FAO Leazes Mag

[ewerk 26574]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

At least you can laugh at yourself.

 

So you are disputing the fact that we have overtaken many major clubs who were ahead of us, and have qualified for europe more than them in the last decade ?

 

Please supply the evidence this is not the case, if for some strange reason you happen not to believe it.

 

Coming on a night when we have qualified for the next round of a european competition, when many other clubs with "superior" boards - in your opinion - are not even in europe at all, your timing could not be better.

 

By overtaken do you mean going from 3rd, 6th, 2nd and 2nd to finishing in the bottom half in 5 of the next 9 season? Hardly a sign of progress is it?

[Gemmill 34923]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

86 actually. Remember we're joint 5th with Aston Villa. Which puts Shepherd on a par with Doug Ellis, something which you are studiously avoiding having to own up to by refusing to set foot in that thread where your silly 5th best on average argument was pulled to bits.

 

no. Joint 5th between 1998 and 2005. I thought you did figures ?????

 

As I explained, Ellis took control of Villa when they had won the League and European Cup. Now they are where exactly, and how well have they done in the 26 - TWENTY SIX - years since exactly ?

 

In answer to the first question - as unlike others I don;t delibrately ignore questions - I have never said at any time that Doug Ellis was the only chairman of any club worse than ours, in fact I have named numerous clubs without hardly drawing breath. Of course, these posts are based on fact, not fiction. Like others do.

 

My "silly" 5th best is a fact. You show me where we aren't the 5th best ? And tell me the clubs that have qualified for europe more than us over the last decade, other than the top 4 ?

 

PS. In answer to the first post, you are being a bit presumptious. What gives you any reason to presume this Yank is going to be better than even Ellis ?

 

He might be a right wanker. And he has made his first mistake already IMO, by offering O'Neill a 6 year contract. I wouldn't do that with any manager, bar perhaps Wenger. I would have offered it to Ferguson, but not now because of his age. I would like to see your reaction if Newcastle offered a manager a 6 year contract, based on an obscure track record, like O'Neill has which is no different to that of Souness.

 

Just think of the bother we would have had getting rid of Dalglish, with a track record that pissed all over O'Neill....although "we can't attract big name successful managers".........

 

Re your Ellis took over Villa blah blah blah. Shepherd took over Newcastle when they were arguably the second best side in the country. We now can't even finish in the top 6, are a PR disaster, are synonymous with unprofessionalism and have finished outside of the top 10 on a few occasions too. Now that's what I call progress.

 

None of what you've written above takes away from the fact that you've consistently scoffed at people telling them they would perhaps prefer Doug Ellis, and then you've gone on to prove that Doug Ellis has performed exactly the same as Freddy Shepherd. How Villa were when Ellis took over is irrelevant, it's his performance alongside Shepherd during the Premiership years that we're looking at.

 

Your argument is in tatters, and Freddy Shepherd is still a shit chairman.

 

As for Lerner offering O'Neill a 6 year contract - would he be better taking the Freddy Shepherd approach and giving his manager rolling one year contracts, and then announcing at the beginning of a season that he won't be renewing it? Lerner is planning long term, hence the long contract - if a bigger club comes in for O'Neill it will cost them a fortune to prise him away, something which is a distinct possibility and which Lerner has intelligently protected himself against. Long term planning is a concept that is completely alien to Shepherd who prefers the fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants approach to running a business.

[Toonpack 6932]

I would still argue though that when comparing chairmen you have to take other things into account than just league placings.

 

Take Wigan for example, 30 years ago they werent even a professional club, Dave Whelan took over and now look at them. Are you seriously saying that just because under Fred we've been in Europe a few times then FF's better?

 

Boro, never won nowt, in 3rd division then along comes Gibson and they're in a UEFA final, able to employ future England managers and more importantly able to attract players over us.

 

You have to take a load of things into account when comparing chairmen, the biggest one being where the club was when they took over compared to where they are now, we are not in as good a position therefore Freds took us backwards.

 

 

Exactly

 

I would only modify "Freds took us backwards" to Fred's TAKING us backwards at an alrming rate

Edited September 29, 2006 by Toonpack

[curry stained pilchard 0]

I would still argue though that when comparing chairmen you have to take other things into account than just league placings.

 

Take Wigan for example, 30 years ago they werent even a professional club, Dave Whelan took over and now look at them. Are you seriously saying that just because under Fred we've been in Europe a few times then FF's better?

 

Boro, never won nowt, in 3rd division then along comes Gibson and they're in a UEFA final, able to employ future England managers and more importantly able to attract players over us.

 

You have to take a load of things into account when comparing chairmen, the biggest one being where the club was when they took over compared to where they are now, we are not in as good a position therefore Freds took us backwards.

I was going to try and add something to this, but reading back over it, it hits the nail squarely on the button...

[ewerk 26574]

I believe LM epitomises all that is wrong with our club at board level. He's busy looking down and saying "well things could be worse" while most of us are looking up and asking what we are doing wrong and how we can improve things.

 

The former attitude has got us where we are now, happy to tread water and hope for a top 6 finish when a club our size should be planning a way to break into the top 4.

[Renton 17875]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

86 actually. Remember we're joint 5th with Aston Villa. Which puts Shepherd on a par with Doug Ellis, something which you are studiously avoiding having to own up to by refusing to set foot in that thread where your silly 5th best on average argument was pulled to bits.

 

no. Joint 5th between 1998 and 2005. I thought you did figures ?????

 

As I explained, Ellis took control of Villa when they had won the League and European Cup. Now they are where exactly, and how well have they done in the 26 - TWENTY SIX - years since exactly ?

 

In answer to the first question - as unlike others I don;t delibrately ignore questions - I have never said at any time that Doug Ellis was the only chairman of any club worse than ours, in fact I have named numerous clubs without hardly drawing breath. Of course, these posts are based on fact, not fiction. Like others do.

 

My "silly" 5th best is a fact. You show me where we aren't the 5th best ? And tell me the clubs that have qualified for europe more than us over the last decade, other than the top 4 ?

 

PS. In answer to the first post, you are being a bit presumptious. What gives you any reason to presume this Yank is going to be better than even Ellis ?

 

He might be a right wanker. And he has made his first mistake already IMO, by offering O'Neill a 6 year contract. I wouldn't do that with any manager, bar perhaps Wenger. I would have offered it to Ferguson, but not now because of his age. I would like to see your reaction if Newcastle offered a manager a 6 year contract, based on an obscure track record, like O'Neill has which is no different to that of Souness.

