The Road To Amsterdam ArenA (UEFA Europa League 2013) - THE END

[David Kelly 1117]

Should spurs then have stuck with Harry after vastly improving them after Ramos, or was ditching him for AVB the right call.

Did they ditch him for AVB though? I would suggest that had the whole England thing never came up Redknapp would still be there. And has AVB driven them any further forward so far? Yes they had a bad spell when the England thing first came up but generally they are in almost exactly the same position that they were under Arry.

It's possible that there might be a manager out there who would be an upgrade to Pardew (who definitely has flaws) but it's probably even more likely that changing would disrupt us at this stage undoing a lot of good work that has gone on in the last few years.

[Howmanheyman 26946]

Was it Bob Moncur or Joe Harvey who once said 'we're daft enough to win the bloody thing' when nobody fancied us?

 

Think it was our Captain personally. I'd fucking LOVE to ram it down the necks of those describing us as England's third team in the Europa cup. (That's up one place since media darlings Liverpool failed to read the script).

 

Good post by Stevie, by the way.

[McFaul 35]

Should spurs then have stuck with Harry after vastly improving them after Ramos, or was ditching him for AVB the right call.

Harry gave them the most consistent seasons they've had since the 1960's. The Harry dismissal was personal in my view, and their results are no better now, they're about the same, but are a far duller team to watch. Who would you suggest could replace Pardew and do a better job?

[ewerk 26444]

Should spurs then have stuck with Harry after vastly improving them after Ramos, or was ditching him for AVB the right call.

 

They're one point better off now than this stage last season.

[Gemmill 34613]

I'm not saying I want Pardew sacked but if there is a better option out there then we should look to upgrade. Exactly the same principle with our players, if we can bring better in then let's do it.

 

You can't really apply that to the manager though. If you start making enquiries every time a better manager becomes available, it undermines the incumbent. Also, replacing the manager invariably results in an overhaul of the playing squad, which is costly/destabilising. Not to mention the direct costs of just replacing a manager in the first place.

 

There needs to be a much better reason than just a better candidate becoming available. Usually unacceptable performance on behalf of the incumbent, which you couldn't really level at Pardew.

[Tooj 17]

You can't really apply that to the manager though. If you start making enquiries every time a better manager becomes available, it undermines the incumbent. Also, replacing the manager invariably results in an overhaul of the playing squad, which is costly/destabilising. Not to mention the direct costs of just replacing a manager in the first place.

 

There needs to be a much better reason than just a better candidate becoming available. Usually unacceptable performance on behalf of the incumbent, which you couldn't really level at Pardew.

 

You could quite easily before the January transfer window closed.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

Harry gave them the most consistent seasons they've had since the 1960's. The Harry dismissal was personal in my view, and their results are no better now, they're about the same, but are a far duller team to watch. Who would you suggest could replace Pardew and do a better job?

 

Don't know enough about who would suit us best or who would come for what's on offer.

 

Loyalty is all well and good but is no guarantee of success. My worry is that Pardews negative traits will never get the best out of the players at his disposal and we will end of losing them.

 

A more positive manager could get this lot on fire. IMO.

[David Kelly 1117]

I wouldn't say his performance was unacceptable. Yes there were flaws but he was playing with a poor hand most of the time. He wasn't the reason why our squad wasn't strong enough to cope with the injuries that we've had.

It's a lot easier to make poor decisions when your options are so limited. Of course it's a lot easier to make good decisions now we have more options!

[David Kelly 1117]

Don't know enough about who would suit us best or who would come for what's on offer.

 

Loyalty is all well and good but is no guarantee of success. My worry is that Pardews negative traits will never get the best out of the players at his disposal and we will end of losing them.

 

A more positive manager could get this lot on fire. IMO.

I don't know how you can call for him to be replaced while admitting that you have no idea of who is an option or even what is required to be better than what we have. It comes across like wanting change for the sake of it and it's no wonder anyone with a brain is disagreeing. I'm sure when you're in the pub you can find some other fans that have no knowledge of football who will agree with you but when you're talking to people who've played and watched football all their lives you sound ridiculous tbh.

[McFaul 35]

I wouldn't say his performance was unacceptable. Yes there were flaws but he was playing with a poor hand most of the time. He wasn't the reason why our squad wasn't strong enough to cope with the injuries that we've had.

It's a lot easier to make poor decisions when your options are so limited. Of course it's a lot easier to make good decisions now we have more options!

