scoobos 297 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 1 minute ago, Alex said: Yes, you’re right. We never revisit who should be in government via the medium of subsequent elections. So that was a brilliant way of illustrating your point Oh come on, its moment in time - its do you want this MP now to enact his manifesto. Once he's in an enacted it - say if it was to demolish a building - you can't vote it undone. You know what I mean man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobos 297 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 Just now, Renton said: Whatever, I've had years of trying to reason logically on these matters but it always falls on deaf ears. Can't you see the irony here? You're as staunch as a brexiteer . Reasoning logically means being open to others views and beliefs as well as trying to influence your own. I'm doing a truss here now and just flouncing cos its feral and getting a bit silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobos 297 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 Just now, Alex said: No, it isn’t 😂 So if you vote Labour in the next GE - then you can change your mind when they get in power? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobos 297 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 Ok my parting shot - lets follow the notion of it not being binding. If we held a referendum tommorrow on whether we should have a GE - and we all voted yes. Would we accept a month later that its not binding so they didnt have to do it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30757 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 2 minutes ago, scoobos said: Oh come on, its moment in time - its do you want this MP now to enact his manifesto. Once he's in an enacted it - say if it was to demolish a building - you can't vote it undone. You know what I mean man. No, that’s inaccurate. You elect the MP to represent you in Parliament, irrespective of whether or not their party is in power. And you could rebuild a building that had been demolished. So factually incorrect and a bad analogy 👍🏻 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 18016 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 2 minutes ago, scoobos said: Can't you see the irony here? You're as staunch as a brexiteer . Reasoning logically means being open to others views and beliefs as well as trying to influence your own. I'm doing a truss here now and just flouncing cos its feral and getting a bit silly. Okay mate, it was a brilliant example of democracy in action, and most people are delighted with the result. PR in action apparently. And it you disagree you're as staunch as a Brexiteer, whatever that means. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30757 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 2 minutes ago, scoobos said: So if you vote Labour in the next GE - then you can change your mind when they get in power? Was replying to a different post, hence the deletion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30757 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 (edited) 16 minutes ago, scoobos said: Now now.. I think this proves my side discussion with Rayvin perfectly tbh - and its not ridiculous. Saying that there shouldnt be a referendum because people elect governments to make these decisions is saying that a parliamentary democracy makes these high level decisions on the peoples behalf - which says its binding, given the government said they'd put it to MPs in parliament and enact it on a a vote. You can't have it both ways Is this not ambiguous ? In the end, the argument comes down to different visions for democracy in the United Kingdom. The conventional view is that ultimate political power lies with Parliament. The High Court came to its conclusion that the referendum was not legally binding guided by “basic constitutional principles of parliamentary sovereignty and representative parliamentary democracy”. In a parliamentary democracy, as barrister Rupert Myers bluntly puts it, “the people are not sovereign”. This is what I was replying to. It’s not ambiguous at all. Edited October 14, 2022 by Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobos 297 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 And fuck me, I was sidetracked by mini debates, but Truss has fucked herself surely - by admitting to not being conservative ? She mentions the corporation tax rise as being put in by a "Previous government" . what a tit. (easy holden) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 14873 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30757 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 10 minutes ago, scoobos said: Can't you see the irony here? You're as staunch as a brexiteer . Reasoning logically means being open to others views and beliefs as well as trying to influence your own. I'm doing a truss here now and just flouncing cos its feral and getting a bit silly. There’s no nuance to your argument though. It’s “it was one person, one vote - therefore it was democratic”. How is that being open to other views? It’s been done to absolute death on here but there are loads of arguments (which you may not agree with of course) that the vote, the campaign and the subsequent implementation were not democratic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6321 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 2 minutes ago, PaddockLad said: Yeah, she's absolute toast. I wonder how many letters Sir Graham Brady has received so far. I don't think it'll be long before he needs to make an announcement. And the difference this time is the MPs didn't want Truss to start with. I can't rule out the notion of Johnson putting his name in the hat for a leadership bid either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex 30757 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 3 minutes ago, scoobos said: And fuck me, I was sidetracked by mini debates, but Truss has fucked herself surely - by admitting to not being conservative ? She mentions the corporation tax rise as being put in by a "Previous government" . what a tit. (easy holden) They always use that though. It’s their get out when it’s pointed out how long they’ve been in power. I.e. it was a previous administration. It’s ridiculous but they’ve spent the last god knows how long lying their arses off 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6321 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wykikitoon 17005 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 Can she even survive the weekend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden McGroin 5044 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 If it wasn't so damaging to the country I'd love these popcorn moments to continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 14873 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 If the tories attempt another coronation by that 1922 gang of fuckin arseholes changing the rules we need to start stocking up on petrol and milk bottles. Burn the fuckin place down and start again 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 18016 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 3 minutes ago, Alex said: They always use that though. It’s their get out when it’s pointed out how long they’ve been in power. I.e. it was a previous administration. It’s ridiculous but they’ve spent the last god knows how long lying their arses off But if it was a previous administration where is the mandate for the current lot? I know taht's been pointed out loads, for example those Green Peace demonstrators, but it's true. General Election now please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Holden McGroin 5044 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 1 minute ago, PaddockLad said: If the tories attempt another coronation by that 1922 gang of fuckin arseholes changing the rules we need to start stocking up on petrol and milk bottles. Burn the fuckin place down and start again Im actually surprised there haven't been any demonstrations yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wykikitoon 17005 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 1 minute ago, Holden McGroin said: Im actually surprised there haven't been any demonstrations yet. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddockLad 14873 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 1 minute ago, Holden McGroin said: Im actually surprised there haven't been any demonstrations yet. Most are apathetic because most voted for these fuckers in 2019. They now know Brexit was a hoax for the think tanks and vested interests to get their people right there in the most powerful seats in government and at the moment if their triumph they’ve realised that these people are dangerous disingenuous lying bastards who don’t give a fuck about anything bar this bullshit ideology. Useful idiots abound in government and lots voted for it less than three years ago. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6321 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renton 18016 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 It's all Remainers' fault. They're everywhere. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmill 35362 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 1 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craig 6321 Posted October 14, 2022 Share Posted October 14, 2022 2 minutes ago, Renton said: It's all Remainers' fault. They're everywhere. Funny how he absolutely loved the Tories, and even talked of coalition when Johnson was elected and then won the GE. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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