 

Just think of the bother we would have had getting rid of Dalglish, with a track record that pissed all over O'Neill....although "we can't attract big name successful managers".........

 

Re your Ellis took over Villa blah blah blah. Shepherd took over Newcastle when they were arguably the second best side in the country. We now can't even finish in the top 6, are a PR disaster, are synonymous with unprofessionalism and have finished outside of the top 10 on a few occasions too. Now that's what I call progress.

 

None of what you've written above takes away from the fact that you've consistently scoffed at people telling them they would perhaps prefer Doug Ellis, and then you've gone on to prove that Doug Ellis has performed exactly the same as Freddy Shepherd. How Villa were when Ellis took over is irrelevant, it's his performance alongside Shepherd during the Premiership years that we're looking at.

 

Your argument is in tatters, and Freddy Shepherd is still a shit chairman.

 

As for Lerner offering O'Neill a 6 year contract - would he be better taking the Freddy Shepherd approach and giving his manager rolling one year contracts, and then announcing at the beginning of a season that he won't be renewing it? Lerner is planning long term, hence the long contract - if a bigger club comes in for O'Neill it will cost them a fortune to prise him away, something which is a distinct possibility and which Lerner has intelligently protected himself against. Long term planning is a concept that is completely alien to Shepherd who prefers the fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants approach to running a business.

 

Agree with this. Leazes Mag suggesting that O'Neill and Souness are equivalent is also laughable, as will soon become apparent. Also, Villa did not have to compensate any club for O'Neill. Contrast this with Shepherd, who publically announces Robson will not get his contract renewed, sacks him without a replacement lined up, panicks and, to the relief of Blackburn, buy out Souness's contract, give him a very generous 2 year, rolling deal package, and give the fuckwit £50 million to waste on the likes of Boumsong and Luque! I mean for FFS, how anyone cannot see what an incompetent bafoon our chairman is is beyond me. Anyway, the proof is in the pudding, we will see where we end up this season relative to all those other clubs ran by terrible chairmen soon enough.

[Dr Gloom 19879]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

86 actually. Remember we're joint 5th with Aston Villa. Which puts Shepherd on a par with Doug Ellis, something which you are studiously avoiding having to own up to by refusing to set foot in that thread where your silly 5th best on average argument was pulled to bits.

 

no. Joint 5th between 1998 and 2005. I thought you did figures ?????

 

As I explained, Ellis took control of Villa when they had won the League and European Cup. Now they are where exactly, and how well have they done in the 26 - TWENTY SIX - years since exactly ?

 

In answer to the first question - as unlike others I don;t delibrately ignore questions - I have never said at any time that Doug Ellis was the only chairman of any club worse than ours, in fact I have named numerous clubs without hardly drawing breath. Of course, these posts are based on fact, not fiction. Like others do.

 

My "silly" 5th best is a fact. You show me where we aren't the 5th best ? And tell me the clubs that have qualified for europe more than us over the last decade, other than the top 4 ?

 

PS. In answer to the first post, you are being a bit presumptious. What gives you any reason to presume this Yank is going to be better than even Ellis ?

 

He might be a right wanker. And he has made his first mistake already IMO, by offering O'Neill a 6 year contract. I wouldn't do that with any manager, bar perhaps Wenger. I would have offered it to Ferguson, but not now because of his age. I would like to see your reaction if Newcastle offered a manager a 6 year contract, based on an obscure track record, like O'Neill has which is no different to that of Souness.

 

Just think of the bother we would have had getting rid of Dalglish, with a track record that pissed all over O'Neill....although "we can't attract big name successful managers".........

 

Re your Ellis took over Villa blah blah blah. Shepherd took over Newcastle when they were arguably the second best side in the country. We now can't even finish in the top 6, are a PR disaster, are synonymous with unprofessionalism and have finished outside of the top 10 on a few occasions too. Now that's what I call progress.

 

None of what you've written above takes away from the fact that you've consistently scoffed at people telling them they would perhaps prefer Doug Ellis, and then you've gone on to prove that Doug Ellis has performed exactly the same as Freddy Shepherd. How Villa were when Ellis took over is irrelevant, it's his performance alongside Shepherd during the Premiership years that we're looking at.

 

Your argument is in tatters, and Freddy Shepherd is still a shit chairman.

 

As for Lerner offering O'Neill a 6 year contract - would he be better taking the Freddy Shepherd approach and giving his manager rolling one year contracts, and then announcing at the beginning of a season that he won't be renewing it? Lerner is planning long term, hence the long contract - if a bigger club comes in for O'Neill it will cost them a fortune to prise him away, something which is a distinct possibility and which Lerner has intelligently protected himself against. Long term planning is a concept that is completely alien to Shepherd who prefers the fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants approach to running a business.

 

[LeazesMag 0]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

At least you can laugh at yourself.

 

So you are disputing the fact that we have overtaken many major clubs who were ahead of us, and have qualified for europe more than them in the last decade ?

 

Please supply the evidence this is not the case, if for some strange reason you happen not to believe it.

 

Coming on a night when we have qualified for the next round of a european competition, when many other clubs with "superior" boards - in your opinion - are not even in europe at all, your timing could not be better.

 

By overtaken do you mean going from 3rd, 6th, 2nd and 2nd to finishing in the bottom half in 5 of the next 9 season? Hardly a sign of progress is it?

 

No. As I have explained before, the board as a whole since 1992 has done this, where Fred was a major part of that board, but not chairman. Since taking over as chairman, we have consolidated our place among the top clubs, consitently qualifying more for europe than every other bar 4, which is on its own merits unless of course you think we have a divine right to always finish 2nd. Which if you do, you will also not deny that, by that criteria, Arsenal, Manu have both gone backwards since they both last the last league title and in Manures, case, the European Cup ?

Edited September 30, 2006 by LeazesMag

[LeazesMag 0]

I would still argue though that when comparing chairmen you have to take other things into account than just league placings.

 

Take Wigan for example, 30 years ago they werent even a professional club, Dave Whelan took over and now look at them. Are you seriously saying that just because under Fred we've been in Europe a few times then FF's better?

 

Boro, never won nowt, in 3rd division then along comes Gibson and they're in a UEFA final, able to employ future England managers and more importantly able to attract players over us.

 

You have to take a load of things into account when comparing chairmen, the biggest one being where the club was when they took over compared to where they are now, we are not in as good a position therefore Freds took us backwards.

 

I don't deny this. However Dave Whelan, good as has been for Wigan, would be in a totally different situation with different demands and expecatations if he were to take over as chairman of us, Man City or another big club, so you simply can't say for certain what he would be like.

