Europe --- In or Out

[Rayvin 4964]

Japan's warning should have set off some alarm bells, mind. 

 

I actually now believe that May still doesn't have a plan, and is trying to navigate this mess as she goes. Which could mean that we end up literally anywhere.

[ChezGiven 0]

Japan's warning should have set off some alarm bells, mind. 

 

I actually now believe that May still doesn't have a plan, and is trying to navigate this mess as she goes. Which could mean that we end up literally anywhere.

 

Without doubt. That's the beauty of empty rhetoric like 'brexit means brexit' as it means nothing as nothing is meant by it other than the carefully spun intentions of doing 'it'. Great politics from May as it conveyed the exact opposite of reality. 

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

Our output has remained unchanged but apparently losing 250k per month because of the increased cost of importing materials. Bau

[Dr Gloom 19825]

There was a mention on the news this morning about May not promising the points system that was supposedly one of the key promises of the Brexit campaign but how could they promise anything anyway when none of them were in a position to be able to deliver?

You can park the points based immigration system with the extra £300m a week for the NHS.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

We haven't even started to leave yet though

I know, it was just (another) one of glooms cherries when last months figures had it heading south.

 

Just trying to keep his pecker up.

[Dr Gloom 19825]

Without doubt. That's the beauty of empty rhetoric like 'brexit means brexit' as it means nothing as nothing is meant by it other than the carefully spun intentions of doing 'it'. Great politics from May as it conveyed the exact opposite of reality.

Yep, it's well played. Until we know what Brexit means Brexit actually means, everything is on hold. I don't think Brexit will eventually mean anything like what the Brexiters where campaigning for.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

Japan's warning should have set off some alarm bells, mind.

 

I actually now believe that May still doesn't have a plan, and is trying to navigate this mess as she goes. Which could mean that we end up literally anywhere.

I think you are being a bit unrealistic. The government was landed with a course of action that they didn't want. There was obviously going to be a process of taking some time to get everyone on board and THEN begin to put together a plan for the negotiations.

 

So far I think it's played out well.

 

The economy has avoided the predicted gloom along with any punishment budgets. It's also allowed time for willy waving to pass and calmer heads to prevail.

 

I'm not even sure how much of a "PLAN" is going to be divulged to the public ahead of a two year negotiation with the EU.

 

I don't really think Japan has added much that we didn't already know.

 

It's now upto May to keep the economy steady while delivering the best deal possible.

[Gemmill 34464]

I think you're being a bit unrealistic expecting anyone to read anything you have to say on this topic.

[TheGingerQuiff 2412]

Sick of hearing about willy waving from this cunt 

[Gemmill 34464]

The economy has managed to weather a storm of willy waving, which is one of the main determinants of economic strengh/weakness.

[Park Life 70]

Yep, it's well played. Until we know what Brexit means Brexit actually means, everything is on hold. I don't think Brexit will eventually mean anything like what the Brexiters where campaigning for.

It's almost like even the loony wing of the Tory party is under control from Ian Flemings castle in Switzerland.

[Dr Gloom 19825]

I think you're being a bit unrealistic expecting anyone to read anything you have to say on this topic.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

I'm pretty sure we'll get everything.

[Rayvin 4964]

I think you are being a bit unrealistic. The government was landed with a course of action that they didn't want. There was obviously going to be a process of taking some time to get everyone on board and THEN begin to put together a plan for the negotiations.

 

So far I think it's played out well.

 

The economy has avoided the predicted gloom along with any punishment budgets. It's also allowed time for willy waving to pass and calmer heads to prevail.

 

I'm not even sure how much of a "PLAN" is going to be divulged to the public ahead of a two year negotiation with the EU.

 

I don't really think Japan has added much that we didn't already know.

 

It's now upto May to keep the economy steady while delivering the best deal possible.

 

I'm not saying that they should have had one to begin with - just that the plan seems to be not to have a plan. And just to fudge through it depending on which way the wind blows before dressing up whatever we come out with as some massive victory.

 

I'd be amazed if anyone in the cabinet has a clear idea of what it is that we even want at this point.

 

I'm really struggling to watch this unfold, it's going to go on for fucking eons.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

I don't see that at all.

 

It's pretty clear that our goal is free access, control over immigration and laws, whilst also being able to have free trade agreements with whoever we want.

