Donald Trump

[Christmas Tree 5587]

Well this is going to piss off Trump AND China

 

 

[Toonpack 12593]

40 minutes ago, PaddockLad said:

This is Trump's real entry to the big league. I genuinely think this emboldens him and he'll soon land troops on Greenland. Iraq will incur a refugee crisis upon its neighbours and Western Europe the likes of which we'll have never seen before... don't have kids but I feel very sorry for all yours ..

 

He may (just may) have overstepped, MAGA were dead against getting involved. A pre-emptive strike against a foreign nation is not within Presidential powers and must be approved by Congress. I know the rules don't apply to this cunt but a lot were vehemently against this, we can but hope this time the rules may be observed and he could be in the shit.

 

It'll get worse for him again when US servicemen, and possibly civilians, start to die as I am sure they will.

[Toonpack 12593]

1 minute ago, Christmas Tree said:

Well this is going to piss off Trump AND China

 

 

 

Russia will be happy as it'll push up the price of oil, just the financial injection their economy desperately needed.

[PaddockLad 20176]

[aimaad22 5094]

10 hours ago, Rayvin said:

Iran and the middle east should just accept that Israel can slaughter them whenever it wants and make peace with it tbh, I dont see what else they can do.

 

Invariably, long term it will produce more insurgency, Israel will never sleep at peace. And the US has destroyed whatever little credibility it had left, other nations will push for arms from China and we will all live in a much more dangerous world. Who knew arming and funding a genocidal maniac in the middle east could have resulted in this? 

 

Iran signed a deal that Trump tore up. Then they were negotiating with the US when Israel struck. Then they were negotiating with Europe when the US struck  but they're the bad guys in all this supposedly. And look at the posturing from Israel and US too btw, "we've struck your nuclear facilities but now YOU must negotiate for peace or die" I mean ok

 

This is nothing but modern colonialism and imperialism and eventually it will meet the same fate that all empires do. 

[Renton 24930]

9 minutes ago, aimaad22 said:

 

Invariably, long term it will produce more insurgency, Israel will never sleep at peace. And the US has destroyed whatever little credibility it had left, other nations will push for arms from China and we will all live in a much more dangerous world. Who knew arming and funding a genocidal maniac in the middle east could have resulted in this? 

 

Iran signed a deal that Trump tore up. Then they were negotiating with the US when Israel struck. Then they were negotiating with Europe when the US struck  but they're the bad guys in all this supposedly. And look at the posturing from Israel and US too btw, "we've struck your nuclear facilities but now YOU must negotiate for peace or die" I mean ok

 

This is nothing but modern colonialism and imperialism and eventually it will meet the same fate that all empires do. 

 

I do find the Iranian theocratic government abhorrent but I don't disagree with what you say here. Iran is not at fault here. Definitely getting shades of this.

 

Edited 5 hours ago by Renton

[Rayvin 6680]

10 minutes ago, aimaad22 said:

 

Invariably, long term it will produce more insurgency, Israel will never sleep at peace. And the US has destroyed whatever little credibility it had left, other nations will push for arms from China and we will all live in a much more dangerous world. Who knew arming and funding a genocidal maniac in the middle east could have resulted in this? 

 

Iran signed a deal that Trump tore up. Then they were negotiating with the US when Israel struck. Then they were negotiating with Europe when the US struck  but they're the bad guys in all this supposedly. And look at the posturing from Israel and US too btw, "we've struck your nuclear facilities but now YOU must negotiate for peace or die" I mean ok

 

This is nothing but modern colonialism and imperialism and eventually it will meet the same fate that all empires do. 

 

It is indeed, no doubts there. I'd fully support a nuclear armed Iran tbh, it's the only way they can ensure they aren't fucked with.

[spongebob toonpants 4624]

[Renton 24930]

38 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

It is indeed, no doubts there. I'd fully support a nuclear armed Iran tbh, it's the only way they can ensure they aren't fucked with.

