratulations on that front. 

 

And for the 100TH TIME, no one is blaming you. 

 

 

 

What winds me up is the impression, on here, that it was all a piece of piss for everyone of my generation, it wasn't, and quality of life is about way more than just ooh you could bring up kids on one wage.

[Toonpack 15507]

4 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

Boomers who brunch. 

Only if we can get in past the young mums.

 

My turn to pay as well, fuck !!