Renton

Do it once you're in power maybe? Just avoid any mention at all of the EU in the manifesto.

He's excellent although I'd like to fact check what he says, especially the 500 miilion profit quote. I was under the impression virtually every railway in the world is subsidised? Also he obviously has a different role to Starmer, he doesn't have to worry about being elected by the whole country. He would be unelectable in that context (rightly or wrongly).

You're resorting to quite ridiculous hypthetical arguments to justify your frankly ludicrous argument here. Lets not deal in hypotheticals. Lets look at the real options in front of us and vote on which we would prefer. If you'd prefer someone else to Johnson, vote against him (for whoever has the best chance of defeating the conservatives in your seat). You're either unaware of the extremely perilous position this country is in or you've given up, I suspect the latter.

Well that's a complete oxymoron. But its not like the differences between Starmer's labour and Johnson's tories are slight, is it? The differences are fucking huge. I'd argue bigger than any election in history personally. If you can't see this, and don't recognise the probably irreversible damage another Johnson term would do (like Trump in the US), then I give up.

This is what I'm scared of, loss of experienced teachers. I don't blame her, teacher's have been treated like shit since 2010. Can't quite remember what happened that year.

We're the only country in Europe standing up to Putin? Oh go fuck yourself mate, another tory shit head.

There's bound to be more industrial action heading into autumn. Got to say, after lock down (and witnessing first hand how hard it is to educate the little shits), there is no professional group I respect more than teachers. I'd give them 10% straight away.

I won't celebrate Newcastle United until we win the Champions league. Fuck the league cup, I wouldn't even smile if we won that.

Pragmatism > Idealism, every time.

Oh come on man. This is fucking ridiculous. No manifesto has been released yet. And you really think a Starmer government would be as bad as the current lot except for maybe one good policy. Really? Because from where I am, Labour's front benches are full of talented, competent, and as far as I am aware, not corrupt, people. If for nothing else surely you recognise they would be infinitely more competent than the Johnson party and not constantly stoking culture wars and wedge issues? You're lost to me!

That is first class loafing.

Fucking Labour, ruining the country again.

Those sentences seems contradictory unless you really believe a Labour government would be as bad as this current tory government. Well, yeah, for obvious reasons.

Well there's you and spngebob for one. Momentum are still there too (not saying you support these of course). I think you need to recognise the dilemma Starmer is in fighting this rotten corrupt government ba ked by the full might of the Murdoch press. He's going to make decisions you don't agree with and may be tactically wrong even. But the intentions are purely to get into power and stop labour being impotent. By all means don't join the party, but not voting for them (if I'm reading this right) plays right into the tories hands. I don't think he should Ihave stopped his front bench from joining the pickets and I certainly don't think he should punish them. It's a moral and tactical mistake imo. But I will support him. Plenty in the party will use it as an opportunity to attack him and weaken the party though imo.

Legal and police professions have been absolutely screwed by the party of law and order.

Echo what has been said and really feel for you. What a sht situation, haven't got any practical advice you wouldn't already know about. It'll be no comfort to you that millions are in the same position. My own experience is that I have somehow remained married which means on paper we should be able to live very comfortably. But I'm heavily indebted (partly our fault, partly not) for the next 3 years at least and honestly I run out of money every month, and stick things on credit cards.. My job is canny enough, but my wife's job is incredibly stressful though and the hours are insane. But she can't afford to leave because everything else is paid much worse. It's creating real strains on the family at a time we should be enjoying it, its not sustainable. I personally feel that its obvious quality of life in this country has gone down the shitter since Cameron got in, accelerated by the madness since the Brexit referendum. Take care of your mental health first and foremost and get help wherever you can. I sincerely hope things improve for you.

Steisand effect in action.

Good post Scoobos. I can see both sides, but have to say staying quiet and letting the tories own this probably won't work, they are masters at blame shifting. Meanwhile, I am much nearer to being an OAP myself now than a graduate, but please God don't let me adopt their political persuasion. Why do so many pensioners hate working people so much?

Hmm, maybe. Makes sense, stoke up the division to number 11, and get it done before the shit storm of winter hits. And if they lose, it's somebody else's mess to clear up.

And meanwhile....; I was talking to my mum last night, and she is proof that this drip drip of propaganda from the tories, enabled by the BBC, has an effect. She doesn't read the Mail or any daily papers. But yesterday she started ranting about how much train drivers got paid, how we need to tighten our belts, and how much worse it was in the 70s. Since my Dad departed she has become incredibly susceptible to this (immigrants as well), no way would he have come out with that shit. It seems all the tory party care about is placating pensioners to me, they hate normal people who work, especially those who have families. She'll be okay on her triple locked pension though.

Well that can't be right, as GB news is completely impartial isn't it, old bristle head told me so.

What Starmer was trying to avoid, happened anyway. Face the cunts down Keir. From interviews I have seen, your front bench is tearing strips out of the tories. You, not so much.

Tory HQ in overdrivr ae the moment. It's Labour's strike apparently, despite RMT not even being afilliated to the Labour party. We had Grant Schapps yesterday constantly quoting the average salary of train drivers, when train drivers aren't even striking (yet). This is what happens when lying is accepted as normal at the very top. The country burns.

Meanwhile......

Tend to agree, he needs to face this head on. The Labour party have been running for too long now, time to fight back.