 

Erm, no. A nuclear armed Iran would be an existential threat for all of us with their connections with the Houthi, Hezbollah, and Hamas etc. WMD and religious zealotry are a bad combination. And yes, I am certainly including the US rapture crew in this, but we're a bit late there. The answer surprisingly was diplomacy. But now that has well and truly been shown to be a sham where Trump and the US are concerned, not to mention Israel who are now brazen liars not to be trusted. So Iran will be hell bent on getting nukes now regardless of the consequences.

[Rayvin 6680]

45 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

Erm, no. A nuclear armed Iran would be an existential threat for all of us with their connections with the Houthi, Hezbollah, and Hamas etc. WMD and religious zealotry are a bad combination. And yes, I am certainly including the US rapture crew in this, but we're a bit late there. The answer surprisingly was diplomacy. But now that has well and truly been shown to be a sham where Trump and the US are concerned, not to mention Israel who are now brazen liars not to be trusted. So Iran will be hell bent on getting nukes now regardless of the consequences.

 

I'd still fully support it. Not seen anything that makes me think the religious are more uniquely predisposed to widespread brutality and catastrophe than anyone else. Indeed money and oil seem to be stronger drivers.

[aimaad22 5094]

Yeah that's what further lopsided, can anyone remember the last time Iran invaded another country? What's the count for the US and Israel again? 

 

I mean by all means get rid of nukes and then bomb the lone fecker that refuses to do it. You can't pick and choose. 

 

Especially when the only country that has nuked a civilian population and another one that refuses to sign the NPT and has undeclared nukes are telling others that they're the unstable ones  

[Renton 24930]

7 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

Yeah hard disagree on this. I now believe in a world absent of US policing that the only hope any medium sized country has of defending itself is nukes. So as said, I'd fully support it personally. It'd be the end of Israel fucking around with them and let's be real, no one is ever going to use nukes aggressively - if North Korea can't bring itself to use them, then no one else will.

 

I do not believe the Iranian regime is an existential threat to all of us, I believe they just want to be left the fuck alone. If we want other nations not to build nukes, we need to be protecting them from militant psychopaths, not enabling them.

 

Also I'm actually curious, when have religious zealots used WMDs previously? Have they used them more than 'civilised' Western nations?

 

Well, there's only 2 instances of their use of course, both morally and ethically debatable and both from the US when they were "the good guys". I don't think any theocracy has successfully developed nukes before so your point is moot. None of Pakistan, India or Israel are outright theocracies, although the influence of religion is still a concern with these countries.

But I know enough about Iran's government of Ayatollahs and Karmenai that I'd  be very concerned were they to have the power to preemptively use fission bombs on Israel. Their stated unambiguous aim is the destruction of the zion state. Their Houthi allies which the mackems think are great lads literally have this written on their flag.

[Rayvin 6680]

If you honestly think Iran would nuke Israel and completely ensure its total annihilation in the process, I can't help you. I find the level of fear we all have about Islamic countries to be utterly insane given that we are the ones who have persecuted them up and down through history, for the past 200 years.

 

I'd trust Iran with a nuke far more than Israel.

[Renton 24930]

3 minutes ago, aimaad22 said:

Yeah that's what further lopsided, can anyone remember the last time Iran invaded another country? What's the count for the US and Israel again? 

 

I mean by all means get rid of nukes and then bomb the lone fecker that refuses to do it. You can't pick and choose. 

 

Especially when the only country that has nuked a civilian population and another one that refuses to sign the NPT and has undeclared nukes are telling others that they're the unstable ones  

 

Howay, Iran has been fighting proxy wars and supporting terrorist groups for decades. They are a brutal authoritarian state that oppress their own people mercilessly. They also supply Russia with drones to kill Ukrainian civilians.

 

Israel has never used nuclear weapons when they probably could have. Iran might be responsible custodians of a nuclear arsenal but erm, no thanks, I'd rather not have that risk. Not to say what has happened is right. It's not, and as you say is counterproductive.

[Renton 24930]

2 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

If you honestly think Iran would nuke Israel and completely ensure its total annihilation in the process, I can't help you. I find the level of fear we all have about Islamic countries to be utterly insane given that we are the ones who have persecuted them up and down through history, for the past 200 years.

