Gemmill 62969 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 Plus I think we'll be adding to the squad in Jan. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 12320 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 Yeah it's too early yet to write things off and as you point out, there's 78 points still available. I think we'll turn the form around and probably look back on this period with a view of "what might have been". 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob toonpants 5169 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 I quite fancy a run at the Europa League tbh, be certainly a very good chance if bringing it home 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 26306 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 Would Sandro and Tino hang around for that competition though? They’re good enough to be playing in the CL regularly 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 26306 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 I think we can almost forget about CL this season unless there’s a remarkable turnaround in our away form. I’d quite enjoy a bash at the Europa league too. All counts toward the uefa coefficient which would help our chances for when we get into the CL again but would probably also trigger a big sale or two. Not only because certain players might want away. The lack of CL cash would force the issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 26306 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 At this stage I’d take any European footie tbh. We’re so inconsistent it’s hard to predict we’ll finish top 6-7 with any certainty. And the league is so competitive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spongebob toonpants 5169 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 Maybe, maybe not We're not in a position yet where we can guarantee maintaining a challenge on all fronts. We need to learn from the Rat debacle about selling better and reinvestng to raise the overall level A great first 11 isn't anywhere near enough 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoHelpMeGod 241 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 Would love Europa as well. It's still Europe, different flavour, and I think we'd actually look to go and win it. I'm not worried at all about this season at the moment. We'll turn it all around and probably finish 5th - 7th. Hopefully, the turnaround starts properly tomorrow. Maybe we'll have another stab at the League Cup as well. It's a lovely feeling, having a manager who allows me to believe that any bad spells can be navigated. Easier to see them for what they really are. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 26306 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 31 minutes ago, SoHelpMeGod said: Would love Europa as well. It's still Europe, different flavour, and I think we'd actually look to go and win it. I'm not worried at all about this season at the moment. We'll turn it all around and probably finish 5th - 7th. Hopefully, the turnaround starts properly tomorrow. Maybe we'll have another stab at the League Cup as well. It's a lovely feeling, having a manager who allows me to believe that any bad spells can be navigated. Easier to see them for what they really are. you’re spot on. He’s consistently shown he can turn things around after starting slowly. It is a recurring theme though, isn’t it? Having to go on mad unbeaten runs to claw back lost ground. Hope he pulls the rabbit out of the hat once again. He wasn’t helped this season by how the transfer window played out but at sone point we’ve got to find a way to start the season better so we’re not left with a mountain to climb. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 62969 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 We're miles away from having a squad that should be able to compete with the top 4 on a regular basis. That's why there's inconsistency. But because of what he's achieved in such a ridiculously short space of time, we're judging him by top 4 standards and "why can't we just be at our best and a total fucking juggernaut all of the time?" Look at the money Liverpool, Chelsea, and Man City have spent, and even they can't maintain those standards a lot of the time. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trophyshy 8997 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 49 minutes ago, SoHelpMeGod said: Would love Europa as well. Happy to oblige. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trophyshy 8997 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 3 minutes ago, Gemmill said: We're miles away from having a squad that should be able to compete with the top 4 on a regular basis. That's why there's inconsistency. But because of what he's achieved in such a ridiculously short space of time, we're judging him by top 4 standards and "why can't we just be at our best and a total fucking juggernaut all of the time?" Look at the money Liverpool, Chelsea, and Man City have spent, and even they can't maintain those standards a lot of the time. Indeed, it takes at least half a billion to go massively backwards these days. 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 12320 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 Would love the run of the Europa League which, given Spurs's exploits last season, we should more than be able to make a good stab at. The concern is about keeping our personnel happy. We shouldn't kid ourselves that for some of them playing in the Champions League will be more important than playing for Newcastle United. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 12320 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 6 minutes ago, Gemmill said: We're miles away from having a squad that should be able to compete with the top 4 on a regular basis. That's why there's inconsistency. But because of what he's achieved in such a ridiculously short space of time, we're judging him by top 4 standards and "why can't we just be at our best and a total fucking juggernaut all of the time?" Look at the money Liverpool, Chelsea, and Man City have spent, and even they can't maintain those standards a lot of the time. Aye this is spot on. We're victims of being miles ahead of where we should be. Ourselves and Villa are in similar positions in that we have what it takes to qualify for the CL, but not yet at a level whereby we can sustain a CL campaign and qualify for it again the following season - if we somehow manage that this season we'll have massively over-achieved - even more so when you consider the shenanigans of the transfer window in the summer. Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool & Man City are at a different level to us at the moment and the next milestone has to be getting to that level. