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Just now, Renton said:

 

This is a good point actually, fair enough. I dont think Thatcher Blair comparisons are necessary, but maybe they are. In which case, I think the party is pretty fucked whoever leads it. The enemy isn't Blair, it's the tories  If Labour cant unite behind that, then they're rightly fucked. 

 

The party is indeed fucked.

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2 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

This is a good point actually, fair enough. I dont think Thatcher Blair comparisons are necessary, but maybe they are. In which case, I think the party is pretty fucked whoever leads it. The enemy isn't Blair, it's the tories  If Labour cant unite behind that, then they're rightly fucked. 

I think that yougov poll yesterday had Blair on a 67% unfavorability rating. It's insane but that shows the crowd they're all trying to appeal to. We rightly gave Corbyn pelters for not playing the game so we can't criticise Nandy when she does it.

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If Blair hadn't gone to Iraq, I wonder how different all of this would have been. Labour would have been nowhere near as toxic and perhaps more left wing voters would remember the years fondly. Honestly I see more people go after him over Iraq than anything else.

Edited by Rayvin
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Blair = Iraq.

Brown ="Labour's financial crisis"

 

No tory would have done differently, but to ignore everything else is madness. I was furious with Blair about Iraq as it happens, long before we invaded (as were millions of others). Brown in contrast should be applauded for his actions in the financial crisis, but fuck me, the tories are still dining out on it and will be for at least another decade. 

 

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Whether you think NL were a force for good or not (I actually think generally they were), there can be no argument that they incorporated facets of Thatcherism. 

 

I think the discussion should be more about the point of stating it - if its to gain kudos with the young zealots in the membership by framing it negatively then I thinks its just playing for votes and dubious, if it's to take the position that a government has to play the establishment game in this country to do anything then its fairly practical (but sad). 

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Has anyone got any evidence re Starmer being a “centrist”.

Its being constantly banded about by the RLB Firms Top crew, but I just don’t know where people are getting it from?

 

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36 minutes ago, Tom said:

Has anyone got any evidence re Starmer being a “centrist”.

Its being constantly banded about by the RLB Firms Top crew, but I just don’t know where people are getting it from?

 

 

Voted for the Tory austerity welfare bill or whatever it was called. The dismal, pathetic Labour betrayal that prompted me to vote for Corbyn.

 

But mostly it's all relative, isn't it? The spectrum changes. In the US he'd be considered a radical. Although i daresay in the US, he would position himself pragmatically.

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8 hours ago, ewerk said:

In the U.S. we’d all be considered radical by virtue of the fact that none of us want to shoot all the poor people. For fun

Fyp 

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On 22/01/2020 at 12:11, Rayvin said:

If Blair hadn't gone to Iraq, I wonder how different all of this would have been. Labour would have been nowhere near as toxic and perhaps more left wing voters would remember the years fondly. Honestly I see more people go after him over Iraq than anything else.

 

I think they massively fucked up when they chose the wrong Miliband brother.

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