Absolutely, and I won't say fair play to Ashley for putting it right, because I'm sure it was a business decision like everyone else. Pay £20m now and stay up, pay fuck all and lose £60m next season being in the Championship again.

 

The sad thing is if we'd have had the likes of Sissoko in August, who knows where we'd be now. Tottenham haven't been THAT good and could even come second! I doubt if we'd have had these players in August that Pards approval rating would've dipped below 98% now. He does fuck me off though, so negative at times, some of his subs are baffling as well as his loyalty to absolute dross. He's played Williamson at times when there were alternatives but, he's done a good job at Newcastle, we're in a much better position now than December 2010, as a club and as a squad.

[Happy Face 29]

A more positive manager could get this lot on fire. IMO.

 

Pardew has got this lot on fire tbf. Since he's had the squad we have now at his disposal we've beaten Villa, Chelsea, Southampton and Kharkiv.

 

We lost to a spurs team at their place who have only lost 2 in 23 games and to a Swansea team who have only been beaten at their place twice all season. Man U, Chelsea and Liverpool couldn't get a win there either.

[McFaul 35]

I'm not saying I want Pardew sacked but if there is a better option out there then we should look to upgrade. Exactly the same principle with our players, if we can bring better in then let's do it.

How do you gauge a better alternative though. Chelsea have been doing that for 10 years, at times they were without doubt in the best four teams in Europe, now though they've not stopped spending, finished 6th last season, and look completely shite, purely because of a trigger happy owner dictating that the next manager will be better. The Mourinho sacking was one thing, but the Ancelotti one just incredible too.

[Gemmill 34613]

 

You could quite easily before the January transfer window closed.

 

That was hardly the entire point of my post though.

[McFaul 35]

Pardew has got this lot on fire tbf. Since he's had the squad we have now at his disposal we've beaten Villa, Chelsea, Southampton and Kharkiv.

 

We lost to a spurs team at their place who have only lost 2 in 23 games and to a Swansea team who have only been beaten at their place twice all season. Man U, Chelsea and Liverpool couldn't get a win there either.

....and in both of them games, we more than matched both of them sides.

[David Kelly 1117]

Absolutely, and I won't say fair play to Ashley for putting it right, because I'm sure it was a business decision like everyone else. Pay £20m now and stay up, pay fuck all and lose £60m next season being in the Championship again.

 

The sad thing is if we'd have had the likes of Sissoko in August, who knows where we'd be now. Tottenham haven't been THAT good and could even come second! I doubt if we'd have had these players in August that Pards approval rating would've dipped below 98% now. He does fuck me off though, so negative at times, some of his subs are baffling as well as his loyalty to absolute dross. He's played Williamson at times when there were alternatives but, he's done a good job at Newcastle, we're in a much better position now than December 2010, as a club and as a squad.

I think all managers make decisions that supporters find baffling at times. You have to try to remember that they know a lot more about what's going on with players at a certain time than we do so what sometimes seems like a bizarre decision from the outside is exactly what we would all do given all the facts. Of course this doesn't explain the decision to sign or play Obertan!

[David Kelly 1117]

How do you gauge a better alternative though. Chelsea have been doing that for 10 years, at times they were without doubt in the best four teams in Europe, now though they've not stopped spending, finished 6th last season, and look completely shite, purely because of a trigger happy owner dictating that the next manager will be better. The Mourinho sacking was one thing, but the Ancelotti one just incredible too.

Chelsea have been the most successful team in the country during that time would be the counter argument. Of course the virtually unlimited transfer funds have made Abramovic's approach possible. A team that can't afford to keep spunking such amounts would almost certainly see very different results.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

I don't know how you can call for him to be replaced while admitting that you have no idea of who is an option or even what is required to be better than what we have. It comes across like wanting change for the sake of it and it's no wonder anyone with a brain is disagreeing. I'm sure when you're in the pub you can find some other fans that have no knowledge of football who will agree with you but when you're talking to people who've played and watched football all their lives you sound ridiculous tbh.

 

I want an upgrade for Shola. Just because I can't tell you who that should be, doesn't mean it's rediculous or we shouldn't do it.

 

Silly argument.

[Gemmill 34613]

 

I want an upgrade for Shola. Just because I can't tell you who that should be, doesn't mean it's rediculous or we shouldn't do it.

 

Silly argument.

 

It's not a silly argument. If you can't articulate what you want to see change and how that change could be effected, you should take it as an indication that it's time for you to stop talking.