[LeazesMag 0]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

86 actually. Remember we're joint 5th with Aston Villa. Which puts Shepherd on a par with Doug Ellis, something which you are studiously avoiding having to own up to by refusing to set foot in that thread where your silly 5th best on average argument was pulled to bits.

 

no. Joint 5th between 1998 and 2005. I thought you did figures ?????

 

As I explained, Ellis took control of Villa when they had won the League and European Cup. Now they are where exactly, and how well have they done in the 26 - TWENTY SIX - years since exactly ?

 

In answer to the first question - as unlike others I don;t delibrately ignore questions - I have never said at any time that Doug Ellis was the only chairman of any club worse than ours, in fact I have named numerous clubs without hardly drawing breath. Of course, these posts are based on fact, not fiction. Like others do.

 

My "silly" 5th best is a fact. You show me where we aren't the 5th best ? And tell me the clubs that have qualified for europe more than us over the last decade, other than the top 4 ?

 

PS. In answer to the first post, you are being a bit presumptious. What gives you any reason to presume this Yank is going to be better than even Ellis ?

 

He might be a right wanker. And he has made his first mistake already IMO, by offering O'Neill a 6 year contract. I wouldn't do that with any manager, bar perhaps Wenger. I would have offered it to Ferguson, but not now because of his age. I would like to see your reaction if Newcastle offered a manager a 6 year contract, based on an obscure track record, like O'Neill has which is no different to that of Souness.

 

Just think of the bother we would have had getting rid of Dalglish, with a track record that pissed all over O'Neill....although "we can't attract big name successful managers".........

 

Re your Ellis took over Villa blah blah blah. Shepherd took over Newcastle when they were arguably the second best side in the country. We now can't even finish in the top 6, are a PR disaster, are synonymous with unprofessionalism and have finished outside of the top 10 on a few occasions too. Now that's what I call progress.

 

None of what you've written above takes away from the fact that you've consistently scoffed at people telling them they would perhaps prefer Doug Ellis, and then you've gone on to prove that Doug Ellis has performed exactly the same as Freddy Shepherd. How Villa were when Ellis took over is irrelevant, it's his performance alongside Shepherd during the Premiership years that we're looking at.

 

Your argument is in tatters, and Freddy Shepherd is still a shit chairman.

 

As for Lerner offering O'Neill a 6 year contract - would he be better taking the Freddy Shepherd approach and giving his manager rolling one year contracts, and then announcing at the beginning of a season that he won't be renewing it? Lerner is planning long term, hence the long contract - if a bigger club comes in for O'Neill it will cost them a fortune to prise him away, something which is a distinct possibility and which Lerner has intelligently protected himself against. Long term planning is a concept that is completely alien to Shepherd who prefers the fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants approach to running a business.

 

 

So you can't answer the facts I quoted that show you up for just being a whinging arsehole taking crap ?

[LeazesMag 0]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

86 actually. Remember we're joint 5th with Aston Villa. Which puts Shepherd on a par with Doug Ellis, something which you are studiously avoiding having to own up to by refusing to set foot in that thread where your silly 5th best on average argument was pulled to bits.

 

no. Joint 5th between 1998 and 2005. I thought you did figures ?????

 

As I explained, Ellis took control of Villa when they had won the League and European Cup. Now they are where exactly, and how well have they done in the 26 - TWENTY SIX - years since exactly ?

 

In answer to the first question - as unlike others I don;t delibrately ignore questions - I have never said at any time that Doug Ellis was the only chairman of any club worse than ours, in fact I have named numerous clubs without hardly drawing breath. Of course, these posts are based on fact, not fiction. Like others do.

 

My "silly" 5th best is a fact. You show me where we aren't the 5th best ? And tell me the clubs that have qualified for europe more than us over the last decade, other than the top 4 ?

 

PS. In answer to the first post, you are being a bit presumptious. What gives you any reason to presume this Yank is going to be better than even Ellis ?

 

He might be a right wanker. And he has made his first mistake already IMO, by offering O'Neill a 6 year contract. I wouldn't do that with any manager, bar perhaps Wenger. I would have offered it to Ferguson, but not now because of his age. I would like to see your reaction if Newcastle offered a manager a 6 year contract, based on an obscure track record, like O'Neill has which is no different to that of Souness.

 

Just think of the bother we would have had getting rid of Dalglish, with a track record that pissed all over O'Neill....although "we can't attract big name successful managers".........

 

Re your Ellis took over Villa blah blah blah. Shepherd took over Newcastle when they were arguably the second best side in the country. We now can't even finish in the top 6, are a PR disaster, are synonymous with unprofessionalism and have finished outside of the top 10 on a few occasions too. Now that's what I call progress.

 

None of what you've written above takes away from the fact that you've consistently scoffed at people telling them they would perhaps prefer Doug Ellis, and then you've gone on to prove that Doug Ellis has performed exactly the same as Freddy Shepherd. How Villa were when Ellis took over is irrelevant, it's his performance alongside Shepherd during the Premiership years that we're looking at.

 

Your argument is in tatters, and Freddy Shepherd is still a shit chairman.

 

As for Lerner offering O'Neill a 6 year contract - would he be better taking the Freddy Shepherd approach and giving his manager rolling one year contracts, and then announcing at the beginning of a season that he won't be renewing it? Lerner is planning long term, hence the long contract - if a bigger club comes in for O'Neill it will cost them a fortune to prise him away, something which is a distinct possibility and which Lerner has intelligently protected himself against. Long term planning is a concept that is completely alien to Shepherd who prefers the fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants approach to running a business.

 

Agree with this. Leazes Mag suggesting that O'Neill and Souness are equivalent is also laughable, as will soon become apparent. Also, Villa did not have to compensate any club for O'Neill. Contrast this with Shepherd, who publically announces Robson will not get his contract renewed, sacks him without a replacement lined up, panicks and, to the relief of Blackburn, buy out Souness's contract, give him a very generous 2 year, rolling deal package, and give the fuckwit £50 million to waste on the likes of Boumsong and Luque! I mean for FFS, how anyone cannot see what an incompetent bafoon our chairman is is beyond me. Anyway, the proof is in the pudding, we will see where we end up this season relative to all those other clubs ran by terrible chairmen soon enough.

 

Do you also agree with the fact that, when you talk about Souness, that the same person you say you agree with, actually backed Souness being given 50m quid ....... bit of a contradiction there matey....I'm surprised at someone as smart as yourself making a slip like that .....

