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18 minutes ago, Toonpack said:

 

 

HAhaha , this is either some excellent deliberate sabotage , or she (or "they") have written these resignation letters for them!

 

(or its a photoshop of course)

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11 minutes ago, Renton said:

Loop Trump GIF

 

I thought you ssaid you studied economics? Did you miss the day one learning on normative and positive economics?

Economics is mostly theory actually, mr smarty pants.

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Just now, scoobos said:

Economics is mostly theory actually, mr smarty pants.

 

Not in my experience. I use economic analysis every day to objectively inform my decisions, and these are all based on published or unpublished facts. Water is a molecule composed of hydrogen and oxygen, that is an example of a fact. Herceptin prolongs life in some types of cancer, that is another. If you want to pretend there is no such thing as facts or absolute truth, go ahead. I left that behind in sixth form philosophy. 

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3 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

Not in my experience. I use economic analysis every day to objectively inform my decisions, and these are all based on published or unpublished facts. Water is a molecule composed of hydrogen and oxygen, that is an example of a fact. Herceptin prolongs life in some types of cancer, that is another. If you want to pretend there is no such thing as facts or absolute truth, go ahead. I left that behind in sixth form philosophy. 

Oh dont be pedantic now, we're friends remember. 

I'm talking about facts in politics, this is a politics thread - not that there are no facts in the world. Im not a frickin flat earther or owt.

Edited by scoobos
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14 minutes ago, scoobos said:

Oh dont be pedantic now, we're friends remember. 

I'm talking about facts in politics, this is a politics thread - not that there are no facts in the world. Im not a frickin flat earther or owt.

 

We were talking about political election campaigns. I've already said I have no problems with people having political ideas or theories I don't support. But what I do have a problem with is politicians telling outright lies to gaslight their audience. You seem to think that's fair game, either that or you just don't seem to accept some things are an absolute truth.

 

Take the infamous 350 million on the side of the bus. That was factually untrue for two reason. Firstly, because it didn't represent the true net figure of contributions, but honestly, that was deliberately done in order to obfuscate the much more important point. Which was the money we contributed to the EU was paid back at least ten fold by having access to the single market and many other membership benefits. Should that have been legal? Not in my opinion. Should it have led to the referendum being anulled. Yes, in my opinion. Why was the referendum not anulled? Oh yeah, because it was an advisory referendum even though you yourself have claimed the results should have been binding. And yeah, I'm an angry remoaner, because this is an example of how lies have completely fucked up this country. ANd this is before we even fucking consider Johnson himself.  

Edited by Renton
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16 minutes ago, scoobos said:

Apart from the shooting bit, which is a bit silly and totalitarian again - this is far more sensible than dissalowing anyone a vote and calling it democracy.

 

Just to make totally sure that we're clear on this, I'm not calling for anything to be called democracy. The democracy we are living is a failed system that has been abused and distorted beyond being remotely useful by years of Tory rule and perversion by corporate and dirty money. I don't care if we exit this period one day with or without democracy as it is currently defined.

 

I just want a less devastating system of governance where smart and experienced people are able to make decisions that benefit society. I think that's something that democracy can be but in our case isn't. Maybe something approaching a technocracy, who knows. My contention though, isn't that I want democracy. I just don't want the hell our current system is inflicting on us.

 

And to go back to my original point (waaaay back), I'm in no hurry to reconcile with people who are being weaponised within this system against their own interests due to their propensity to dismiss and reject informed opinion in place of their gut feeling on matters. I'm really ok with that position too - they have failed me, not the other way around. I'm not going cap in hand and asking them to fuck me all over again, I'm just going to stand to the side and criticise their decision making framework and harp on endlessly about the consequences of their choices. That may make them dig their heels in all the more but... if that's true, they really are overgrown toddlers.

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