I assume they're not going to customise the bar in our honour this time marra VS Eddie Howes constantly nackered mags at work

[toonotl 4681]

I might have strayed from the general consensus here but I don't fault Howe's tactics.

 

We could've beaten them one of umpteen different ways and I think that Howe chose to go with the way that conserved the most amount of energy. I can understand that rationale given the amount of important games we have coming up. I blame the players, entirely.

 

It was a tactic designed to nullify their attack and capitalize on their poor press and porous midfield to create chances in attack. We did the first and had ample opportunities to do the second and failed miserably every single time. I can completely concede that, having lost, losing that way looks weak and pathetic like we showed them respect, etc., but I actually think it was the opposite. Yes, we could've won it another way. Yes, in hindsight, we should've done it differently. But I think Howe reasoned, these are so shit that we can play the whole game in second gear, conserve energy for other matches, and hit them on the break since they're too naive to not press us with their dogshit press. He was right. For me, it's the players who let him down shockingly.

[Rayvin 8362]

5 minutes ago, toonotl said:

I might have strayed from the general consensus here but I don't fault Howe's tactics.

 

We could've beaten them one of umpteen different ways and I think that Howe chose to go with the way that conserved the most amount of energy. I can understand that rationale given the amount of important games we have coming up. I blame the players, entirely.

 

It was a tactic designed to nullify their attack and capitalize on their poor press and porous midfield to create chances in attack. We did the first and had ample opportunities to do the second and failed miserably every single time. I can completely concede that, having lost, losing that way looks weak and pathetic like we showed them respect, etc., but I actually think it was the opposite. Yes, we could've won it another way. Yes, in hindsight, we should've done it differently. But I think Howe reasoned, these are so shit that we can play the whole game in second gear, conserve energy for other matches, and hit them on the break since they're too naive to not press us with their dogshit press. He was right. For me, it's the players who let him down shockingly.

 

I agree with this but am going to add that the one area I think people can and do have legitimate grievance with Howe is that his approach to games like this is much the same as mine, on a philosophical level. To him, it's just another game. He understands that some of our fans care more about it than most games, but he doesn't really think it's that important in the overall scheme of his ambitions for himself and the club. He prioritises glory and success over the parochial elements - so yes, I can see him taking an approach such as you've laid out, 100%. But it's going to rub the fans up the wrong way because seemingly some of us would rather beat the mackems than progress in the cup, or whatever the tradeoff might have otherwise been.

[RobinRobin 14503]

3 hours ago, Rosco said:

he’ll offer more around the box like Calum Wilson used to do

[RobinRobin 14503]

PS Happy belated birthday Gem 

[toonotl 4681]

3 minutes ago, Rayvin said:

 

I agree with this but am going to add that the one area I think people can and do have legitimate grievance with Howe is that his approach to games like this is much the same as mine, on a philosophical level. To him, it's just another game. He understands that some of our fans care more about it than most games, but he doesn't really think it's that important in the overall scheme of his ambitions for himself and the club. He prioritises glory and success over the parochial elements - so yes, I can see him taking an approach such as you've laid out, 100%. But it's going to rub the fans up the wrong way because seemingly some of us would rather beat the mackems than progress in the cup, or whatever the tradeoff might have otherwise been.

 

Yeah, mate. Agreed. I had that inkling as I was typing out the above that perhaps my detachment (as a non-Geordie NUFC supporter (of 30 years but still not a Geordie)) means that I fail to fully appreciate the frustration at Howe's tactics and its contribution to the result. I can definitely appreciate that it should be win at all costs and not about holding something back because of match load and what have you when it comes to derbies. That's perfectly legitimate. It's how I treat all sporting events against the English.  

 

Football (and sport) is about emotion at the end of the day. Derbies and old rivalries are a big part of that. Hopefully next time, we set out the fucking thump them and leave nothing to chance.

[Ayatollah Hermione 17238]

9 hours ago, Renton said:

 

No I'm not. He's saying he fears it's the beginning of the end for Howe. I assume that's not just based on today's game result or performance, because if it is, that is even more embarrassing. The mackems were always favourites to win today in my mind, for the obvious reasons stated.

 Shut up, you tit. I’m literally saying, in the post, that we’ve been shite for ages and we have, man. Even as early as the back end of last season, our away form fell off a cliff. Eddie Howe is fantastic but sometimes, things get away from managers and I have a horrible feeling it’s starting to happen here. Everything above him has been a shitshow but he wouldn’t be the first manager to get a bullet to deflect blame from a shit executive structure. If Eddie Howe can simply not crack how to play multiple games in a week, he will not last as Newcastle United manager. A club that wants to be in Europe every season

[Ayatollah Hermione 17238]

Had on, I’ll make a hilarious AI image to go with my point, that might sway things 

[Holden McGroin 9903]

Aye. It would have been 0-0 if Woltey hadn’t scored. I’d have taken a point. It didn’t work but LOTS of times his tactics do work. You can’t always get it right.

