Rayvin

The media and dirty money is in charge more like. The electorate for the most part doesn't understand any single issue well enough to place an informed vote against it because they only get their information from one side.

Ah that makes sense now. But it's interesting this point about papering over the cracks - what does Labour expect is going to be different now, that they'll enact changes quick enough that they can fill the cracks before they need papering over?

I see we're running Rivers of Blood comparisons today. One thing that I'm not following mind, Starmer keeps claiming that the Tories were running an open border experiment - obviously they weren't in reality, but what is he basically pointing to? What specifically did the Tories do which enabled immigration to spiral?

I was wondering if he doesn't thrive as well with Barnes as he does with Gordon, but if he is injured in some form then thats a better scenario. A few people are saying his head is turned but he looks angry enough when he misses that im not sure it would impact his game even if it was true.

Was looking back at some of my posts from nearer Brexit, a much angrier time for me I think me of 4 years ago was right on this though: Ignore the EU focus of that because really you could say the same about any issue. If we fall into line with an ever more right leaning Labour party, we will never realise anything we want to see happen. Starmer has proven that in his first year in power.

Having now reviewed this immigration stuff in more detail, I'm back to despairing. It's fact free bollocks that just endorses Reform talking points. Guardian comment section is full of people declaring they will abandon Labour, and I know that's just the Guardian, but let's be real, a lot of us read it. A lot of left of centre people read it. I wonder if there's something to be said for the Tories in all this. They believe most of the same things but weren't competent enough to get any of it done. Labour on the other hand...

It's not like it even hurt Chelsea, they were better without him. In the end he's a bellend, playing for a bellend club, whose suspension will only sadden bellends. That's all that really matters.

I mean tbh I'm not at all convinced Labour is ready to be having this conversation though. It feels to me, and has felt to me since Miliband, that Labour needs some sort of actual vision to be taking the country toward. I get that pragmatism is important but I don't think it can exist just on its own. We need to be going somewhere, and with Labour it's really poorly defined. It's all reactive stuff. Whether it's Starmer, Rayner, whoever... I just don't see who in the party has the first fucking idea where to take the country. There is leadership but no vision.

Fuck sake mate, I'm sorry. Fucking shit news. You'll likely not forget her at least, she seemed to have some real personality to her.

Huh.. you all really think that's likely? Who would step into the breach? I don't think the issue is just Starmer at all, I think it's a party wide malaise.

Corbyn was challenged by the Blairites though, and Starmer is from their fold. He's since purged the party of the moderate left so we won't see any sort of challenge this term IMO. The immigration thing I don't have as much of an issue with tbh - I mean it's a nonsense issue in reality but it is a substantive issue in terms of narrative. More communication about what they're doing to tackle it isn't a bad thing - even if I saw very little detail about what all of this speech actually means in reality.

This but also Arteta blames the ref/ball/weather/planetary alignment and then proclaims Arsenal to be the best team in the league, for all time.

He's not even good enough to warrant this level of fuss.

Mind you, if we beat them a fourth time this season I genuinely think it might break Arteta. We might watch a man completely come apart in real time.

I mean I know, but at the same time I just thought it might be interesting to review the permutations I always back us against Arsenal but at the same time, we shouldn't panic if we lose.

Pressure is off on this one to some extent with the way the table is set. As long as we avoid a bad loss, we'll still be in a solid enough position on final day. Not that I'd want it to go to final day. If we lose to Arsenal and everyone else wins their games, we're still 5th at minimum thanks to GD. If we win it, we're over the line. I guess a draw might help us against Chelsea in the end.

They probably will be, final game of the season at home presumably. Doesn't change the fact that they're not exactly a superb team though.

Fucking Arteta He's a living meme.

For real? What a joke man. As if this hasn't been Forest's best season in decades.

About what

Agreed, Dan Burn is a fucking hero. He'll be remembered fondly, I'm sure of it.

Huge result. But while I'm pleased for our CL hopes of course, I am at this moment pleased more that we beat that slimy, cynical stain on football. I was ambivalent about who missed out of the other CL places, but I now firmly know which team I want to see fail. Chelsea are on the football pitch what they are in the boardroom. Entitled cunts who bend the rules and somehow get away with it. May their club burn in hell. HWTL.

I could actually cry. the poetic fucking justice.

Minute by minute, like the BBC text service. I mean tbh, I can hear if we score from my window so I'm usually pretty informed

As someone who can't watch games like this because my anxiety can't take it, and so instead I follow MBM and the chat on here, I cannot begin to describe how much I hate comments like this