Liverpool up for sale

[Guest Barrack Road]

Just Sunderland for me. Spurs are near them in my angst table though. Are you yank?

Edited May 12, 2010 by Barrack Road

[LeazesMag 0]

"I just want Liverpool to do well, whether it's Rafa there or someone else there I don't really mind. First and foremost Liverpool is Liverpool and I think we deserve to be top of the table every year.

 

That is why they're the most hated peoples in Europe, and the most hated club in England in a sentence.

 

how much of their support is still day trippers harking back to when they last won the league, or are they defecting to Man City, Chelsea etc

 

I know that where I live, there are still Liverpool wannabees who support them "because I always have". Joke.

[Guest Barrack Road]

"I just want Liverpool to do well, whether it's Rafa there or someone else there I don't really mind. First and foremost Liverpool is Liverpool and I think we deserve to be top of the table every year.

 

That is why they're the most hated peoples in Europe, and the most hated club in England in a sentence.

 

how much of their support is still day trippers harking back to when they last won the league, or are they defecting to Man City, Chelsea etc

 

I know that where I live, there are still Liverpool wannabees who support them "because I always have". Joke.

Despicable club with one of the poorest local fanbases in the Premiership.

[sniffer 0]

Just Sunderland for me. Spurs are near them in my angst table though. Are you yank?

 

No. I work for a British company in the States at the moment.

[sniffer 0]

Just Sunderland for me. Spurs are near them in my angst table though. Are you yank?

 

No. I work for a British company in the States at the moment.

[sniffer 0]

oops.

[Guest Barrack Road]

Just Sunderland for me. Spurs are near them in my angst table though. Are you yank?

 

No. I work for a British company in the States at the moment.

Like Shorlock Hermes.

[Park Life 70]

The State of Liverpool FC – An Idiots Guide

 

While "senior sources" at the club (Christan Purslow) try to facilitate a smear campaign against the manager, pretend everything is rosy at the club and briefs the press to headline the Rick Parry pay off on the day the club's financials are tactically released on election results day; here's what's really going on at Liverpool Football Club:

 

 

The figures released on Friday 8th May 2010 indicate that Liverpool FC is in net debt to the tune of £351m; an increase of £52m from last year’s figure.

 

A total of £233.996m is owed to RBS, in addition to an inter-company loan of £144.441m owed to “Kop Cayman”; a company owned by Gillett and Hicks based in the Cayman Island for tax reasons; a company that have loaned Liverpool FC £144.441m at an interest rate of 10%. This is the “own money” that Gillett and Hicks claim to have put into the club. In reality, they’re just charging the club 10% interest for lending that money through an offshore limited liability company that they aren’t even personally liable for – Liverpool FC are.

 

Liverpool FC are not paying the interest off on that £144.4m however. It is being charged as a “compound interest”, meaning the interest isn’t paid, but is instead “rolled up” to the grand total. For example, this year (if I’ve got this right):

 

£144.4m @ 10% interest = £14.44m payable this year.

 

Instead of paying that £14.44m, it is rolled onto the total making the outstanding debt owed to Kop Cayman £158.88m. The following year this is then charged at a further 10% interest:

 

£158.88m @ 10% interest = £15.88m payable next year.

 

Instead of paying that £15.88m, it is rolled onto the total making the outstanding debt owed to Kop Cayman £174.76m. The following year this is then charged at a further 10% interest:

 

£174.76m @ 10% interest = £17.76m payable next year.

 

Instead of paying that £17.76m, it is rolled onto the total making the outstanding debt owed to Kop Cayman £192.52m etc etc etc...

 

The debt soon spirals out of control, as you can see; and don’t forget, this only concerns the £144.4m owed to Gillett and Hick’s Cayman Islands company – it doesn’t concern the huge £234m owed to RBS.

[Guest Barrack Road]

So sad to see the demise of an once great club. So upsetting that their future is in jeopardy, and they might have a decade of desolation and hardship.

[Guest Barrack Road]

Reading that again it's much worse than even at a first reading. You've got £350m of debt in the worst economic downturn of our lifetime, these debts clearly are rising every year, they're out the Champions League, imo have little hope of getting back in, in the near future and the directors are saying they only want someone buying the ground who will pledge to build the ground.

 

I remember SJP being built up cost £110m, and FFS always goes on about the price of steel now saying it would cost over £300m plus to do what we did then, and they'll have to build a ground from scratch. That will cost £400m conservatively?

 

So anyone who would seriously want to buy the ground has to find £750m, and that is well before they consider what is needed on the playing side. My heartbleeds truly it does. They are utterly fucked, utterly.