 

He is one of the best managers we’ve ever had. We are in the CL and he has won us some silverware for the first time in my lifetime. Some of us need perspective if we are even questioning him at the moment.

 

PS Happy Birthday Gem.

[Gemmill 63200]

21 minutes ago, Ayatollah Hermione said:

 Shut up, you tit. I’m literally saying, in the post, that we’ve been shite for ages and we have, man. Even as early as the back end of last season, our away form fell off a cliff. Eddie Howe is fantastic but sometimes, things get away from managers and I have a horrible feeling it’s starting to happen here. Everything above him has been a shitshow but he wouldn’t be the first manager to get a bullet to deflect blame from a shit executive structure. If Eddie Howe can simply not crack how to play multiple games in a week, he will not last as Newcastle United manager. A club that wants to be in Europe every season

 

I don't think it's that he can't work out how to play 3 times a week, I think it's more that the squad a) isn't good enough, and b) where it is "good enough" we've got massive underperformance from key individuals.

 

The first team has been hugely weakened in the most important position on the pitch because of the departure of Isak (and long term injury to his direct replacement). Then there's the complete non-performance of the likes of Gordon and Joelinton, and more recently Tonali who looks totally off at the minute. Botman being injured means we're flogging Burn who looks like he's on the downslope of his career now unfortunately. We've been missing our first choice fullbacks most of the season. 

 

Barnes is the only winger we could say is having a good season, and even he's very hit and miss. Elanga frankly looks shit (although I don't think he is, and I think long term he'll come good but he's really testing the fucking patience at the minute). 

 

We're massively missing Trippier's leadership too, particularly in closing out games. 

 

There's loads I'd look to change before the manager, starting with our new DoF coming up with some exciting young Premier League ready continental talent. Hopefully that begins in January and we can kick on in the second half of the season. 

 

When you take our squad and compare it with other teams trying to play 3 hard games in a week AND maintain a top 4/5 position, we're miles behind them even playing at our best. When you add poor form in key positions into the mix, and consider the margins at this level, I still think it's incredible that we're holding it together as well as we are. 

[wykikitoon 28542]

On that with BDB any news on him? 

[Renton 27784]

1 hour ago, Ayatollah Hermione said:

 Shut up, you tit. I’m literally saying, in the post, that we’ve been shite for ages and we have, man. Even as early as the back end of last season, our away form fell off a cliff. Eddie Howe is fantastic but sometimes, things get away from managers and I have a horrible feeling it’s starting to happen here. Everything above him has been a shitshow but he wouldn’t be the first manager to get a bullet to deflect blame from a shit executive structure. If Eddie Howe can simply not crack how to play multiple games in a week, he will not last as Newcastle United manager. A club that wants to be in Europe every season

 

I know you weren't saying it was just based on yesterday, that was in reponse to someone else. I'm not sure even what your point is now though, is it that you personally think he's run out of rope or are you saying the owners have come to that decision? Who do you think can come in and improve things? Either way I think bringing up the possibility of his dismissal is ludicrous and fickle.

 

It's not Howe's fault thus summer's recruitment was completely ham strung. If things had gone to plan and we had got our chosen striker Ekitike, in a parallel universe we would have been league contenders. 

[thebrokendoll 14245]

6 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

I know you weren't saying it was just based on yesterday, that was in reponse to someone else. I'm not sure even what your point is now though, is it that you personally think he's run out of rope or are you saying the owners have come to that decision? Who do you think can come in and improve things? Either way I think bringing up the possibility of his dismissal is ludicrous and fickle.

 

It's not Howe's fault thus summer's recruitment was completely ham strung. If things had gone to plan and we had got our chosen striker Ekitike, in a parallel universe we would have been league contenders. 

 

not if the plan was to provide him service from gordon and elanga we wouldnt.

[Renton 27784]

4 minutes ago, thebrokendoll said:

 

not if the plan was to provide him service from gordon and elanga we wouldnt.

 

How not? At the end of the day it's about player synergy, they would be different players with Ekitike as the spear head imo, as was the plan. Wolt is a good player but he doesn't fit into this jig saw. To accommodate him, Howe will need to change the whole team which isn't easy. Maybe Wissa will make the difference.