 

Still can't refute the facts I have put forward though can you ? Do we have a policy of "always" making shit panic buys or not, as Dan suggests ? If you think so, name them.

 

The point about Souness and O'Neill having similar track records is quite simply that people are basing O'Neills "quality" on his track record, then saying we can't appoint winning managers when we have appointed managers whose track records piss all over O'Neill, most notably Dalglish. You really must do better Renton, I am beginning to think those qualifications of yours must be fake or something ....

 

Not to mention that people on here also told us how good Boumsong and Luque were...so they agreed with Souness .... which says a lot about them and their judgement too wouldn't you agree

[Ted Maul 0]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

86 actually. Remember we're joint 5th with Aston Villa. Which puts Shepherd on a par with Doug Ellis, something which you are studiously avoiding having to own up to by refusing to set foot in that thread where your silly 5th best on average argument was pulled to bits.

 

no. Joint 5th between 1998 and 2005. I thought you did figures ?????

 

As I explained, Ellis took control of Villa when they had won the League and European Cup. Now they are where exactly, and how well have they done in the 26 - TWENTY SIX - years since exactly ?

 

In answer to the first question - as unlike others I don;t delibrately ignore questions - I have never said at any time that Doug Ellis was the only chairman of any club worse than ours, in fact I have named numerous clubs without hardly drawing breath. Of course, these posts are based on fact, not fiction. Like others do.

 

My "silly" 5th best is a fact. You show me where we aren't the 5th best ? And tell me the clubs that have qualified for europe more than us over the last decade, other than the top 4 ?

 

PS. In answer to the first post, you are being a bit presumptious. What gives you any reason to presume this Yank is going to be better than even Ellis ?

 

He might be a right wanker. And he has made his first mistake already IMO, by offering O'Neill a 6 year contract. I wouldn't do that with any manager, bar perhaps Wenger. I would have offered it to Ferguson, but not now because of his age. I would like to see your reaction if Newcastle offered a manager a 6 year contract, based on an obscure track record, like O'Neill has which is no different to that of Souness.

 

Just think of the bother we would have had getting rid of Dalglish, with a track record that pissed all over O'Neill....although "we can't attract big name successful managers".........

 

Re your Ellis took over Villa blah blah blah. Shepherd took over Newcastle when they were arguably the second best side in the country. We now can't even finish in the top 6, are a PR disaster, are synonymous with unprofessionalism and have finished outside of the top 10 on a few occasions too. Now that's what I call progress.

 

None of what you've written above takes away from the fact that you've consistently scoffed at people telling them they would perhaps prefer Doug Ellis, and then you've gone on to prove that Doug Ellis has performed exactly the same as Freddy Shepherd. How Villa were when Ellis took over is irrelevant, it's his performance alongside Shepherd during the Premiership years that we're looking at.

 

Your argument is in tatters, and Freddy Shepherd is still a shit chairman.

 

As for Lerner offering O'Neill a 6 year contract - would he be better taking the Freddy Shepherd approach and giving his manager rolling one year contracts, and then announcing at the beginning of a season that he won't be renewing it? Lerner is planning long term, hence the long contract - if a bigger club comes in for O'Neill it will cost them a fortune to prise him away, something which is a distinct possibility and which Lerner has intelligently protected himself against. Long term planning is a concept that is completely alien to Shepherd who prefers the fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants approach to running a business.

 

 

So you can't answer the facts I quoted that show you up for just being a whinging arsehole taking crap ?

 

I think Gemmill's post blows your 'facts' out of the water tbh. You're talking shite, Leazes.

[LeazesMag 0]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

86 actually. Remember we're joint 5th with Aston Villa. Which puts Shepherd on a par with Doug Ellis, something which you are studiously avoiding having to own up to by refusing to set foot in that thread where your silly 5th best on average argument was pulled to bits.

 

no. Joint 5th between 1998 and 2005. I thought you did figures ?????

 

As I explained, Ellis took control of Villa when they had won the League and European Cup. Now they are where exactly, and how well have they done in the 26 - TWENTY SIX - years since exactly ?

 

In answer to the first question - as unlike others I don;t delibrately ignore questions - I have never said at any time that Doug Ellis was the only chairman of any club worse than ours, in fact I have named numerous clubs without hardly drawing breath. Of course, these posts are based on fact, not fiction. Like others do.

 

My "silly" 5th best is a fact. You show me where we aren't the 5th best ? And tell me the clubs that have qualified for europe more than us over the last decade, other than the top 4 ?

 

PS. In answer to the first post, you are being a bit presumptious. What gives you any reason to presume this Yank is going to be better than even Ellis ?

 

He might be a right wanker. And he has made his first mistake already IMO, by offering O'Neill a 6 year contract. I wouldn't do that with any manager, bar perhaps Wenger. I would have offered it to Ferguson, but not now because of his age. I would like to see your reaction if Newcastle offered a manager a 6 year contract, based on an obscure track record, like O'Neill has which is no different to that of Souness.

 

Just think of the bother we would have had getting rid of Dalglish, with a track record that pissed all over O'Neill....although "we can't attract big name successful managers".........

 

Re your Ellis took over Villa blah blah blah. Shepherd took over Newcastle when they were arguably the second best side in the country. We now can't even finish in the top 6, are a PR disaster, are synonymous with unprofessionalism and have finished outside of the top 10 on a few occasions too. Now that's what I call progress.

 

None of what you've written above takes away from the fact that you've consistently scoffed at people telling them they would perhaps prefer Doug Ellis, and then you've gone on to prove that Doug Ellis has performed exactly the same as Freddy Shepherd. How Villa were when Ellis took over is irrelevant, it's his performance alongside Shepherd during the Premiership years that we're looking at.

 

Your argument is in tatters, and Freddy Shepherd is still a shit chairman.

 

As for Lerner offering O'Neill a 6 year contract - would he be better taking the Freddy Shepherd approach and giving his manager rolling one year contracts, and then announcing at the beginning of a season that he won't be renewing it? Lerner is planning long term, hence the long contract - if a bigger club comes in for O'Neill it will cost them a fortune to prise him away, something which is a distinct possibility and which Lerner has intelligently protected himself against. Long term planning is a concept that is completely alien to Shepherd who prefers the fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants approach to running a business.

 

 

So you can't answer the facts I quoted that show you up for just being a whinging arsehole taking crap ?

 

I think Gemmill's post blows your 'facts' out of the water tbh. You're talking shite, Leazes.

 

I'm not arsed what you think mate. I put up facts. And You can't dispute them. Only 4 clubs have qualified for europe more than us in the last decade.