[Park Life 70]

KPMG: Liverpool FC On The Verge Of Administration After Massive Rise In Debt

 

 

by Willie Gannon

 

 

 

The season that just keeps kicking gave Liverpool and its many fans the worst news imaginable after reports emerged that the club have sunk deeper into debt. Yesterday's financial report from Kop Holdings revealed a record loss of £54.9 million over the course of the last season, meaning that the club's total debt now stands at £472.5 million.

 

Accounts for the club's holding company for the year ending in July 2009 show rising interest payments of £40 million over the last year, wages breaking the £100 million range for the first time and a record loss of £54.9 million.

 

At the end of last season, after a record profit of £10 million, Liverpool's debt stood at £350m. Urgent negotiations with RBS and a refinancing of the loan reduced the deficit to £237 million, and the British Government-owned bank are now expected to come back and seek their money.

 

£233 million of the debt is owed to RBS and Wachovia, while another £144.4 million is owed to Hicks and Gillett's parent company, Kop Cayman.

 

At the end of last season KPMG had warned Kop Football Ltd. of the "material uncertainty" of their product. In other words, should Liverpool fail to bring the EPL trophy or the Champions League trophy home in the 2009/10, then the debt would increase substantially, as there would not be any monies available to pay off their debt.

 

With the current findings we can see that that is exactly what has happened to the once great club.

 

Liverpool have until the end of July to pay RBS and Wachovia their debt, or at the least a very large portion of the debt through player sales, which looks increasingly like the only way out of the mire. Already ahead of the curve, the EPL and UEFA summoned new Chairman Martin Broughton to their headquarters to discuss Liverpool's participation in their respective tournaments next year.

 

Their greatest fear is that the now Government-owned bank will have nowhere near the same level of sympathy for the club that they had last year. RBS restructured their core business after the EU allowed the company to redesign itself after the biggest taxpayer bail out in Europe during the financial crisis, some £100 billion. As a result of the restructuring RBS are expected to shed 20,000 from their world wide work force.

 

The EU’s top competition enforcer, Neelie Kroes, warned that if the bank failed to meet 2013 targets to restore healthy balance sheet then the EU would be forced to take action upon the bank.

 

The fact that the goalposts have now shifted for RBS means that the bank will almost definitely come looking for Liverpool to repay their debt. There is no sympathy for football clubs who spend beyond their means in the current climate, and Liverpool will do well to garner support from political parties because their debt is essentially taxpayer money.

 

Broughton has been quick to talk of the proposed £81 million four year sponsorship deal with Standard Charter and how it will help to reduce the debt. However, it would now seem that the level of sponsorship depends upon Liverpool's success during that period.

 

One theory on Broughton's role that has begun to surface is that his appointment to the role of Chairman is only window dressing to appease RBS, to make it look as if the club are actively looking to reduce their debts but are in actual fact treading water with no serious buyers on the horizon.

 

This would seem to go with the EPL's recent talks with Broughton about their commitment to meet every fixture next season.

 

"I expect to be chairman until we sell, so a matter of months,” Broughton said. “There’s no fixed price, there’s no agreed price—it’s a willing buyer, willing seller trade. We have willing sellers and there are willing buyers out there—that will determine the price," which all sounds a little bit desperate.

 

With the club now losing £110,000 a day it looks as if Broughton, RBS, and the UK Government will have much to discuss over the next two months.

 

To make the debt look more servicable Royal Bank of Scotland and Wachovia have forced Tom Hicks and George Gillett Jr. to move Liverpool’s borrowings away from them and on to Hicks' Cayman Islands-listed parent company, Kop Cayman.

 

Many fans rejoiced last year when Liverpool appeared to reduce their bank loan from £350 million to £290 million, but that turned out to be financial slight of hand and was only because their offshore parent company increased its loan to the club by £86.2 million to £144.4 million. That loan, on which Liverpool has to pay 10 percent interest, is likely to have increased over the last 12 months, explaining these new devastating figures.

 

Only this week Rafael Benitez eventually agreed to meet Martin Broughton about the Spaniard's future at the club. There has been a huge amount of speculation about his future role at the club, with stories emanating from Italy every day with new links to Juventus.

 

Benitez has played a political chess game with Hicks and Gillett in the corridors of power at Anfield, and he has become part of the fabric at the club with his people in virtually every position of power regarding the football side of the club.

 

He has called upon the owners to lavish him with money, or he will leave. He has told them not to sell Fernando Torres or Steven Gerrard, or he will leave. He has also called upon them to meet their many promises, or he will leave. Rafa knows the club lies on the edge of a financial precipice and has made demands that he knows sound impossible given the level of debt.