[thebrokendoll 14245]

12 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

How not? At the end of the day it's about player synergy, they would be different players with Ekitike as the spear head imo, as was the plan. Wolt is a good player but he doesn't fit into this jig saw. To accommodate him, Howe will need to change the whole team which isn't easy. Maybe Wissa will make the difference.

 

they've got the best part of 30 PL appearances between them this season with a combined ONE assist.

nowt ive seen of either of them would suggest things would be different hsd they been providing for woltemade, the rat, or ekitike.

they've both been fucking shite.

[Renton 27784]

1 minute ago, thebrokendoll said:

 

they've got the best part of 30 PL appearances between them this season with a combined ONE assist.

nowt ive seen of either of them would suggest things would be different hsd they been providing for woltemade, the rat, or ekitike.

they've both been fucking shite.

 

The fact they've previously played really  well at our or other clubs suggests to me that it's the system that isn't working, not the players.

[thebrokendoll 14245]

11 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

The fact they've previously played really  well at our or other clubs suggests to me that it's the system that isn't working, not the players.

 

gordon got 5 assists last season, 10 the previous one. he's been shite on the whole since his rumoured move to the bindippers fell through 18 months ago.

at this point ive little interest in what elanga did at forest, only what he's doing here. he's been shite too.

[Gemmill 63200]

I blame this all on the dearth of liberty caps. 

[Renton 27784]

12 minutes ago, thebrokendoll said:

 

gordon got 5 assists last season, 10 the previous one. he's been shite on the whole since his rumoured move to the bindippers fell through 18 months ago.

at this point ive little interest in what elanga did at forest, only what he's doing here. he's been shite too.

 

Who were those assists for?

[thebrokendoll 14245]

3 minutes ago, Gemmill said:

I blame this all on the dearth of liberty caps. 

 

and on that note, sounded like most of our away support yesterday had been hitting the temazepam hard.

[SoHelpMeGod 263]

Just got to smash these smug inbred cunts at home to shut them up. No doubt they'd take it all out on their sister-wives.

[OTF 10613]

7 hours ago, toonotl said:

I might have strayed from the general consensus here but I don't fault Howe's tactics.

 

We could've beaten them one of umpteen different ways and I think that Howe chose to go with the way that conserved the most amount of energy. I can understand that rationale given the amount of important games we have coming up. I blame the players, entirely.

 

It was a tactic designed to nullify their attack and capitalize on their poor press and porous midfield to create chances in attack. We did the first and had ample opportunities to do the second and failed miserably every single time. I can completely concede that, having lost, losing that way looks weak and pathetic like we showed them respect, etc., but I actually think it was the opposite. Yes, we could've won it another way. Yes, in hindsight, we should've done it differently. But I think Howe reasoned, these are so shit that we can play the whole game in second gear, conserve energy for other matches, and hit them on the break since they're too naive to not press us with their dogshit press. He was right. For me, it's the players who let him down shockingly.

 

I agree with some of your post but this is terribly wrong. Howe really struggles to not select his strongest team, the team he selects he expects 100% commitment to victory regardless of the opposition. I don't think it was about conserving energy at all, he was trying something different away from home in an attempt to arrest poor form. The biggest reason it didn't work was Woltemade's ridiculous own goal. Other than than Ramsdale had to make one good save. Our lack of cohesion in attack was down to two key factors, the first being their intensity in closing down and their commitment to fouling to limit our ability to build momentum. They did an OK job of this, though they should have been down to 10 men when Brobby already on a yellow studded Miley.

 

Gordon I think actually had a reasonable game at times, he made a couple of runs that could have seen him in on goal but we didn't have the vision to find him. Elanga on the other hand was the most baffling selection, Murphy I think is probably just about as fast as Elanga when on the ball and crucially works well with the rest of our team. Barnes too should feel aggrieved to have not started.

[YorkshireExile 90]

Quote

I blame this all on the dearth of liberty caps. 

 

Bumper year down here in west yorkshire.

[wykikitoon 28542]

9 minutes ago, YorkshireExile said:

 

Bumper year down here in west yorkshire.

aye, I've seen loads!

[wykikitoon 28542]

39 minutes ago, Renton said:

 

Who were those assists for?

2 x Murphy

1 x Isak

1 x Joe

1 x Sandro

1 x OG

 

 

[Craig 12383]

9 hours ago, OTF said:

For me the tactical decision to sit back was a mistake.

 

This sums it up for me. We've lost our identity - our success came from the high press and not giving the opposition a moment to breathe until we were 2-3 goals to the good. 

 

The histrionics from the media and the Sunderland fans doesn't wash either - it was an awful game from both sides, divided only by a freak own goal. 

As for the 'photo op' - what goes around, comes around. We've got to take that one on the chin I'm afraid.