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 26306 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 8 minutes ago, Gemmill said: We're miles away from having a squad that should be able to compete with the top 4 on a regular basis. That's why there's inconsistency. But because of what he's achieved in such a ridiculously short space of time, we're judging him by top 4 standards and "why can't we just be at our best and a total fucking juggernaut all of the time?" Look at the money Liverpool, Chelsea, and Man City have spent, and even they can't maintain those standards a lot of the time. true. he is a victim of his own success because and success drives expectation. the majority of fans appreciate this and back howe even when things look sticky, though there are some notable fuckwits in our online support (present company excepted). but i dunno if the short space of time argument will hold for that much longer with the owners. they might forgive failing to finish in the top 7 if we do well in the cups and finish top half. i'm not sure they'll entertain a lower mid-table finish and a continuation of our current away form. it would be incredibly harsh on howe but that's football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 26306 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 3 minutes ago, Craig said: Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool & Man City are at a different level to us at the moment and the next milestone has to be getting to that level. we could always cheat like chelsea. the new financial rules do exactly the same job as psr. the system is rigged so why not try harder to bend the rules? the saudis have played incredibly nice to date. they bulldozed their way to success in other sports. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 12320 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 2 minutes ago, Dr Gloom said: we could always cheat like chelsea. the new financial rules do exactly the same job as psr. the system is rigged so why not try harder to bend the rules? the saudis have played incredibly nice to date. they bulldozed their way to success in other sports. Problem with that approach, no matter how much I would like success as early as possible, is those outside of our circle will go to town on pointing out we've only got there because we've bulldozed our way in. To date, I'm managed to shut-down many a conversation about us getting where we are because of the investment by pointing out we're still considerably behind the curve on spending - something they reluctantly have to accept. Patience on this one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meenzer 17978 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 I know that's the rationally correct position, but if we'd won in 95/96 then it'd be hard to argue we didn't spend our way to that title, and I reckon we'd all be OK with defending that against whatever the occasional pub bore has to say. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 62969 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 (edited) If we ever get there it'll be because we've spent our way there. That's just how it works, and that's fine. You can shave some of that off by good management making good decisions, but it'll still come from spending a lot of money. Edited November 28 by Gemmill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 12320 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 Aye, but let's stay within the rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gloom 26306 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 At the very least the new commercial bloke should test the limit of “Fair Market Value” in a way some of the deals done so far have failed to do 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christmas Tree 6685 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 Hope a poor finish this season doesn’t see him off as it was very predictable how this would play out. With regards to players like Tonali, Tino etc, they are just going to follow the money and no CL football etc will change that. What the higher ups need to do is concentrate on the cream of young players (urgh) and sourcing more players like Malik. Give the guy the proper tools and watch him go! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobos 388 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 3 hours ago, Craig said: Aye this is spot on. We're victims of being miles ahead of where we should be. Ourselves and Villa are in similar positions in that we have what it takes to qualify for the CL, but not yet at a level whereby we can sustain a CL campaign and qualify for it again the following season - if we somehow manage that this season we'll have massively over-achieved - even more so when you consider the shenanigans of the transfer window in the summer. Chelsea, Arsenal, Liverpool & Man City are at a different level to us at the moment and the next milestone has to be getting to that level. Agree on this - Villa are our proper rivals imo - we started our projects at the same time and went for the same managers - I think we've done better than Villa on points and game performances tbh - but I do think they've done better on squad depth, we've got superstars they'd love to have - but they seem to have a much more resilient squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoHelpMeGod 241 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 At the very least, our current owners have made all of our dreams of winning the league a genuine possibility, even if it is a very small one right now. I would like to think that we will do it one day. I would also like to think that Eddie will be the manager who takes us there. Pure fairytale stuff, but it's nice to dream. As for FFP / PSR / whatever the fuck - I really hate the "rules" and the way they work. If there was a way to bend the rules, win some trophies and not be punished, docked points etc, I'd absolutely want the club to do it. Appreciate that others would rather play by the book or be cautious, totally understand. But for me, we've waited so long for any success, we've finally had some, and I want us to keep having it. The cup final this year was one of the best days of my life and I'm sure you can all say the same. Spend the money, win the trophies, bring in some superstars to play in black and white. We'd all love that. Doesn't matter what anyone else says about us anyway. Life's too short. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toonotl 4656 Posted November 28 Share Posted November 28 I'd also like us to bend the rules and stop playing it with kid gloves. Getting to the top will not earn us any sort of moral plaudits from others. Other club's supporters will say what they say regardless of how its done so who cares. As Son House put it: Don't you mind people grinning in your face. As an Australian, I find the English psychological obsession with the morality of sport to be incredible. Sport is for winning. Moral victories are claimed and clung to by losers and Mike Atherton has a pocket full of dirt for anyone who says otherwise. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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