 

If O'Neill flops, Villa will also have to pay him off. If we appointed a manager on a 6 year contract, people would be up in arms at the stupidity of it. I think long contracts for managers are bollocks because managers fortunes change so quickly, being based on results with a very thin line between success and failure.

 

Ironically, people are saying that Shepherd has taken the club "miles" backwards, yet YOU are now saying the position that Villa were in under Ellis is "on merit" ..... [whereas Shepherds isn't I take it ?]

 

I put up Ellis as a counter argument to show how much in comparison Fred has backed his managers ..... nothing more nothing less, but I shouldn't be surprised that no matter how many times I said it, it appears people didn't read properly .....

 

Gemmil also backed Souness ....

Edited September 30, 2006 by LeazesMag

[ewerk 26574]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

At least you can laugh at yourself.

 

So you are disputing the fact that we have overtaken many major clubs who were ahead of us, and have qualified for europe more than them in the last decade ?

 

Please supply the evidence this is not the case, if for some strange reason you happen not to believe it.

 

Coming on a night when we have qualified for the next round of a european competition, when many other clubs with "superior" boards - in your opinion - are not even in europe at all, your timing could not be better.

 

By overtaken do you mean going from 3rd, 6th, 2nd and 2nd to finishing in the bottom half in 5 of the next 9 season? Hardly a sign of progress is it?

 

No. As I have explained before, the board as a whole since 1992 has done this, where Fred was a major part of that board, but not chairman. Since taking over as chairman, we have consolidated our place among the top clubs, consitently qualifying more for europe than every other bar 4, which is on its own merits unless of course you think we have a divine right to always finish 2nd. Which if you do, you will also not deny that, by that criteria, Arsenal, Manu have both gone backwards since they both last the last league title and in Manures, case, the European Cup ?

 

Firstly I am talking about Shepherd as chairman, not as a board member. The facts are clear, we have been in decline since he became chairman. Now you didn't really address my point, you say we have consolidated our place amongst the top clubs; have we? As I said, out of the past 9 seasons we have finished in the bottom half 5 times! That isn't consolidating our place, that is going backwards. Are you honestly telling me that that is not a decline from the days of SJH?

 

And yes Arsenal and Man U have been in decline over the past two seasons, the facts speak for themselves, unfortunately you can't hear them.

[LeazesMag 0]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

At least you can laugh at yourself.

 

So you are disputing the fact that we have overtaken many major clubs who were ahead of us, and have qualified for europe more than them in the last decade ?

 

Please supply the evidence this is not the case, if for some strange reason you happen not to believe it.

 

Coming on a night when we have qualified for the next round of a european competition, when many other clubs with "superior" boards - in your opinion - are not even in europe at all, your timing could not be better.

 

By overtaken do you mean going from 3rd, 6th, 2nd and 2nd to finishing in the bottom half in 5 of the next 9 season? Hardly a sign of progress is it?

 

No. As I have explained before, the board as a whole since 1992 has done this, where Fred was a major part of that board, but not chairman. Since taking over as chairman, we have consolidated our place among the top clubs, consitently qualifying more for europe than every other bar 4, which is on its own merits unless of course you think we have a divine right to always finish 2nd. Which if you do, you will also not deny that, by that criteria, Arsenal, Manu have both gone backwards since they both last the last league title and in Manures, case, the European Cup ?

 

Firstly I am talking about Shepherd as chairman, not as a board member. The facts are clear, we have been in decline since he became chairman. Now you didn't really address my point, you say we have consolidated our place amongst the top clubs; have we? As I said, out of the past 9 seasons we have finished in the bottom half 5 times! That isn't consolidating our place, that is going backwards. Are you honestly telling me that that is not a decline from the days of SJH?

 

And yes Arsenal and Man U have been in decline over the past two seasons, the facts speak for themselves, unfortunately you can't hear them.

 

Nobody is saying that Shepherd is as good a chairman as SJH. I certainly never have.

 

What I say however, is that we are consolidated as one of the top clubs in the country, and while we haven't done so well on the field that is solely because we have not appointed as good a manager for the club as Keegan was.

 

However - ALL the managers have been backed by the manager every bit as much as Keegan was, so that tells you that the board is continuing to do just as good a job in regard to running the club from a financial aspect, as they did when SJH was chairman.

 

They have also upgraded the stadium and built a brand new training complex. Are these not improvements on the club that SJH left or not ?

 

Lastly....we have had a few low finishes - comparatively. However these positions are still higher than our old "golden eras" under the previous boards over 3 decades, as expectations are higher, proof if any were needed of how much bigger and better the club is, and remains so. This is on merit. The club has also - on the field - finished in the top 5 for 3 consecutive seasons for the first time on over 50 years, this was not achieved with SJH as chairman but Fred. Fact. There is no reason to believe the club would have fared any better under SJH than under Shepherd, as the choice of Keegan was an inspired risk and you simply cannot say he would have chosen better successors to Keegan, as his own successors have done. He may not have done this. And no-one, NO-ONE, can argue with the track record of Dalglish ..... and Bobby Robson too, who both must have been fairly unanimous decisions among all the board and major shareholders to appoint at the time.

 

Although - as I keep pointing out - the Halls are the major shareholders, not Shepherd, so you also can't say that he hasn't had a hand in choosing the managers anyway. They certainly aren't solely the choice of Shepherd, the chairman in any company doesn't do this, he merely has the casting vote if necessary.

 

I suspect that many people are blinded in their view of Shepherd because they don't like him. Well, I;m not keen on him either, but as with Craig Bellamy, its the club I am interested in and whether or not I like someone or approve of what they say in the press, doesn't matter at all. While it is better if they do say the right things, at the end of the day it doesn't effect results on the field so I just don't give a flying fuck.

[ewerk 26574]

What I say however, is that we are consolidated as one of the top clubs in the country

 

We are not one of the top teams in the country, to say we are is laughable. If you asked a selection of supporters of others club if we were one of the "top teams" in the country the majority would say no, the final nail in that coffin came with Sky's dropping of us from their "top" fixtures.

 

 

and while we haven't done so well on the field that is solely because we have not appointed as good a manager for the club as Keegan was.

Although - as I keep pointing out - the Halls are the major shareholders, not Shepherd, so you also can't say that he hasn't had a hand in choosing the managers anyway. They certainly aren't solely the choice of Shepherd, the chairman in any company doesn't do this, he merely has the casting vote if necessary.