 

Your problem is that you don't have that branch of the decision tree in your brain.

[Happy Face 29]

I want an upgrade for Shola.

 

We've consistently upgraded on Shola - Gouffran, Ba, Cisse, Carroll, Owen, Martins, Bellamy, Kluivert....

 

You cannit keep genius like his at bay though. He defeats all new-comers.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

 

We've consistently upgraded on Shola - Gouffran, Ba, Cisse, Carroll, Owen, Martins, Bellamy, Kluivert....

 

You cannit keep genius like his at bay though. He defeats all new-comers.

 

[David Kelly 1117]

I want an upgrade for Shola. Just because I can't tell you who that should be, doesn't mean it's rediculous or we shouldn't do it.

 

Silly argument.

I might not be able to tell you who the player is we should sign but I can say that we want someone more mobile, who can last 90 minutes, who can play off the shoulder, who can drop in deep, who can work the channels, who can bring others into play etc.

Mind you, I could no doubt name players all day who could do some or all of these things better than Shola and if you can't then frankly that just shows you up even more.

[Happy Face 29]

 

You laugh. I can honestly say I still love Shola more than any one of them....I think more than any major striker we've bought since Shola started?

 

Luque? Viduka?

[McFaul 35]

The issue I have with a new manager is this. Pardew irrespective of what ANYONE says, statistically is our best manager since SBR. He's also the first manager to get us in the top 5 since SBR. He's done it spending next to fuck all, given transfer outgoings. Could Mourinho have got us 5th? Possibly. Newcastle coming 5th for me, with the squad we had was massive overachievement, I'm not on about in terms of the size of the club, we're a MUCH bigger club than the likes of Everton and VIlla on so many levels that are hard to argue with. Where he let himself down was coming out and saying "we're on a different level to these clubs". His major problem is like many Londoners, he's tongue loose gets cocky and talks shit.

 

As for replacements, we're not going to poach any of the managers in the top 6, and whoever else there is around will be managing at an inferior club, or will be looking for work because they've failed in another position. Pardew has NOT failed. These posts will seem ridiculous if we win the Europa League, and it is definitely not the pipe dream it seems just writing it. We have a genuine chance if we can see this Russian side off.

[The Fish 9011]

I might not be able to tell you who the player is we should sign but I can say that we want someone more mobile, who can last 90 minutes, who can play off the shoulder, who can drop in deep, who can work the channels, who can bring others into play etc.

Mind you, I could no doubt name players all day who could do some or all of these things better than Shola and if you can't then frankly that just shows you up even more.

I think this sums up my issue with CT. He's like a child who just wants shiny, new and more.

[David Kelly 1117]

The issue I have with a new manager is this. Pardew irrespective of what ANYONE says, statistically is our best manager since SBR. He's also the first manager to get us in the top 5 since SBR. He's done it spending next to fuck all, given transfer outgoings. Could Mourinho have got us 5th? Possibly. Newcastle coming 5th for me, with the squad we had was massive overachievement, I'm not on about in terms of the size of the club, we're a MUCH bigger club than the likes of Everton and VIlla on so many levels that are hard to argue with. Where he let himself down was coming out and saying "we're on a different level to these clubs". His major problem is like many Londoners, he's tongue loose gets cocky and talks shit.

 

As for replacements, we're not going to poach any of the managers in the top 6, and whoever else there is around will be managing at an inferior club, or will be looking for work because they've failed in another position. Pardew has NOT failed. These posts will seem ridiculous if we win the Europa League, and it is definitely not the pipe dream it seems just writing it. We have a genuine chance if we can see this Russian side off.

I really think it's difficult to come up with a better manager who we have a chance of bringing in. Like you say, managers at top clubs won't leave them for us so who else would you go for? Martinez springs to mind as a possibility but really what has he ever done to make you think he's capable of doing more for us than Pardew? Mark Hughes is available but while did well with Blackburn and Wales, he was wank with Citeh and QPR. Has he shown anything that would suggest he could move us forward? Benitez will be available soon enough and he's won nearly as many trophies as a manager as we have as a club. But would you want him here?

Pardew is doing a good job and I'm far from convinced any manager could do much better with us despite the mistakes he's made. Hopefully there will come a time where as a club we're in a position to kick on further and at that time it's possible that Pardew won't have enough to make that move. But changing him now would only make it harder to get to that point in the first place.