 

During his six years at the club he has spent some £210 million on 49 players, whilst bringing in some £125 million for 80 players.

 

With the news that Rafa is now saying he needs at least six new players to challenge for fourth, it would seem that Rafa has spent quite poorly over his time in charge. To say he needs six players for a decent team after six years in charge is nothing short of Benitez admitting wasting Liverpool's money.

 

The biggest rise, however, has come in the wages bracket at the club, where Benitez has almost doubled the club's wage bill since taking over.

 

2004- £66m

2005- £65m

2006- £68m

2007- £75m

2008- £79m

2009- £101m

Total- £454

For the second year running KPMG have given a brutal audit on all that is wrong with Liverpool FC, citing "material uncertainty" yet again.

 

"These conditions indicate the existence of a material uncertainty which may cast doubt on the parent company's ability to continue as a going concern," it said.

 

Liverpool are on the verge of becoming the next Leeds or Newcastle; the EPL think so, UEFA think so, and KPMG know so. The next two months are vital for the club.

 

Challenging for the title is gone, keeping Benitez at the club looks less and less likely every day, Fernando Torres has intimated that he wants to leave English football, and Steven Gerrard has just endured his worst ever season in a red shirt.

 

Liverpool will not earn Champions League money next season, they will not challenge for the league title, their best players could leave, and their manager could go to Italy.

 

Next year couldn't be any worse than this one, could it?

[khay 8]

The last bit will probably help though.

[Park Life 70]

Reading that again it's much worse than even at a first reading. You've got £350m of debt in the worst economic downturn of our lifetime, these debts clearly are rising every year, they're out the Champions League, imo have little hope of getting back in, in the near future and the directors are saying they only want someone buying the ground who will pledge to build the ground.

 

I remember SJP being built up cost £110m, and FFS always goes on about the price of steel now saying it would cost over £300m plus to do what we did then, and they'll have to build a ground from scratch. That will cost £400m conservatively?

 

So anyone who would seriously want to buy the ground has to find £750m, and that is well before they consider what is needed on the playing side. My heartbleeds truly it does. They are utterly fucked, utterly.

 

They're done it to clubs in Brazil as well apparently. Right pair of tinkers.

 

Not sure maybe Puds can clarify, but MA isn't charging us interest from S.J.Holdings I don't think.

[Rob W 0]

Reading that again it's much worse than even at a first reading. You've got £350m of debt in the worst economic downturn of our lifetime, these debts clearly are rising every year, they're out the Champions League, imo have little hope of getting back in, in the near future and the directors are saying they only want someone buying the ground who will pledge to build the ground.

 

I remember SJP being built up cost £110m, and FFS always goes on about the price of steel now saying it would cost over £300m plus to do what we did then, and they'll have to build a ground from scratch. That will cost £400m conservatively?

 

So anyone who would seriously want to buy the ground has to find £750m, and that is well before they consider what is needed on the playing side. My heartbleeds truly it does. They are utterly fucked, utterly.

 

I suspect that the greatest legacy of SJH and FFS will be building the ground when items were good - we can now look at 52000 a week when clubs like Everton, Liverpool etc are stuffed because they can't afford to build a new stadium

[peasepud 59]

Allegedly fat Ash isn't charging us interest no. Like I said the other week I'm waiting with interest to see SJ Holdings accounts.

[Asprilla 96]

I wonder if there's any difference between how fucked a team can be when they're owned by one person (us, Chelsea....Villa?) and when they're "owned" by a consortium (Liverpool, ManU etc).

[The Fish 9023]

You thinking Liverpool is a camel?

[Asprilla 96]

You thinking Liverpool is a camel?

In a way, I suppose it is.

[Andrew 4231]

just listening to hicks on SSN

 

hes sure they've done a great job, despite running massive debt hes quoting 600-800million for the club despite over 200mil of debt and the plans to build a new stadium which will also need paying for

 

mental

[Tom 13883]

Long term I think we are better off than them

[Kitman 2188]

Long term I think we are better off than them

 

Maybe they should get relegated too, apparently this is a very good thing to happen to a club.....

[sammynb 2929]

Long term I think we are better off than them

 

Maybe they should get relegated too, apparently this is a very good thing to happen to a club.....

 

FoK

[Tom 13883]

Long term I think we are better off than them

 

Maybe they should get relegated too, apparently this is a very good thing to happen to a club.....

aye thats exactly what i was saying

[Kitman 2188]

Long term I think we are better off than them

 

Maybe they should get relegated too, apparently this is a very good thing to happen to a club.....

 

FoK

 

[Park Life 70]

Could probs buy the whole city for that kind of money.