 

The appointment of the manager is almost entirely down the the chairman, that is one of his key functions and what he is paid to do. The facts are that apart from Robson, a fairly obvious appointment, he has recruited managers who have done terrible jobs. Now I know you will reply with your "trophy winning managers" line but at the end of the day the chairman shouldn't just be in the job because he owns shares but it should also be because he has the ability to make better decisions than the average fan. Now this is where Freddy fails, yes he has kept us on an even keel financially but footballing wise he has made poor managerial appointments and made transfer decisions without the knowledge of the managers, a capital offence IMO.

 

Lets not forget the timing of his dismissals, I'm sure you'll agree that sacking managers early in the season isn't the ideal situation but something Freddy has been guilty of. Not to ignore his persistence with Souness when it was obvious to every man and his dog that it wasn't going to work out for him here.

 

However - ALL the managers have been backed by the manager every bit as much as Keegan was, so that tells you that the board is continuing to do just as good a job in regard to running the club from a financial aspect, as they did when SJH was chairman.

 

Yes Freddy has done a good job financially but its the fans that enable him to do so. I don't have the facts or figures but it seems to me that we haven't made a huge impact in the lucrative oversea's markets as our rivals have and therefore haven't exploited our potential, in fact merchandising has made up less than 10% of our income.

 

Lastly....we have had a few low finishes - comparatively. However these positions are still higher than our old "golden eras" under the previous boards over 3 decades, as expectations are higher, proof if any were needed of how much bigger and better the club is, and remains so. This is on merit. The club has also - on the field - finished in the top 5 for 3 consecutive seasons for the first time on over 50 years, this was not achieved with SJH as chairman but Fred. Fact.

 

And finally we come to the main point; you're continual comparison with the Mc Keag/ Westwood era. If we continue to judge ourselves with that period we will never progress. I'm looking at it from when SJH left and we were one of the top clubs in the country to "midtable, hoping for Europe fodder" as we are now. Due to my age I may be judged as a "Keegan band wagon jumper" but the way I see it is that as a club we have to keep progressing or we will start regressing. The clubs around us, our rivals, have made strides regarding managers, setups, coaching, scouting and signings whereas we have fallen away and lost ground on them which has made itself clear in our league finishes.

 

Look at our current setup where we have more academy coaches than first team coaches, its farcical. Roeder came into the job promising an overhaul of scouting and the Academy and so far we have seen fuck all, at the end of the day this should be coming from the chairman down but we have yet to see any evidence of any guidance from our chairman.

 

To conclude, I believe that Shepherd is a man incredibly lucky to find himself in charge of a Premier Leage club and doesn't quite know what to do with it. He has made poor managerial appointments, tried to play manager himself at times and ignored all other aspects of the playing side while throwing the fans' money at the problem with little success. You LM may be happy with qualifying for the UEFA Cup most seasons but I personally want something more, I want to see NUFC lift a cup or at least challenge for the league but sadly I can't see this happening until someone with more ambition and foresight takes over at the helm of our club.

[Renton 17875]

Now that Deadly Doug isn't a chairman. WHo is the fat one better than now? And give evidence for your answer.

 

There are 87 examples over the last decade.

 

Shame you are blind to evidence mind .......

 

86 actually. Remember we're joint 5th with Aston Villa. Which puts Shepherd on a par with Doug Ellis, something which you are studiously avoiding having to own up to by refusing to set foot in that thread where your silly 5th best on average argument was pulled to bits.

 

no. Joint 5th between 1998 and 2005. I thought you did figures ?????

 

As I explained, Ellis took control of Villa when they had won the League and European Cup. Now they are where exactly, and how well have they done in the 26 - TWENTY SIX - years since exactly ?

 

In answer to the first question - as unlike others I don;t delibrately ignore questions - I have never said at any time that Doug Ellis was the only chairman of any club worse than ours, in fact I have named numerous clubs without hardly drawing breath. Of course, these posts are based on fact, not fiction. Like others do.

 

My "silly" 5th best is a fact. You show me where we aren't the 5th best ? And tell me the clubs that have qualified for europe more than us over the last decade, other than the top 4 ?

 

PS. In answer to the first post, you are being a bit presumptious. What gives you any reason to presume this Yank is going to be better than even Ellis ?

 

He might be a right wanker. And he has made his first mistake already IMO, by offering O'Neill a 6 year contract. I wouldn't do that with any manager, bar perhaps Wenger. I would have offered it to Ferguson, but not now because of his age. I would like to see your reaction if Newcastle offered a manager a 6 year contract, based on an obscure track record, like O'Neill has which is no different to that of Souness.

 

Just think of the bother we would have had getting rid of Dalglish, with a track record that pissed all over O'Neill....although "we can't attract big name successful managers".........

 

Re your Ellis took over Villa blah blah blah. Shepherd took over Newcastle when they were arguably the second best side in the country. We now can't even finish in the top 6, are a PR disaster, are synonymous with unprofessionalism and have finished outside of the top 10 on a few occasions too. Now that's what I call progress.

 

None of what you've written above takes away from the fact that you've consistently scoffed at people telling them they would perhaps prefer Doug Ellis, and then you've gone on to prove that Doug Ellis has performed exactly the same as Freddy Shepherd. How Villa were when Ellis took over is irrelevant, it's his performance alongside Shepherd during the Premiership years that we're looking at.

 

Your argument is in tatters, and Freddy Shepherd is still a shit chairman.

 

As for Lerner offering O'Neill a 6 year contract - would he be better taking the Freddy Shepherd approach and giving his manager rolling one year contracts, and then announcing at the beginning of a season that he won't be renewing it? Lerner is planning long term, hence the long contract - if a bigger club comes in for O'Neill it will cost them a fortune to prise him away, something which is a distinct possibility and which Lerner has intelligently protected himself against. Long term planning is a concept that is completely alien to Shepherd who prefers the fly-by-the-seat-of-your-pants approach to running a business.

 

Agree with this. Leazes Mag suggesting that O'Neill and Souness are equivalent is also laughable, as will soon become apparent. Also, Villa did not have to compensate any club for O'Neill. Contrast this with Shepherd, who publically announces Robson will not get his contract renewed, sacks him without a replacement lined up, panicks and, to the relief of Blackburn, buy out Souness's contract, give him a very generous 2 year, rolling deal package, and give the fuckwit £50 million to waste on the likes of Boumsong and Luque! I mean for FFS, how anyone cannot see what an incompetent bafoon our chairman is is beyond me. Anyway, the proof is in the pudding, we will see where we end up this season relative to all those other clubs ran by terrible chairmen soon enough.