 

In the immediate aftermath of the vote the "willy waving" was very loud that we won't be getting all that. It's still there but a lot less audible.

 

What is going on now is a very sensible consultation process across the country involving business, universities, city services, etc to identify the very important nuances to the different sectors.

 

At the same time legal eagles are identifying how we untangle the decades of law making.

 

This is probably the most important process in the whole Brexit so that we go into negotiations with every possible angle and wiggle room covered, all geared to get as close to the best deal as possible.

 

I watched the full Brexit statement and debate today and overall it was pretty positive stuff from all sides.

 

As I said during the Brexit campaign, I just can't see a scenario where the Germans and others are going to get into tit for tat Tarrifs.

[Rayvin 4964]

This is going to go on for years though... decades probably to get all the legal stuff done. We might not even be alive to see the end of the process.

 

All for a protest vote against austerity...

 

I'm glad you're upbeat about it at least CT - it'd probably be even more depressing if the Brexiters were gloomy about our prospects.

 

Did anyone see the report with 25% of the country considering emigrating? I'm in that 25%, not that I have particularly high expectations of anywhere else. Why can't the world be run by the sane?

[Christmas Tree 3997]

This is going to go on for years though... decades probably to get all the legal stuff done. We might not even be alive to see the end of the process.

 

All for a protest vote against austerity...

 

I'm glad you're upbeat about it at least CT - it'd probably be even more depressing if the Brexiters were gloomy about our prospects.

 

Did anyone see the report with 25% of the country considering emigrating? I'm in that 25%, not that I have particularly high expectations of anywhere else. Why can't the world be run by the sane?

Ignoring all the tosh in this post.....

 

It will all be done and dusted by the next election.

[Rayvin 4964]

I do actually think they're looking at decades to rewrite all of the legislation, my friend...

[PaddockLad 14585]

It will all be done and dusted by the next election.

I think that's likely, the general terms will be put before the country in 2020, so it will be in essence a second referendum on whether to press the button on article 50. However, I think the terms are likely to be nothing like what most who voted leave would want (as reported today,there's not going to be a points based immigration policy, we used to have one and Terry as Home Sec dumped it in 2010) and in any case, the ones who shit themselves on the 24th June when they realised what they'd done won't be making the same mistake twice.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

I think that's likely, the general terms will be put before the country in 2020, so it will be in essence a second referendum on whether to press the button on article 50. However, I think the terms are likely to be nothing like what most who voted leave would want (as reported today,there's not going to be a points based immigration policy, we used to have one and Terry as Home Sec dumped it in 2010) and in any case, the ones who shit themselves on the 24th June when they realised what they'd done won't be making the same mistake twice.

Not sure where you get that from. Article 50 gets pressed in Jan 17 starting the two year clock ticking. All done and dusted Jan 19. Over a year before the next election. No second ref.

 

As for the points based system, just another bit of rhetoric from a leave campaign that was a campaign, not a government. I think the vast majority will be happy to be out of the EU and have "control" over the immigration system.

[Monkeys Fist 38767]

Not sure where you get that from. Article 50 gets pressed in Jan 17 starting the two year clock ticking. All done and dusted Jan 19. Over a year before the next election. No second ref.

 

As for the points based system, just another bit of rhetoric from a leave campaign that was a campaign, not a government. I think the vast majority will be happy to be out of the EU and have "control" over the immigration system.

4% isn't vast.

[Christmas Tree 3997]

4% isn't vast.

Vast majority of leavers.

[ewerk 26347]

And who has control?

[Christmas Tree 3997]

And who has control?

Government

[Park Life 70]

Not sure where you get that from. Article 50 gets pressed in Jan 17 starting the two year clock ticking. All done and dusted Jan 19. Over a year before the next election. No second ref.

 

As for the points based system, just another bit of rhetoric from a leave campaign that was a campaign, not a government. I think the vast majority will be happy to be out of the EU and have "control" over the immigration system.

I think we'll get control back on a number of things but the rhetoric/signals from Germany and France is hinting at a strong stance on 'free movement' for 'free access'. Think we'll have to compromise. One of the ideas is to take the 7 year break that Blair skipped ie against the A7.

Edited September 6, 2016 by Park Life