 

I'd trust Iran with a nuke far more than Israel.

 

For all it's faults Israel is a democracy. Why don't you trust them with nuclear weapons, they literally have them and don't use them. I think you're being a bit naive on the Iranian government here. They haven't destroyed Israel because they are impotent. I don't want that to change. They will never be allies of the west as they are fundamentally opposed to western liberal democracy as a concept.

 

[Rayvin 6680]

Just now, Renton said:

 

For all it's faults Israel is a democracy. Why don't you trust them with nuclear weapons, they literally have them and don't use them. I think you're being a bit naive on the Iranian government here. They haven't destroyed Israel because they are impotent. I don't want that to change. They will never be allies of the west as they are fundamentally opposed to western liberal democracy as a concept.

 

 

"Naive" again. Man I hear that a lot on here, always makes me smile a bit given how things tend to go.

 

Alright man, I surrender to your superior knowledge of the inner workings of the Iranian state and its motivations.

 

 

[Renton 24930]

4 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

"Naive" again. Man I hear that a lot on here, always makes me smile a bit given how things tend to go.

 

Alright man, I surrender to your superior knowledge of the inner workings of the Iranian state and its motivations.

 

 

 

Well, you certainly can't go there and decide for yourself. As far as authoritarian hell holes go, there aren't many worse countries imo.

 

 

[Renton 24930]

This ancient tweet has resurfaced.

 

 

 

[ewerk 34909]

43 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

If you honestly think Iran would nuke Israel and completely ensure its total annihilation in the process, I can't help you. I find the level of fear we all have about Islamic countries to be utterly insane given that we are the ones who have persecuted them up and down through history, for the past 200 years.

 

I'd trust Iran with a nuke far more than Israel.

“The Iranians, a great bunch of lads”.

[aimaad22 5094]

30 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

Howay, Iran has been fighting proxy wars and supporting terrorist groups for decades. They are a brutal authoritarian state that oppress their own people mercilessly. They also supply Russia with drones to kill Ukrainian civilians.

 

Israel has never used nuclear weapons when they probably could have. Iran might be responsible custodians of a nuclear arsenal but erm, no thanks, I'd rather not have that risk. Not to say what has happened is right. It's not, and as you say is counterproductive.

 

Given what has happened in the last few years, if you think Iran is more dangerous than Israel, nothing I'll say will convince you otherwise. 

 

Yes they've engaged in proxy wars and deserve criticism for it but the list of countries that have done that is long and hardly reason to believe they'd use nukes willy nilly. 

[aimaad22 5094]

Anyway, only time will tell how effective these strikes were and what Iran does. The only guarantee at the moment seems to be that the next generation is going to grow up in a less safe world than we did. 

[Renton 24930]

1 hour ago, aimaad22 said:

 

Given what has happened in the last few years, if you think Iran is more dangerous than Israel, nothing I'll say will convince you otherwise. 

 

Yes they've engaged in proxy wars and deserve criticism for it but the list of countries that have done that is long and hardly reason to believe they'd use nukes willy nilly. 

 

Iran are more dangerous to us, as in UK, EU, than Israel. Of course they are. They're allied with Russia, close to China and frankly our number2 enemy. Israel are our ally. That doesn't detract or excuse their atrocities, but it's true nonetheless.

 

1 hour ago, aimaad22 said:

Anyway, only time will tell how effective these strikes were and what Iran does. The only guarantee at the moment seems to be that the next generation is going to grow up in a less safe world than we did. 

 

I agree.

[Rayvin 6680]

1 hour ago, aimaad22 said:

 

Given what has happened in the last few years, if you think Iran is more dangerous than Israel, nothing I'll say will convince you otherwise. 

 

Yes they've engaged in proxy wars and deserve criticism for it but the list of countries that have done that is long and hardly reason to believe they'd use nukes willy nilly. 

 

Other than when they had the audacity to try and break free from colonial era oil terms, I don't know what Iran have ever done to the UK. I'm fairly sure it's absolutely fuck all. The older I get, the more convinced I become that we're the true terror state in all this. Us and the Americans.