 

Do you also agree with the fact that, when you talk about Souness, that the same person you say you agree with, actually backed Souness being given 50m quid ....... bit of a contradiction there matey....I'm surprised at someone as smart as yourself making a slip like that .....

 

Still can't refute the facts I have put forward though can you ? Do we have a policy of "always" making shit panic buys or not, as Dan suggests ? If you think so, name them.

 

The point about Souness and O'Neill having similar track records is quite simply that people are basing O'Neills "quality" on his track record, then saying we can't appoint winning managers when we have appointed managers whose track records piss all over O'Neill, most notably Dalglish. You really must do better Renton, I am beginning to think those qualifications of yours must be fake or something ....

 

Not to mention that people on here also told us how good Boumsong and Luque were...so they agreed with Souness .... which says a lot about them and their judgement too wouldn't you agree

 

I agree with what Gemmill said in this post, not what he said last year, there is no contradiction. This is typical of the way you conduct your arguments, you think because someone has said previously something which was wrong that means everything else they say is wrong. Wrong! As even you admit, everyone makes mistakes, even your beloved Shepherd. And once and for all, you do know that Gemmll is not in a position of authority at Newcastle, don't you, because from your posts its not very clear. What does it matter if people thought Luque or Boumsong were any good (not me btw)? The only people who mattered and had access to the scouting reports and videos were the chirman and the man HE had appointed - Souness. It wasn't toontastic's or N-O's fault ffs!

 

I never mentioned anything about panic buys either, though top marks for using the old straw man tactic as usual.

 

My point was that I think it is hugely ironic that you criticise Ellis (the chairman you say is rubbish but turns out to be as good as Shepherd using your own criteria, it wasn't Lerner iirc) for giving one of the most sought after, up and coming UK managers in the game (this is the truth no matter what ridiculous comparisons you want to make with Souness) a long-term contract, considering what Shepherd did during the Robson/Souness fiasco! Answer me honestly, who do you think made the worst respective decisions? Now, I assume you think Shepherd's decision was better, and this I find interesting, because in 2 or 3 years it will prove once and for all to me at least you are talking out your arse in your support for him. Answer so I can bookmark the thread please.

[Gemmill 34923]

Further info on Shepherd v Ellis for Leazes to ponder over. Shepherd took over as chairman of Newcastle in December 96, I believe. What follows is the name of the club that has finished highest in each of the full Premiership seasons since that time:

 

1997/98: Aston Villa

1998/99: Aston Villa

1999/00: Aston Villa

2000/01: Aston Villa

2001/02: Newcastle

2002/03: Newcastle

2003/04: Newcastle

2004/05: Aston Villa

2005/06: Newcastle

 

So it looks to me like in the 9 seasons that Shepherd has been Chairman, Doug Ellis has outperformed him in the Premiership (5 times they have finished higher than us) - Villa have actually been by far the more consistent club as well, without the swings from highs to lows that Newcastle have experienced. This is the same Doug Ellis that Leazes likes to point at and say "Are you telling me you'd prefer HIM?"

 

Falling apart at the seams tbh.

 

Cheers to Mick on N-O for the tip-off on this btw.

[ewerk 26574]

Further info on Shepherd v Ellis for Leazes to ponder over. Shepherd took over as chairman of Newcastle in December 96, I believe. What follows is the name of the club that has finished highest in each of the full Premiership seasons since that time:

 

1997/98: Aston Villa

1998/99: Aston Villa

1999/00: Aston Villa

2000/01: Aston Villa

2001/02: Newcastle

2002/03: Newcastle

2003/04: Newcastle

2004/05: Aston Villa

2005/06: Newcastle

 

So it looks to me like in the 9 seasons that Shepherd has been Chairman, Doug Ellis has outperformed him in the Premiership (5 times they have finished higher than us) - Villa have actually been by far the more consistent club as well, without the swings from highs to lows that Newcastle have experienced. This is the same Doug Ellis that Leazes likes to point at and say "Are you telling me you'd prefer HIM?"

 

Falling apart at the seams tbh.

 

Cheers to Mick on N-O for the tip-off on this btw.

 

And lets not forget that Villa have actually won something since Shepherd took over.

[Renton 17875]

Further info on Shepherd v Ellis for Leazes to ponder over. Shepherd took over as chairman of Newcastle in December 96, I believe. What follows is the name of the club that has finished highest in each of the full Premiership seasons since that time:

 

1997/98: Aston Villa

1998/99: Aston Villa

1999/00: Aston Villa

2000/01: Aston Villa

2001/02: Newcastle

2002/03: Newcastle

2003/04: Newcastle

2004/05: Aston Villa

2005/06: Newcastle

 

So it looks to me like in the 9 seasons that Shepherd has been Chairman, Doug Ellis has outperformed him in the Premiership (5 times they have finished higher than us) - Villa have actually been by far the more consistent club as well, without the swings from highs to lows that Newcastle have experienced. This is the same Doug Ellis that Leazes likes to point at and say "Are you telling me you'd prefer HIM?"

 

Falling apart at the seams tbh.

 

Cheers to Mick on N-O for the tip-off on this btw.

 

[Renton 17875]

Mind you, it has to be pointed out Villa did disastrously last year, flirting with relegation. How's the chairman reacted to this again?

[Dr Gloom 19879]

Mind you, it has to be pointed out Villa did disastrously last year, flirting with relegation. How's the chairman reacted to this again?

 

sadly, i can't see the fat twat following ellis and doing the honourable thing by walking. he loves the limelight too much. belgravia are going to have to offer way over the odds for him even to consider it imo

[adios 717]

Any truth in the rumour that arguing with Leazes is to be introduced as an official sport at the next Special Olympics?

[LeazesMag 0]

What I say however, is that we are consolidated as one of the top clubs in the country

 

We are not one of the top teams in the country, to say we are is laughable. If you asked a selection of supporters of others club if we were one of the "top teams" in the country the majority would say no, the final nail in that coffin came with Sky's dropping of us from their "top" fixtures.

 

and while we haven't done so well on the field that is solely because we have not appointed as good a manager for the club as Keegan was.

Although - as I keep pointing out - the Halls are the major shareholders, not Shepherd, so you also can't say that he hasn't had a hand in choosing the managers anyway. They certainly aren't solely the choice of Shepherd, the chairman in any company doesn't do this, he merely has the casting vote if necessary.

 

The appointment of the manager is almost entirely down the the chairman, that is one of his key functions and what he is paid to do. The facts are that apart from Robson, a fairly obvious appointment, he has recruited managers who have done terrible jobs. Now I know you will reply with your "trophy winning managers" line but at the end of the day the chairman shouldn't just be in the job because he owns shares but it should also be because he has the ability to make better decisions than the average fan. Now this is where Freddy fails, yes he has kept us on an even keel financially but footballing wise he has made poor managerial appointments and made transfer decisions without the knowledge of the managers, a capital offence IMO.

 

Lets not forget the timing of his dismissals, I'm sure you'll agree that sacking managers early in the season isn't the ideal situation but something Freddy has been guilty of. Not to ignore his persistence with Souness when it was obvious to every man and his dog that it wasn't going to work out for him here.

 

However - ALL the managers have been backed by the manager every bit as much as Keegan was, so that tells you that the board is continuing to do just as good a job in regard to running the club from a financial aspect, as they did when SJH was chairman.

 

Yes Freddy has done a good job financially but its the fans that enable him to do so. I don't have the facts or figures but it seems to me that we haven't made a huge impact in the lucrative oversea's markets as our rivals have and therefore haven't exploited our potential, in fact merchandising has made up less than 10% of our income.

 

Lastly....we have had a few low finishes - comparatively. However these positions are still higher than our old "golden eras" under the previous boards over 3 decades, as expectations are higher, proof if any were needed of how much bigger and better the club is, and remains so. This is on merit. The club has also - on the field - finished in the top 5 for 3 consecutive seasons for the first time on over 50 years, this was not achieved with SJH as chairman but Fred. Fact.

 

And finally we come to the main point; you're continual comparison with the Mc Keag/ Westwood era. If we continue to judge ourselves with that period we will never progress. I'm looking at it from when SJH left and we were one of the top clubs in the country to "midtable, hoping for Europe fodder" as we are now. Due to my age I may be judged as a "Keegan band wagon jumper" but the way I see it is that as a club we have to keep progressing or we will start regressing. The clubs around us, our rivals, have made strides regarding managers, setups, coaching, scouting and signings whereas we have fallen away and lost ground on them which has made itself clear in our league finishes.

 

Look at our current setup where we have more academy coaches than first team coaches, its farcical. Roeder came into the job promising an overhaul of scouting and the Academy and so far we have seen fuck all, at the end of the day this should be coming from the chairman down but we have yet to see any evidence of any guidance from our chairman.

 

To conclude, I believe that Shepherd is a man incredibly lucky to find himself in charge of a Premier Leage club and doesn't quite know what to do with it. He has made poor managerial appointments, tried to play manager himself at times and ignored all other aspects of the playing side while throwing the fans' money at the problem with little success. You LM may be happy with qualifying for the UEFA Cup most seasons but I personally want something more, I want to see NUFC lift a cup or at least challenge for the league but sadly I can't see this happening until someone with more ambition and foresight takes over at the helm of our club.

 

Who says I am happy ?

 

For starters.......I tbink NUFC should be, and could eclipse manu for support if we were truly successful, the Keegan era showed this. And we wouldn't need day trippers from every poxy little village in Cornwall to fill the stadium, half the city of newcastle would want to be in that ground if we won trophies.

 

So, to that extent, I think not going ahead with a new stadium is the clubs biggest mistake it has ever made in my lifetime. After decades, and decades, of attempting to get something done - through a poor board whether you like it or not - they finally almost made the breakthrough. They should have moved the club lock stock and barrel away from SJP to get into this new stadium. Bollocks to tradition, that is how much I want to succeed.

 

My point about Shepherd, is that the club has been in the position before whereby they had good foundations to build on and they were wasted within moments by people who didn't have the desire or the courage to go further. On both those counts, he has at least attempted to take the club further and succeeded in consolidating the club appearing in europe regularly. YOu have to give him/them credit for that, as I have said, many many other clubs have also fallen away. I think it is amazing the people who do not understand this. We have not appointed a manager as good as Keegan, and this is the reason why we haven't stayed 2nd top or gone better. Nobody can say that appointing Dalglish wasn't a serious attempt to build on the Keegan legacy, because it most certainly was. As was Gullit and Robson, however Gullit worked out.

 

In my view, the only poor appointment has been Souness, I have never defended that, I have been one of the loudest critics of Souness, I hate the bastard, and think he is a shite manager, I have done since I was working in Scotland when he was manager of Rangers.

 

Regarding the overhaul of the coaching system, what was wrong with it before Souness ? Souness destroyed the system, Roeder has brought in new people, we don't know if they are any good, but he has changed the personnell, isnt' that what he said ? So why are you saying he hasn't ?

 

As we have qualified for europe more than everyone bar 4 clubs in the past decade, that makes us one of the countries top clubs. You simply can't dispute this. As I said, its not top and believe me I want to be the best as much as anyone, I have supported this club through everything - mostly thin years - since 1964 and I was too young to go to Budapest although i saw all 6 of the home games in europe in 1969. I also saw the 1974 and 1976 Finals, and the recent ones. I am 51 - and look young for my age - so I have more reason than most for wanting to win something, even the League Cup, although as a club I have bigger ambitions than just winning the league cup and following it up with nothing, which is why I dismiss posts saying that the smogs, Leicester etc have done better than us just because they have won the League Cup, that is rubbish.

 

I think Newcastle United need to win a trophy, any trophy, because it is a stigma now and needs to be broken. The first cup - even the League Cup - would ease the pressure when we get close in other competitions, witness the amount of times we simply haven't performed when in the closing strait as proof of that. The club has had the quality to win trophies, all the times they have qualified for europe has shown that, so the board has gave all their managers the tools to do the job. The failing [to win a trophy] is with the players when it has really mattered, and the managers in some cases for obviously picking wrong teams, wrong tactics, and failing to prepare them properly.

 

As for Shepherd .... I said this a few weeks to peasepud and one or two others in a different thread....like any other board, they can only survive so many appointments that don't work out. So if roeder fails, and Shearer does too, then that will probably be their time up. But - don't think replacing them with almost anyone will mean improvement, because whoever takes their place could easily, very easily in fact, be worse. They could even be downright shite, like the ones we had before, or Bob Murray or many others.

This is realistic and nothing else.

Edited October 1, 2006 by LeazesMag

[LeazesMag 0]

Mind you, it has to be pointed out Villa did disastrously last year, flirting with relegation. How's the chairman reacted to this again?

 

sadly, i can't see the fat twat following ellis and doing the honourable thing by walking. he loves the limelight too much. belgravia are going to have to offer way over the odds for him even to consider it imo

 

Like I said, if you really want such an organisation to take over the football, it proves your stupidity beyond doubt.